NFP?

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As traditional Catholics, who amongst you practices NFP?

I am of the mind that it is to be condemned along with all other methods of birth control.
 
I’ve been doing a lot of research on this lately because my wife and I just had our first child, and we’re in the middle of talking about NFP now.

I think it is birth control because its purpose is to do just that…control births - as in whether or not they happen. Same primary aim as the birth control pill or condoms - just a different mechanism of action.

I think it is another case of the ends justifying the means…the ends here being not to get pregnant.

Pope Pius XI, in Casti Connubii, #54, said that the “conjugal act is destined primarily by nature for the begetting of children…”

He goes on to say in #59 that “…in the use of the matrimonial right there are also secondary ends, such as mutual aid, the cultivating of mutual love and the quieting of concupisence which husband and wife are not forbidden to consider so long as they are subordinated to the primary end and so long as the intrinsic nature of the act is preserved.”

So to my mind, NFP subordinates the conjugal act’s primary purpose (as stated above in #54…that is, creation of children) to the secondary purposes (stated in #59). It brings the secondary aims of it to the forefront by endeavoring to avoid pregnancy.
 
My view is it is the seeking of pleasure for the self, while minumizing the ultimate purpose of it (sex).

Is it a sin ? Well, I can’t say a couple is sinning in using NFP, as long as their pastor is telling them it is an acceptable alternative to the pill or other man made contraceptives.

Is it moral ? IMO if a couple is using it " just until we can afford to have children". Then I’d say no, not a very good reason. Should have waited longer to get married.

If they have been informed by the womans doctor that childbirth could be risky for her, then yes, it’s moral to do so if the pastor has given his appproval. I don’t think God would be offended in such a case. (Just don’t try and justify abortion if…)
:twocents:
 
Is it a sin ? Well, I can’t say a couple is sinning in using NFP, as long as their pastor is telling them it is an alternative to the pill or other man made contraceptives.
I differ here - just because their priest is telling them it is OK to use doesn’t mean it is OK to use…I recently confessed something to a priest that the Church condemns as gravely sinful…and he told me “not to worry” about that!

From what I’m coming across in my researches, it seems that prayerful abstinence is the only way to go…and maybe not even that because one should be open to all of the children that the Lord would send to them.
 
I’ve been doing a lot of research on this lately because my wife and I just had our first child, and we’re in the middle of talking about NFP now.

I think it is birth control because its purpose is to do just that…control births - as in whether or not they happen. Same primary aim as the birth control pill or condoms - just a different mechanism of action.

I think it is another case of the ends justifying the means…the ends here being not to get pregnant.

Pope Pius XI, in Casti Connubii, #54, said that the “conjugal act is destined primarily by nature for the begetting of children…”

He goes on to say in #59 that “…in the use of the matrimonial right there are also secondary ends, such as mutual aid, the cultivating of mutual love and the quieting of concupisence which husband and wife are not forbidden to consider so long as they are subordinated to the primary end and so long as the intrinsic nature of the act is preserved.”

So to my mind, NFP subordinates the conjugal act’s primary purpose (as stated above in #54…that is, creation of children) to the secondary purposes (stated in #59). It brings the secondary aims of it to the forefront by endeavoring to avoid pregnancy.
Your view is solid as a rock 😉 But we have Catholic couples being taught it’s ok. 🤷
 
We posted at the same time. Anyhow, I agree completely.

I stopped going to Mass for 35 years. Got married outside the
Church. Now I’ve returned and we are living as brother and sister until the issue is resolved to the satisfaction of my local tribunal.

No communion or relations for me until then. The cost is too high to do otherwise.
 
Without NFP my husband and I would have had to abstain for the past 12 years and continue to do so indefinitely. I have congestive heart failure do to heart defects I was born with. After our first and only daughter I was advised (with second and third opinions) another pregnancy would be life threatening for me.

The Church allows for NFP to be used for serious reasons. I choose to follow the Church teachings.
 
Isn’t this real issue whether it is contraceptive? Birth control is the purpose of NFP. Birth control with God in control.

Another thread I saw argues the artificiality of it. That notion seems silly to me:shrug:
 
I guess I am confused by this point of you. Some of the most orthodox couples I know use NFP.
There is nothing wrong with the natural spacing of children. And sometimes, a couple thinks that they can support children, and things happen. Take my husband and I. He had a wonderful job with great pay and benefits. Inexplicably, he was cut to 3 days a week. We can barely afford to feed ourselves and my daughter. We had discussed starting our family now, but are abstaining until things get better.

So, you’re telling me that in that discernment, we are sinning? That’s nonsense! If a couple is abstaining for forever, that’s an issue. If a couple is using ABC, that’s an issue. If a couple knows that right now, the creation of a life is not good for that new life, they are right in choosing to abstain from marital relations. If the Lord decides that they are going to have children anyway, it will happen, even if the woman is not fertile at the time of marital relations.

This whole- NFP is no better than ABC stance makes no sense to me.
 
It is a sad thing to see Catholics disregarding the Supreme Teaching Authority of the Church.

The Beauty of our Catholic Faith is that through the Magisterium of the Church we can follow what the Church teaches as they faithfully transmit what God wants and permits.

So any discussion of ‘I think’ or ‘I feel’ when contrary to the the Teachings of our Faith are TOTALLY IRRELEVANT.

NFP is a Church approved practice when followed obediently by the Church.
 
I guess I am confused by this point of you. Some of the most orthodox couples I know use NFP.
There is nothing wrong with the natural spacing of children. And sometimes, a couple thinks that they can support children, and things happen. Take my husband and I. He had a wonderful job with great pay and benefits. Inexplicably, he was cut to 3 days a week. We can barely afford to feed ourselves and my daughter. We had discussed starting our family now, but are abstaining until things get better.

So, you’re telling me that in that discernment, we are sinning? That’s nonsense! If a couple is abstaining for forever, that’s an issue. If a couple is using ABC, that’s an issue. If a couple knows that right now, the creation of a life is not good for that new life, they are right in choosing to abstain from marital relations. If the Lord decides that they are going to have children anyway, it will happen, even if the woman is not fertile at the time of marital relations.

This whole- NFP is no better than ABC stance makes no sense to me.
Hold them horses gal ! I didn’t describe your situation, you did.
I just gave two simple examples to express my view on the moral side of it.

I would not dare to advise you or anyone on the matter, other than to tell you to talk to your priest and follow your heart.
I don’t want to judge anyone. I’m having a hard enough time with myself 😉

And as far as abstaining, that would be the route I’d go myself. Others can choose themselves. They know their situation, not me.
 
Isn’t this real issue whether it is contraceptive? Birth control is the purpose of NFP. Birth control with God in control.

Another thread I saw argues the artificiality of it. That notion seems silly to me:shrug:
If your argument is that it is acceptable because it does not have the abortifacient features of some birth control pills - then why not use condoms? They are not abortifacients…

Goal of condom usage = prevent pregnancy

Goal of NFP = prevent pregnancy
 
I guess I am confused by this point of you. Some of the most orthodox couples I know use NFP.
There is nothing wrong with the natural spacing of children. And sometimes, a couple thinks that they can support children, and things happen. Take my husband and I. He had a wonderful job with great pay and benefits. Inexplicably, he was cut to 3 days a week. We can barely afford to feed ourselves and my daughter. We had discussed starting our family now, but are abstaining until things get better.

So, you’re telling me that in that discernment, we are sinning? That’s nonsense! If a couple is abstaining for forever, that’s an issue. If a couple is using ABC, that’s an issue. If a couple knows that right now, the creation of a life is not good for that new life, they are right in choosing to abstain from marital relations. If the Lord decides that they are going to have children anyway, it will happen, even if the woman is not fertile at the time of marital relations.

This whole- NFP is no better than ABC stance makes no sense to me.
If you believe there is no moral issue with avoiding pregnancy in and of itself, then it becomes a question of the means employed in that avoidance…as you can plainly see from the paragraphs I quoted from Casti Connubii, the primary end of the conjugal act is procreation…the good of the spouses, mutual love, etc., are secondary aims…having intercourse during times of suspected infertility to avoid pregnancy SUBORDINATES procreation to those secondary aims. And a lot of effort goes into that avoidance - charts, temperatures, mucus measurement…
 
I have to say, I don’t see why any Catholic would object to the use of NFP. Is it a form of birth control? Yes. It is not, however, artificial birth control (contraception), and it is artificial birth control only which has been explicitly condemned by the Church.

The fact of the matter is, couples who practice NFP are making use of attributes of a woman’s biology to control births, thus they are availing themselves of completely natural, God-ordained means.

It was objected that couples using NFP are of the mindset that the ends justify the means, implying that the means are incompatible with Catholic faith. But in the case of NFP, the means are what they are by the will of God. Couples who use NFP are keeping the marital act open to life because they are not introducing a foreign, artificial obstruction into their union to prevent birth.
 
Without NFP my husband and I would have had to abstain for the past 12 years and continue to do so indefinitely. I have congestive heart failure do to heart defects I was born with. After our first and only daughter I was advised (with second and third opinions) another pregnancy would be life threatening for me.

The Church allows for NFP to be used for serious reasons. I choose to follow the Church teachings.
Your right. The Church does allow NFP for serious reasons, and it does sound as if you have a serious reason.

But today, people go around giving Seminars on the glories of NFP. They explain how wonderful it is and how much better their marriage is since they started practicing it, but what they fail to mention is that it is only permitted for serious reasons.

It would be like giving seminars on how wonderful it is to miss Mass on Sundays. What would we think if people started giving talks at Churches about how wonderful it is to miss mass on Sundays; how it has allowed the family to have more quality time together on Sunday mornings, and how close they have become as a result? Missing Mass and NFP are both allowed, but only for serious reasons.

The promoters of NFP tell how wonderful it is and how happy they are for practicing it, yet neglect to mention that it is a mortal sin if there is not a grave necessity.

I think there is something disordered about the promotion of NFP. Certainly it is permitted for serious reasons, just as missing Mass is, but should it really be promoted as a positive good, in such a way that makes people desire the good that supposedly results from it? It seems to me that there is something disordered about promoting something as a positive good that is an exception to the rule, and which is only allowed for a serious reason.
 
As traditional Catholics, who amongst you practices NFP?

I am of the mind that it is to be condemned along with all other methods of birth control.
I’m an Orthodox Christian and have been thinking about the connection between NFP and barrier forms of contraception recently. I am persuaded that the ancient Christian teaching is that marriage and sexuality are geared primarily for procreation and only secondarily for the union of the spouses. This plan of God is realized through the primary and secondary ends of the conjugal act applying to the act at all times and in the same order. Because of this, the conjugal act is *always *objectively ordered toward its primary and secondary ends, viz., procreation and the union of the couple. This is true regardless of whether subjective issues outside the couple’s control keep either procreation or union from occurring in the conjugal act. Since procreation is written into the nature of every conjugal act, any deliberate action/behavior taken by the couple to prevent conception from occurring could only be defined as an attempt to play God and remove what he, himself, established as part of the nature of conjugal union (an action otherwise known as contraception). This would make NFP equal to barrier methods of contraception. Under this belief, barrier methods of contraception would differ from NFP only in that they delay the removal of the act’s procreative nature a little longer. Using an analogy to abortion, this belief would make the difference between NFP and barrier methods equivalent to the difference between keeping an embryo from implanting itself in the womb and removing it from the womb once it’s there – since in both cases a conceived life must never be deliberately ended, both forms of removing the embryo are abortion. Likewise, since under the traditional conception of the nature of the conjugal act, the procreative aspect of the conjugal act always exists and must not be deliberately removed, both forms of removing this procreative potential (either by preventing it from occurring or removing its occurrence once there) would be equal violations of the teaching.

I believe that the Roman Catholic Church traditionally taught this belief of the primary and secondary ends of the conjugal act existing in their divinely established order in every conjugal act. However, with *Humane Vitae *and the acceptance of NFP, the connection between procreation and the conjugal act was subtly changed. The current Roman Catholic teaching is that a marital act is only objectively procreative if it naturally finds itself so. Under this new definition, keeping the conjugal act from ever being naturally procreative can be accepted in certain cases, whereas barrier methods of contraception, which remove the act’s natural procreativity, are still rejected. However, under the traditional belief that the primary and secondary ends of the conjugal act apply at all times, NFP couldn’t be accepted because it would entail deliberately removing the objective primary end of sexuality placed into the nature of the act by God, himself.

I’ve wanted to ask a traditional Roman Catholic who rejects NFP about these opinions. I’m glad that I saw your post. Do you think these observations are correct?

God bless,

Adam
 
I have to say, I don’t see why any Catholic would object to the use of NFP. Is it a form of birth control? Yes. It is not, however, artificial birth control (contraception), and it is artificial birth control only which has been explicitly condemned by the Church.

The fact of the matter is, couples who practice NFP are making use of attributes of a woman’s biology to control births, thus they are availing themselves of completely natural, God-ordained means.

It was objected that couples using NFP are of the mindset that the ends justify the means, implying that the means are incompatible with Catholic faith. But in the case of NFP, the means are what they are by the will of God. Couples who use NFP are keeping the marital act open to life because they are not introducing a foreign, artificial obstruction into their union to prevent birth.
How can one argue that the marriage act is open to life if it is exercised deliberately during those times when it is least likely for fertilization to result?

This is a little like tempting God if you ask me…we don’t want children right now, so we will deliberately have sex when, by our calculations, we are least likely to get pregnant…now, since God is omnipotent, if he wants us to have children then it will happen despite our designs…smacks a bit of Satan tempting Christ to turn stones to bread in the desert…of course he could have done it…but did he not say “It is written, you shall not tempt the Lord, your God.”

Again, in NFP the secondary aims are made to eclipse the primary.

Amongst the errors condemned by Pope Innocent IX: “9. The act of marriage for pleasure only is entirely free of all fault and venial defect.” - CONDEMNED. (taken from The Sources of Catholic Dogma" by Denzinger, 1957)
 
Hi Adam,

I think that you are 100% on target!!! 😃
I’m an Orthodox Christian and have been thinking about the connection between NFP and barrier forms of contraception recently. I am persuaded that the ancient Christian teaching is that marriage and sexuality are geared primarily for procreation and only secondarily for the union of the spouses. This plan of God is realized through the primary and secondary ends of the conjugal act applying to the act at all times and in the same order. Because of this, the conjugal act is *always *objectively ordered toward its primary and secondary ends, viz., procreation and the union of the couple. This is true regardless of whether subjective issues outside the couple’s control keep either procreation or union from occurring in the conjugal act. Since procreation is written into the nature of every conjugal act, any deliberate action/behavior taken by the couple to prevent conception from occurring could only be defined as an attempt to play God and remove what he, himself, established as part of the nature of conjugal union (an action otherwise known as contraception). This would make NFP equal to barrier methods of contraception. Under this belief, barrier methods of contraception would differ from NFP only in that they delay the removal of the act’s procreative nature a little longer. Using an analogy to abortion, this belief would make the difference between NFP and barrier methods equivalent to the difference between keeping an embryo from implanting itself in the womb and removing it from the womb once it’s there – since in both cases a conceived life must never be deliberately ended, both forms of removing the embryo are abortion. Likewise, since under the traditional conception of the nature of the conjugal act, the procreative aspect of the conjugal act always exists and must not be deliberately removed, both forms of removing this procreative potential (either by preventing it from occurring or removing its occurrence was there) would be equal violations of the teaching.

I believe that the Roman Catholic Church traditionally taught this belief of the primary and secondary ends of the conjugal act existing in their divinely established order in every conjugal act. However, with *Humane Vitae *and the acceptance of NFP, the connection between procreation and the conjugal act was subtly changed. The current Roman Catholic teaching is that a marital act is only objectively procreative if it naturally finds itself so. Under this new definition, keeping the conjugal act from ever being naturally procreative can be accepted in certain cases, whereas barrier methods of contraception, which remove the act’s natural procreativity, are still rejected. However, under the traditional belief that the primary and secondary ends of the conjugal act apply at all times, NFP couldn’t be accepted because it would entail deliberately removing the objective primary end of sexuality placed into the nature of the act by God, himself.

I’ve wanted to ask a traditional Roman Catholic who rejects NFP about these opinions. I’m glad that I saw your post. Do you think these observations are correct?

God bless,

Adam
 
I wrote the following several years ago when my wife and I used to teach NFP (I think the bulimia/contraception comparison came from Scott Hahn originally.)

We don’t teach any more. I could never get over the impression that the NFP industry teaches values-free NFP/ NFP as Catholic contraception and that the majority of Catholics we taught NFP often did not have “grave reasons.”
We teach there are 4 main reasons for having recourse to NFP.
1–Physical/ mental health—a pregnancy could kill you or so physically impair you as to prevent your fulfillment of your duties in your state in life—NOT because of a widening waste line or drooping skin! Or psychological health, i.e., mom would literally have a nervous breakdown if she became pregnant—not because she just couldn’t stand being home with the little kids all day without the personal fulfillment of her professional job.
2–Financial constraints—your child will starve if you have another. Wanting a bigger house or designer SUV just does not cut it!
3–work on the mission fields by one or both spouses that would preclude having children temporarily
4–active persecution or war—i.e., you or your child likely to die by coercive abortion, in concentration camp, in acts of war, etc.
Clearly we say these reasons must be SERIOUS, not trivial. Only the couple and their confessor can truly decide what truly constitutes grave reason.
We’ve had couples sit through my talk on this subject and literally say, "Gee, we thought we were being good Catholics just for deciding to use NFP. Now we realize we don’t even have grounds for recourse to NFP," then tell us a month or two later they’re pregnant.
NFP vs Contraception
Spacing children may be a desirable goal that does not violate God’s laws in certain serious situations such as those outlined above. But the means of achieving the goal differ. One is intrinsically evil (abortion, abortifacient contraception, barrier methods, sterilization) while one is morally neutral (Natural Family Planning.)
In one, an act is performed (sex) but its natural outcome is artificially foiled. In the other, no act is performed (simple abstinence during fertile times) so there IS no act, therefore the practice is morally neutral. It is then the intention of using NFP that constitutes its relative moral licitness or illicitness.
If NFP is used in a selfish manner, it too can be sinful. If it is used only in grave circumstances, it is not sinful.
The difference is real.
Dieting (decreasing caloric intake, the act of NOT eating) is a moral and responsible means of losing weight to maintain the body’s health.
Bulimia (the ACT of eating, them vomiting) is rightly called an eating DISORDER. An ACT is performed (eating in this case) and its natural outcome (nutrition) is foiled by expelling the food from the body.
Likewise contraception is a disorder. An ACT is performed (sex) and its natural outcome (procreation) is foiled by expelling the sperm or egg or both (abortifacient contraceptives) from the body.
Contraception is to NFP what Bulimia is to dieting. But just as dieting can be misused (anorexia) so too can NFP be misused in a sinful manner.
 
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