No Eastern Rite Church when travelling?

[SyroMalankara]

I fully agree you with this, Cavaradossi.

If one is a Coptic Catholic, you have to decide which of the two terms is the noun and which is the adjective. Are you a Catholic who happen to be Coptic or a Copt who happen to be Catholic? If the former, you will have to accept any other rite that one is not fully familiar with because the communion is the same. If the latter, would it be any surprise if yoru mother communion is not so welcoming?

Also, a Syriac church who welcomes a Catholic to communion sounds awfully suspicious to me. From what I know OO have even more closed communion than Catholics.

The Syriac Orthodox and Catholic Church have an intercommunion agreement in place. Within the OO, each Church has its own relationship with the Catholic Church. The Armenians and Syriacs are the closest, allowing for Communion among members, as well as Confession, Matrimony and Baptism.

Also, the line of questioning here - "Are you a Catholic who happen to be Coptic or a Copt who happen to be Catholic? " is misleading. One cannot be Catholic without belonging to one of the Churches. One could as a Latin the same, are you a Latin or a Catholic, which comes first? It would make as much, or as little sense.

 

[jimkhong]

Also, the line of questioning here - "Are you a Catholic who happen to be Coptic or a Copt who happen to be Catholic? " is misleading. One cannot be Catholic without belonging to one of the Churches. One could as a Latin the same, are you a Latin or a Catholic, which comes first? It would make as much, or as little sense.

There is a difference. One can be Coptic without being Catholic. Therefore, one can be a Copt, who could be Catholic or Orthodox as is expedient. Not a very good way to be, I agree but it is possible. Or one could be a Catholic, who is more at home in his/her Coptic rite but would be happy to take communion in another rite if necessary. On the other hand, unless you are referring to the Western Orthodox (extremely small minority), Latin inevitably mean Catholic.

I was not aware of the Syriac arrangement - thanks for the info. Is ther ea formal agrement as I understand that the one with the Armenian is local or informal. As far as I am aware, the Catholic Church has an intercommunion agreement only with the Assyrians. I believe that Copts are quite closed on inter-communion and do not have any agreement. I had a very strong negative reaction from one Copt on this forum when I mentioned I was offered communion by a Coptic priest at a Coptic Orthodox Qurbana. I believe the Coptic priest was not following his own law and I did not accept.

 

[Nils]

This is a good time to get to know what you joined. Modern Catholicism is about being under the Pope, no matter how you worship (like it or not). “Lex orandi lex credendi” is pretty far away from reality.

 

[twf]

This is a good time to get to know what you joined. Modern Catholicism is about being under the Pope, no matter how you worship (like it or not). “Lex orandi lex credendi” is pretty far away from reality.

This isn’t fair or helpful to the OP. He, like all Catholics, has a canonical RIGHT to the liturgy celebrated with reverence according to the rubrics. Was there actually abuse in this particular case? I have no idea as I was not there…but I as a Latin can certainly sympathize that in some modern parishes the state of the liturgy is such that it is painful for me as well. I have walked out of masses a couple times…once the priest processed in SANS VESTMENTS - I ran and found another parish.
Coptsolider - I hope you are able to find a more reverent liturgy in the area.

 

[malphono]

The entire idea of an Oriental being forced to endure something alien for the express purpose of satisfying some sort of “obligation” imposed by the dictates of Roman Law is maddening. Personally, I couldn’t care less about any so-called “obligation” and whereas I will voluntarily frequent the Latin Usus Antiquior (in whichever Rite might be available – I wish the Carmelite, Dominican, or the traditional Ambrosian were readily available, but never mind that), I haven’t voluntarily attended a Novus Ordo Mass in 35+ years. Whether it’s “valid” or not is immaterial to me: I go to pray, and if the atmosphere isn’t conducive to prayer, what’s the point? I never bought into “warm body syndrome” and at my age I’m certainly not going to start now. I have, however, voluntarily attended various Orthodox liturgies. If they will allow me to commune, so much the better, but even if they do not, I still have the opportunity to immerse myself in prayer.

Anyway … so much for my unsolicited :twocents:

 

[coptsoldier]

I Have not questioned the validity of the blessed sacrament at modern roman parishes. It is valid, as they are canonical under a canonical bishop, who is under a canonical patriarch. Also stating that eastern catholics canot commune in orthodox jurisdictions is plain and simply wrong as there are agreements between rome and the syrian churches to allow for this. As for the copts, its an individual bishop decision. I am meeting with sayedna in 1 month to discuss this matter.

Also stating that latin means catholic is wrong. Almost all historical protestant churches are schismatic latin rite. Also every sede vacante group is also schismatic. The situation with the orthodox east is very different then, say, the lutherans, as the orthodox are in formal schism, not heresy.

I have just discovered the ukrainians pray a mass monthly up where I visit, so I will be timing my visits with that. I will keep trying to find a parish that doesnt rob me of my peace, but if I cant I will find the least offensive, do a metania, pray, commune, and go home.