No Books are Actually Missing from the KJV

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There’s a question in Ask an Apologist about what n books are missing from the KJV. Father’s answer isn’t wrong, he answered the person’s intended question rather than the literal inquiry, but I just wanted to point out that the 1611 KJV did have the same books and passages as had always been included. It wasn’t until the late 19th century that an American publisher started putting out KJV’s with the deletions, according to The Book: a History of the Bible by DeHamel.

There’s a supposed facsimile of the 1611 for sale online that includes the Deuterocanonical books and later deleted passages, though I believe the actual 1st edition is completely lost and this is really a 1612 or 1613 copy that’s been reproduced. amazon.com/The-Holy-Bible-Edition-Version/dp/0840700415

I have been told that in Great Britain, the Crown still claims the copyright and it’s not lawful to publish a KJV without all the books. I have no idea if that’s true or not. Perhaps some of our British posters can enlighten me.
 
D?ch v? thám t? tu di?u tra hÃng gi?, hÃng nhái

T? lâu hÃng gi?, hÃng nhái luôn lÃ* nh?ng v?n d? nh?c nh?i d?i v?i b?t k? doanh nghi?p nÃo trong b?t k? linh v?c, ngÃnh ngh? s?n xu?t nÃ*o. Vì v?y d? dáp ?ng nhu c?u di?u tra d?m b?o quy?n l?i cho các doanh nghi?p chúng tôi xin cung c?p d?ch v? thám t? tu di?u tra hÃng gi?, hÃng nhái.



]Cung c?p thông tin, b?ng ch?ng ph?c v? ho?t d?ng t? t?ng dân s? trong dó bao g?m c? vi?c b?o v? quy?n s? h?u trà tu?, quy?n tác gi?, tác ph?m, quy?n s? h?u công nghi?p vÃ* chuy?n giao công ngh?.

]Phát hi?n, cung c?p thông tin v? hÃng gi?, hÃng nhái, hÃng kém ch?t lu?ng.

]B?o v?, áp t?i, h? t?ng các cá nhân co quan doÃn th?.

]Di?u tra tr?m c?p n?i b? trong gia dình, công ty. Tu v?n và áp d?ng các gi?i pháp c? th? cho khách hÃng nh?m ch? d?ng phòng ng?a phát hi?n, ngan ch?n s? th?t thoát, ti?t l?, dánh c?p thông tin và các yêu c?u khác.
dich vu tham tu,thám t? tu,tham tu tu, tham tu, thám t?
 
I know. I have this volume (KJV “apocrypha”) in my collection someplace. I don’t think I’d get the 1611 edition due to readability issues.

Most paople are surprised to learn that Protestant Bibles actually contained these books until the late 1700s/early 1800s when they were removed for reasons other than the dispute on their canonicity.
 
There’s a question in Ask an Apologist about what n books are missing from the KJV. Father’s answer isn’t wrong, he answered the person’s intended question rather than the literal inquiry, but I just wanted to point out that the 1611 KJV did have the same books and passages as had always been included. It wasn’t until the late 19th century that an American publisher started putting out KJV’s with the deletions, according to The Book: a History of the Bible by DeHamel.

There’s a supposed facsimile of the 1611 for sale online that includes the Deuterocanonical books and later deleted passages, though I believe the actual 1st edition is completely lost and this is really a 1612 or 1613 copy that’s been reproduced. amazon.com/The-Holy-Bible-Edition-Version/dp/0840700415

I have been told that in Great Britain, the Crown still claims the copyright and it’s not lawful to publish a KJV without all the books. I have no idea if that’s true or not. Perhaps some of our British posters can enlighten me.
This reminds me of a similar question I asked a while back…I was told that the orginal KJV had ALL 49 books of the OT…It wasn’t until later that they were taken out…That is what I was told here in the forum.
 
I own 2 KJV’s that have the Apocrypha. They are from Cambridge. (Very high quality). I actually use the one as my daily reader. To me, it is one of the most beautifully written translations there is. (And frankly, more orthodox than our own “NAB”). The fact that it has all the books, and then some, is just a HUGE plus!

Also, as a side note as I always get this when I talk to folks about it. Yes, I also own a number of other translations, including the DR Challoner. I’m always asked why I don’t read that over the KJV. Answer? It doesn’t read as well. The books are “named” differently, and the Psalms are not numbered as I am used to. 😃 (I do read through it on occasion though as I enjoy it as well).
 
I own 2 KJV’s that have the Apocrypha. They are from Cambridge. (Very high quality). I actually use the one as my daily reader. To me, it is one of the most beautifully written translations there is. (And frankly, more orthodox than our own “NAB”). The fact that it has all the books, and then some, is just a HUGE plus!

Also, as a side note as I always get this when I talk to folks about it. Yes, I also own a number of other translations, including the DR Challoner. I’m always asked why I don’t read that over the KJV. Answer? It doesn’t read as well. The books are “named” differently, and the Psalms are not numbered as I am used to. 😃 (I do read through it on occasion though as I enjoy it as well).
Where did you get it from?
 
I own 2 KJV’s that have the Apocrypha. They are from Cambridge. (Very high quality). I actually use the one as my daily reader. To me, it is one of the most beautifully written translations there is. (And frankly, more orthodox than our own “NAB”). The fact that it has all the books, and then some, is just a HUGE plus!
👍 I totally agree. I also use a KJV that has the Apocrypha. I always wondered if there were any other Catholics who did. I own a few other translations, too, but nothing else comes close to the KJV.
 
Where did you get it from?
My favorite is my KVJ Cambridge Cameo with Apocrypha - it can be found a number of places, but for reference, here is the calf skin edition on Amazon amazon.com/Cameo-Reference-Apocrypha-Black-Calfskin/dp/1107608074/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1358291296&sr=8-6&keywords=cambridge+cameo

They also make the New Cambridge Paragraph Bible with Apocrypha - For reference, on Amazon here amazon.com/Cambridge-Paragraph-Apocrypha-Personal-Calfskin/dp/052119881X/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1358291389&sr=8-4&keywords=new+cambridge+paragraph+bible

There are other options out there as well, but these are the ones I own. Christianbook.com also carries them; just need to search a bit - sometimes they have a better price.
 
Also, as a side note as I always get this when I talk to folks about it. Yes, I also own a number of other translations, including the DR Challoner. I’m always asked why I don’t read that over the KJV. Answer? It doesn’t read as well. The books are “named” differently, and the Psalms are not numbered as I am used to. 😃 (I do read through it on occasion though as I enjoy it as well).
I have several translations, too, and I read about the history of the KJV a few years ago and admire it quite a lot. If I’m trying to understand something, I really like reading different translations. When I write and include Scripture quotes, I often use them from several sources in one work, including the KJV.
 
There’s a question in Ask an Apologist about what n books are missing from the KJV. Father’s answer isn’t wrong, he answered the person’s intended question rather than the literal inquiry, but I just wanted to point out that the 1611 KJV did have the same books and passages as had always been included. It wasn’t until the late 19th century that an American publisher started putting out KJV’s with the deletions, according to The Book: a History of the Bible by DeHamel.

There’s a supposed facsimile of the 1611 for sale online that includes the Deuterocanonical books and later deleted passages, though I believe the actual 1st edition is completely lost and this is really a 1612 or 1613 copy that’s been reproduced. amazon.com/The-Holy-Bible-Edition-Version/dp/0840700415

I have been told that in Great Britain, the Crown still claims the copyright and it’s not lawful to publish a KJV without all the books. I have no idea if that’s true or not. Perhaps some of our British posters can enlighten me.
👍

If I might add, I think that the disappearance of the Apocrypha section from the KJV really began during the Puritan ascendancy of the 1640s. The Westminster Confession (1647) declared that “the books commonly called Apocrypha, not being of divine inspiration, are no part of the Canon of Scripture, and therefore are of no authority in the Church of God, nor to be any otherwise approved, or made use of, than other human writings.” As a result, the section was quietly dropped from editions published during the Commonwealth (1649-1660) and the Protectorate (1653–1659). By the time the monarchy was restored in 1660, Bibles used for reading in churches, as well as some private Bibles contained the section.

And yes, during 1826 the British and Foreign Bible Society actually made the resolution “that the funds of the Society be applied to the printing and circulation of the Canonical Books of Scripture, to the exclusion of those Books and parts of Books usually termed Apocryphal.”
 
👍

And yes, during 1826 the British and Foreign Bible Society actually made the resolution “that the funds of the Society be applied to the printing and circulation of the Canonical Books of Scripture, to the exclusion of those Books and parts of Books usually termed Apocryphal.”
Patrick…do you have a copy or link to this resolutiion from the BFBS?

I read somewhere also that they rescinded this resolution in 1964 or so…do you have a copy of that resolution as well?

If yes, can you provide me copies or links. Thanks.
 
Patrick…do you have a copy or link to this resolutiion from the BFBS?
I saw this circular letter from here. (Emphases mine)

British and Foreign Bible Society House,
London, February 10, 1826.​
We beg leave to inform you that important reasons have induced the Committee of the British and Foreign Bible society to adopt the subjoined Resolution:—
“That the funds of the Society be applied to the printing and circulation of the Canonical Books of Scripture, to the exclusion of those books, and parts of books, which are usually termed Apocryphal; and that all copies printed, either entirely or in part, at the expense of the Society; and whether such copies consist of the whole or of any one or more of such books, be invariably issued bound; no other books whatever being bound with them: and further, that all money grants to societies or individuals be made only in conformity with the principle of this regulation.”
While the Committee of the British and Foreign Bible Society have adopted this Regulation for their own guidance, nothing is further from their intention than to interfere, in the smallest degree, with the religious views and opinions, or with the rites and usages, of foreign churches; —they respect that liberty of conscience in others which they themselves so happily enjoy.
The Committee of the British and Foreign Bible Society embrace this opportunity of assuring all their continental brethren of their most unfeigned Christian regard, and of their anxious desire to contribute as liberally as possible to the Foreign Societies consistently with their present Resolution; and they shall deem it their privilege and happiness invariably to maintain that pleasing bond of harmony and union which has so long and so beneficially subsisted between the British and Foreign Bible Society and the kindred Institutions of the Continent.

We remain, respectfully,
Your obedient humble Servants,
(Signed) A. BRANDRAM,
Jos. HUGHES,
C.F.A. STEINKOPFF [Secretaries]
I read somewhere also that they rescinded this resolution in 1964 or so…do you have a copy of that resolution as well?
If yes, can you provide me copies or links. Thanks.
No, I couldn’t find that one right now. Based on what I’m reading though it was the American Bible Societies which rescinded its position in 1964, while the BFBS did so in 1966.
 
during 1826 the British and Foreign Bible Society actually made the resolution “that the funds of the Society be applied to the printing and circulation of the Canonical Books of Scripture, to the exclusion of those Books and parts of Books usually termed Apocryphal.”
Yes, my source says that the first printing of Bibles without the Deuterocanonical books was this one which was for missionary work only. It wasn’t until 1885, however, that copies of the KJV for public sale were printed by an American publisher minus the books and passages. He was able to do this because the US had finally gained full independence and the rules of the crown about how the KJV was to be published could be ignored.
 
Yes, my source says that the first printing of Bibles without the Deuterocanonical books was this one which was for missionary work only. It wasn’t until 1885, however, that copies of the KJV for public sale were printed by an American publisher minus the books and passages. He was able to do this because the US had finally gained full independence and the rules of the crown about how the KJV was to be published could be ignored.
Yeah, Americans mess things up big time, don’t they? :rolleyes: (No offense meant) BTW, I just read that the very first Bible printed in America (Robert Aitken’s Bible, 1781-2) is a KJV minus the Apocrypha section.

I do note that 1885 is the same year that the Revised Version came out (minus the Apocrypha, which would be published in 1895). The funny thing about it is, because of the Deuteros’ suspect status amongst many Protestants (especially those in the US), only three small companies from the New Testament Committee and a fourth from the Old Testament Committee revised the KJV Apocrypha, with no American involvement. The American version of the RV published in 1901 (the American Standard Version) did not have the Apocrypha.
 
Yeah, Americans mess things up big time, don’t they? :rolleyes: (No offense meant)
That’s okay, freedom is a messy business. It’s like someone codified chaos.

I thought that missionary society was British, though? I may be misremembering…
 
Between the front and back cover - yes, the KJV contained the books. However, in the part of that volume considered inspired Scripture, the KJV excluded the Deuterocanon. For a screenshot and links to more, see the article Did the 1611 King James Bible delete the Deuterocanon. 😉
I have no idea what this is a scan of, but there are no extant copies known of the first printing of the 1611 KJV which underwent revision before the 2nd edition. Perhaps that page was not changed, perhaps it was, I don’t know. I wonder if Amazon has a modern KJV and how it is laid out? Maybe they have a look inside the cover - possibly placement is traditional and something can be gleaned from that.

Regardless, all of the Canon is included.
 
I have no idea what this is a scan of, but there are no extant copies known of the first printing of the 1611 KJV which underwent revision before the 2nd edition. Perhaps that page was not changed, perhaps it was, I don’t know. I wonder if Amazon has a modern KJV and how it is laid out? Maybe they have a look inside the cover - possibly placement is traditional and something can be gleaned from that.

Regardless, all of the Canon is included.
There were actually two folio editions of the KJV which were both published in 1611, known respectively as the ‘He’ Bible and the ‘She’ Bible. The names derive from the way each of these editions render Ruth 3:15: one reads “he (Boaz) went into the city;” the other reads “she (Ruth) went into the city.” The difficulty lies in that the Hebrew has “he,” but the sense of the passage demands that Ruth rather than Boaz go into the city. It would seem that the ‘He’ Bible is the earlier version and that the translators deliberately changed the pronoun from “she” in the Bishops’ Bible. AFAIK, ‘He’ Bibles are rarer than ‘She’ Bibles: fewer than fifty copies versus fewer than 150.

Speaking of online versions, this one and this one are both ‘He’ Bibles, while this one is a ‘She’ Bible.

Actual publication dates are pretty much confusing though. From Gordon Campbell’s Bible: The Story of the King James Version:

The first edition of the KJV (the ‘He’ Bible) published by the king’s printer was a large folio, as was the second (the ‘She’ Bible). Both were published in 1611, but the second edition was relaunched in 1613, so the date on the title page of the second edition may be 1611, 1612, or 1613. The second edition is a page-for-page reprint of the first, so when the compositor reached Exodus 14:10, in which three lines are repeated in the first edition, the compositor of the second corrected the error and then executed some fancy footwork to ensure that the page ended at the same point. Something seems to have happened to Boel’s engraved title page (it may have been broken or lost, or he may have taken it to Spain with him), and a woodcut imitation of Boel’s engraving was used instead.
The printing of the first edition of the KJV seems to have started before the copy-editing was finished (hence, for example, the lack of paragraph markings after Acts 20), but the high quality of the finished product implies that printing had not been hurried. The same cannot be said for the second edition of 1611, which shows signs of being a rushed response to the brisk sales of the first edition. One striking feature is that some copies consist of a mixture of pages from the first and second editions. Another sign of haste is the number of prominent misprints. The dedication, for example, refers to ‘Chkist our Lord,’ and in some copies, ‘that eateth’ (Jeremiah 31:30) is printed as ‘ehat tateth’, an error that should have been noticed by any proof-reader, even one freshly returned from a pub lunch. The best-known error is the printing of ‘Judas’ instead of ‘Jesus’ in Matthew 26:36, a gaffe that has led to the ‘She Bible’ being referred to as the Judas Bible.
Some thirty readings from the second edition survive into modern KJV texts. Most are corrections of misprints, but at least one creates an error: the first edition read ‘waters of gall’ in Jeremiah 8:14, because the Hebrew form is plural; the second edition changed the text to ‘water of gall’, and this incorrect reading has yet to be expunged. There is a more problematical issue concerning the word ‘shew’ (the old form of ‘show’) in Hosea 6:5, in which the first edition reads ‘therefore have I shewed them by the Prophets’; the second edition reads ‘therefore have I hewed them by the Prophets’, which is the reading that survives in modern editions of the KJV. But was ‘shew’ an error? It was not a misprint, as the annotated Bishops’ Bible in the Bodleian shows, but rather a deliberate decision on the part of the translators. ‘Hew’ is an accurate translation of the Hebrew, but ‘shew’ may well reflect the reading of the Aramaic paraphrase known as the Jonathan Targum; if ‘shew’ is a mistake, it is one that reflects the judgement of the translators rather than the accuracy of the typesetters.
 
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