No Habits?

[albertziggy]

It is a special vocation, and one that is open only to the seculars. I would embrace this vocation rather than worrying about what titles people use to address one another in a fraternity meeting.

Thank you for your kind words. Rest assured that the use of titles is not a pre-occupation of mine.

Peace also to you.

In Christ,
albertziggy

 

[JMJ_coder]

Here is my question. Is it that we don’t hear about it or are there no such movements within the Carmelite family? I have only known two Carmelite obediences: Primitive and Discalced.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

Currently, there is a group of Carmelites in Wyoming who are aiming at just such a thing. They are directly accountable to the Bishop (association of diocesan rite?). I’m not sure what there official name is, but there letters are M.Carm.

And, they make good coffee!

www.carmelitemonks.org/

 

[Ocarm]

Something that has always puzzled me and maybe some of our Carmelite brothers can clarity for me. I’m noticiing an increase the number of Franciscan communities that are coming from the three branches of the Friars Minor or being founded with the same rule. The common thread among them is the search for greater austerity, get away from parishes, increase prayer life and greater poverty. Then there are specific ministries too.

Here is my question. Is it that we don’t hear about it or are there no such movements within the Carmelite family? I have only known two Carmelite obediences: Primitive and Discalced.

A third, and currently the largest grouping, is the Syro-Malabar rite Carmelites of Mary Immaculate (founded in Kerala, India in 1831) and their female counterparts the Congregation of the Mother of Carmel. Between them they have around 10,000 members, which would make them bigger than either the Observant or Discalced orders (if first and second orders were combined).

And that is kind of the point: although Carmelite spirituality is well known within the church, and has a large secular following because of scapular devotion, the Carmelite family is smaller than the Salesian, Ignatian or Dominican families, and much smaller than your own Franciscan family (I’m not including secular institutes here).

There is thus less scope for diversity, and fewer divisions and sub-divisions. Having said that, there are a number of smaller congregations within the family that follow the Carmelite rule, often in particular apostolates. I recently attended the solemn profession of Sr Camilla in Kensington, London, who is the first member of of the Community of Our Lady of Walsingham to reach final vows. They live a simple but not primitive version of the rule and focus on helping people to discern God’s plans for them. They have a number of people in formation and others interested in applying. There are other major congregations around the world who are longer established; and we have third order regular institutes as well. The emphasis upon prayer and the vows within these different institutes varies considerably. And some independent Carmels have adopted a primitive observance, including one here in England of which I’m aware.

The issue of getting back to our roots continues to be discussed and worked at. One consequence of this has been (in Western Europe at least) a marginal increase in the number of non-ordained brothers in solemn vows in my own order, sometimes holding senior positions within the provinces. I attended an international meeting of O.Carm students in Israel last summer, and heard that similar processes were occurring elsewhere.

It’s clear that we are living in a time of change, and I see that as very positive and very challenging. Reform and redefining of aims and apostolates may well be around the corner, and new ways to live the charism might be the result. But I won’t engage in any more guesswork, nor should these scribbles be interpreted as anything more than a few minor observations on my part, not a statement of the policy or intent of the order, and certainly not of the broader family - I’m not a spokesman for either.

One way or another, our charism is doing well in many parts of the world, and both the O.Carm and OCD continue to attract vocations even in the western world, so we’re still living Carmel across the globe. I’m excited about the future of the order, but will have to wait and see what it brings. Mother Teresa used to say, ‘The future is not yet here, and so I only have today to love and serve God.’ And today is enough to keep us busy, I think.

 

[JReducation]

A third, and currently the largest grouping, is the Syro-Malabar rite Carmelites of Mary Immaculate (founded in Kerala, India in 1831) and their female counterparts the Congregation of the Mother of Carmel. Between them they have around 10,000 members, which would make them bigger than either the Observant or Discalced orders.

There is thus less scope for diversity, and fewer divisions and sub-divisions. Having said that, there are a number of smaller congregations within the family that follow the Carmelite rule, often in particular apostolates. I recently attended the solemn profession of Sr Camilla in Kensington, London, who is the first member of of the Community of Our Lady of Walsingham to reach final vows. They live a simple but not primitive version of the rule and focus on helping people to discern God’s plans for them. They have a number of people in formation and others interested in applying. There are other major congregations around the world who are longer established; and we have third order regular institutes as well. The emphasis upon prayer and the vows within these different institutes varies considerably. And some independent Carmels have adopted a primitive observance, including one here in England of which I’m aware.

The issue of getting back to our roots continues to be discussed and worked at. One consequence of this has been (in Western Europe at least) a marginal increase in the number of non-ordained brothers in solemn vows in my own order, sometimes holding senior positions within the provinces. I attended an international meeting of O.Carm students in Israel last summer, and heard that similar processes were occurring elsewhere.

It’s clear that we are living in a time of change, and I see that as very positive and very challenging. Reform and redefining of aims and apostolates may well be around the corner, and new ways to live the charism might be the result. But I won’t engage in any more guesswork, nor should these scribbles be interpreted as anything more than a few minor observations on my part, not a statement of the policy or intent of the order, and certainly not of the broader family - I’m not a spokesman for either.

One way or another, our charism is doing well in many parts of the world, and both the O.Carm and OCD continue to attract vocations even in the western world, so we’re still living Carmel across the globe. I’m excited about the future of the order, but will have to wait and see what it brings. Mother Teresa used to say, ‘The future is not yet here, and so I only have today to love and serve God.’ And today is enough to keep us busy, I think.

Brother,

That was really interesting. I had never heard of the Syro-Malabar Carmelties. That’s cool. I have known many congregations of Carmelite Sisters. I worked with two of them. I worked with the Carmelite Sisters of Charity founded by St. Joaquina of Vedruna. They are absolutely awesome. I loved evrey minute of it. In fact, the Carmelites stole them from the Franciscans. They were founded by a Capuchin Franciscan Friar in Vedruna Spain. They even wore the habit of the Franciscans. When they went to the local bishop for canonical approval, he was a Carmelite. He changed their spiritual orientation, keeping their pastoral orientation. They took off the chord and put on the belt, becoming the Carmelites of Charity instead of the Capuchinesses of Charity. It’s facinating how the Holy Spirit works.

When I was in the missions the Carmelite Sisters from Valladolid Spain ran our mission school. They are a very Teresian group. Their life of prayer, their charity toward the poor, their discipline and yet joyfulness was contageous. I enjoyed working along side them.

I have worked alongside the OCDs in the USA. I enjoy them very much and have some good friends among them. I have some reservations about one of the O’Carm provinces in the USA… But I have some reservations about some Franciscan provinces in the USA too, so don’t be offended.

I believe that the older orders in the USA were severely damaged by the ordination of too many men. Eventually they evolved into diocesan priests in habits. The parish became their first priority. The laity became their fraternity. Work became their prayer and finally, poverty was replaced by som vague form of detachment. Own everything you can get your hands on, just don’t call it yours, that kind of thinking.

This is why their is a powerful reform movement of Franciscans around the world. The three thinjgs that are being addressed are: reducing the number of priests, staying out of parishes, serving only those below the middle class. This is driving middle class Catholics in the USA crazy. They don’t understand that the old priories and friaries were meant to be schools of prayer and holiness, not rectories for parishes. They don’t understand that the priesthood is accidental to the religious life. As I always say to people, “If I get another priest, you can borrow him when he’s not busy.” I’m the local superior so people often ask, “Father, when are we getting another priest.” We have only one priest in this house. There are seven of us. I’m not a priest. But our one priest teaches full-time at the university. He’s a Doctor of Bio-Ethics and a Doctor of Moral Theology and has not interest in anything related to a parish. He like another Fr. Benedict G, an ordained Franciscan who has never been inside a parish, except to say a mass. These guys baffle most people.

Thanks for sharing all that information, Brother. I loved it. Can you share more. Can you tell that I love the Carmelties? Now you see why I did my STD dissertation on Teresa and Francis? I can understand why she and Peter of Alcantara were such close friends. Carmelites and Franciscans are flip sides of the same coin.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[popsep]

When the habits came off IN ORDER’S, we know longer see GOD in the world. Now we just see half naked people walking around. GOD is not seen in the world and SIN has won. LET GOD BE SEEN IN THE WORLD AGAIN,WEAR THE HABIT AND BE PROUD TO BE A RELIGIOUS FOR GOD