No, I don't bow to the Precious Blood

[Spiller]

**YOU **ARE NOT GOD!!!

When I have Him in my hands inside of a ciborium, I bow/genuflect/kneel to NO ONE.

Even when reposing the Blessed Scrament in the tabernacle, I would NEVER bow or genuflect while holding a consecrated host in a ciborium or a pyx. Not ever!

 

[Spiller]

CAF was clearly the wrong place to ask this question…

 

[LilyM]

One would NEVER bow while holding a ciborium containing the Blessed Sacrament.

What I meant (in case it wasn’t crystal clear) is that if you (holding nothing) pass someone and THEY have a ciborium full of consecrated Hosts, and then pass a Tabernacle with consecrated Hosts reserved within, you’d bow or genuflect to both. Why not? He is present in both places, is He not, and should we not acknowledge EVERY place in which He resides in the Blessed Sacrament?

You still haven’t said, though, whether, as you must if you’re logically consistent, you’d bow to everyone who receives before you.

 

[Spiller]

Well, you probably couldn’t do so without spilling em, so no.

But if you pass someone with a full ciborium of consecrated Hosts AND a tabernacle with consecrated Hosts inside then absolutely genuflect to both.

That would depend. I certainly would not if I was an EMHC during the Mass or if I was in some sort of procession:

GIRM 274…If, however, the tabernacle with the Most Blessed Sacrament is present in the sanctuary, the priest, the deacon, and the other ministers genuflect when they approach the altar and when they depart from it, but not during the celebration of Mass itself. Otherwise all who pass before the Most Blessed Sacrament genuflect, unless they are moving in procession.

 

[Spiller]

What I meant (in case it wasn’t crystal clear) is that if you (holding nothing) pass someone and THEY have a ciborium full of consecrated Hosts, and then pass a Tabernacle with consecrated Hosts reserved within, you’d bow or genuflect to both. Why not? He is present in both places, is He not, and should we not acknowledge EVERY place in which He resides in the Blessed Sacrament?

You still haven’t said, though, whether, as you must if you’re logically consistent, you’d bow to everyone who receives before you.

Absolutely not, for the Eucharist is inside of me AS WELL, whether or not I am holding Him in my hands.

 

[Hunho]

I’ve spent quite a while trying to figure out a way to say something that seemed to me to be obvious - but by the various posts in this thread seems to be anything but obvious - and I finally had to fall back on this: “Have this mind among yourselves, which was in Christ Jesus,who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men. And being found in human form he humbled himself and became obedient unto death, even death on a cross. Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name which is above every name, that at the name of Jesus every knee shall bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.” (Philippians 2:5-11)
By the way, to be completely clear, I bow.

 

[Ghoti]

Absolutely not, for the Eucharist is inside of me AS WELL, whether or not I am holding Him in my hands.

So how long before this wears off?

 

[LilyM]

Absolutely not, for the Eucharist is inside of me AS WELL, whether or not I am holding Him in my hands.

No, because you’re still waiting in line for Communion and you haven’t received Him yet, but other people have, those who went before you in line. Of course in such a situation He isn’t inside you yet. Otherwise there’d be no need for any of us to even receive - not ever, not even once - because just by being present at Mass He’d already be in all of us. But He IS inside those who have already received, no? So you should then bow to people who have received when you haven’t, by your logic.

 

[Spiller]

No, because you’re still waiting in line for Communion and you haven’t received Him yet, but other people have, those who went before you in line. Of course in such a situation He isn’t inside you yet. Otherwise there’d be no need for any of us to even receive - not ever, not even once - because just by being present at Mass He’d already be in all of us. But He IS inside those who have already received, no? So you should then bow to people who have received when you haven’t, by your logic.

Pardon me. I read “before” as “from.” My mistake.

I still wouldn’t as I am in procession to receive Holy Communion:

GIRM 274…If, however, the tabernacle with the Most Blessed Sacrament is present in the sanctuary, the priest, the deacon, and the other ministers genuflect when they approach the altar and when they depart from it, but not during the celebration of Mass itself. Otherwise all who pass before the Most Blessed Sacrament genuflect, unless they are moving in procession.

 

[Spiller]

So how long before this wears off?

Ask your priest.

 

[Spiller]

***Proper Posture After Communion

And More on Bowing**

ROME, OCT. 25, 2005 (Zenit.org).- Answered by Father Edward McNamara, professor of liturgy at the Regina Apostolorum Pontifical University.

"Another case is the second part of the question regarding the sign of reverence toward the Blood of Christ even though one has already received Communion under the species of bread.

This second sign of reverence is required by liturgical norms for all the faithful and likewise for concelebrating priests who genuflect before partaking of the chalice even though they have already consumed the Host."*

I sure wish he would provide those “liturgical norms” because I would be happy to follow them.

 

[LilyM]

Pardon me. I read “before” as “from.” My mistake.

I still wouldn’t as I am in procession to receive Holy Communion:

GIRM 274…If, however, the tabernacle with the Most Blessed Sacrament is present in the sanctuary, the priest, the deacon, and the other ministers genuflect when they approach the altar and when they depart from it, but not during the celebration of Mass itself. Otherwise all who pass before the Most Blessed Sacrament genuflect, unless they are moving in procession.

How about, as an earlier poster said, if you refrain from receiving for whatever reason - you must know that Christ is still present in those who receive at least at the end of Mass, and not in yourself at that time. People ain’t moving in no procession then, so surely there’s no excuse for you not to bow to everyone who you know has received. Certainly isnt any GIRM rule against it. So I presume you’re genuflecting in front of them then?

 

[LilyM]

***Proper Posture After Communion

And More on Bowing***

ROME, OCT. 25, 2005 (Zenit.org).- Answered by Father Edward McNamara, professor of liturgy at the Regina Apostolorum Pontifical University.

"Another case is the second part of the question regarding the sign of reverence toward the Blood of Christ even though one has already received Communion under the species of bread.

This second sign of reverence is required by liturgical norms for all the faithful and likewise for concelebrating priests who genuflect before partaking of the chalice even though they have already consumed the Host."

I sure wish he would provide those “liturgical norms” because I would be happy to follow them.

The second sign, the liturgical norm, IS that all the faithful and concelebrating priests either bow or genuflect … ‘before partaking of the chalice EVEN THOUGH they have already consumed the Host’ - and presumably even in passing the chalice if they don’t receive. Do you not believe that it exists? Do you think the good father is lying or mistaken?

 

[Spiller]

The second sign, the liturgical norm, IS that all the faithful and concelebrating priests either bow or genuflect … ‘before partaking of the chalice EVEN THOUGH they have already consumed the Host’ - and presumably even in passing the chalice if they don’t receive. Do you not believe that it exists? Do you think the good father is lying or mistaken?

What document?

 

[LilyM]

What document?

GIRM, US Norm no. 160:

“When receiving Holy Communion, the communicant bows his or her head before the Sacrament as a gesture of reverence and receives the Body of the Lord from the minister. The consecrated host may be received either on the tongue or in the hand, at the discretion of each communicant. When Holy Communion is received under both kinds, the sign of reverence is also made before receiving the Precious Blood…”

In other words after you receive the Host, you must also make a second separate gesture of reverence for the Precious Blood as you receive it, regardless of the fact that you have previously received the Host. Do you not agree that in such a case you would have to make a second separate reverence to the Chalice? Regardless of the fact that by receiving the Host you have already become a ‘living Tabernacle’ or whatever buzzphrase you want to use?

Now surely the Precious Blood is worthy of exactly the same reverence whether you choose to receive it or not. The chalice is the same Holy Eucharist and equally worthy of respect whether you receive it or not, do you not agree? That being the case, it logically follows that even IF you pass by the chalice and don’t receive from it, you must also make a bow of the head towards it.

 

[Spiller]

GIRM, US Norm no. 160:

“When receiving Holy Communion, the communicant bows his or her head before the Sacrament as a gesture of reverence and receives the Body of the Lord from the minister. The consecrated host may be received either on the tongue or in the hand, at the discretion of each communicant. When Holy Communion is received under both kinds, the sign of reverence is also made before receiving the Precious Blood…”

In other words after you receive the Host, you must also make a second separate gesture of reverence for the Precious Blood as you receive it, regardless of the fact that you have previously received the Host. Do you not agree that in such a case you would have to make a second separate reverence to the Chalice? Regardless of the fact that by receiving the Host you have already become a ‘living Tabernacle’ or whatever buzzphrase you want to use?

Now surely the Precious Blood is worthy of exactly the same reverence whether you choose to receive it or not. The chalice is the same Holy Eucharist and equally worthy of respect whether you receive it or not, do you not agree? That being the case, it logically follows that even IF you pass by the chalice and don’t receive from it, you must also make a bow of the head towards it.

“When receiving Holy Communion, the communicant bows his or her head before the Sacrament as a gesture of reverence and receives the Body of the Lord from the minister. The consecrated host may be received either on the tongue or in the hand, at the discretion of each communicant. When Holy Communion is received under both kinds, * the sign of reverence is also made before receiving the Precious Blood *…”

 

[LilyM]

“When receiving Holy Communion, the communicant bows his or her head before the Sacrament as a gesture of reverence and receives the Body of the Lord from the minister. The consecrated host may be received either on the tongue or in the hand, at the discretion of each communicant. When Holy Communion is received under both kinds, * the sign of reverence is also made before receiving* the Precious Blood …”

Wow, you’ve just totally missed the point of WHY we make the gesture, haven’t you? In the words of the document itself - it’s a sign of reverence. Now perhaps you’d care to explain to me WHY Our Lord in the Precious Blood is any less deserving of the same sign of reverence even when we don’t receive Him, or why we would only revere Him when we DO receive Him.

 

[LilyM]

“When receiving Holy Communion, the communicant bows his or her head before the Sacrament as a gesture of reverence and receives the Body of the Lord from the minister. The consecrated host may be received either on the tongue or in the hand, at the discretion of each communicant. When Holy Communion is received under both kinds, * the sign of reverence is also made before receiving* the Precious Blood …”

Wow, you’ve just totally missed the point of WHY we make the gesture, haven’t you? In the words of the document itself - it’s a sign of reverence. Now perhaps you’d care to explain to me WHY Our Lord in the Precious Blood is any less deserving of the same sign of reverence simply because we don’t choose to receive Him, or why we would only be obliged to revere Him when we DO receive Him.

 

[Lux_et_Tenebrae]

Hi,

I was told by our liturgical coordinator that I should reverence the Precious Blood in the chalice as I walk past it. I said no –

Since you were told, by a legitimate minister of the Parish, and this is not something “wrong”, what about following your parish instructions?

(I do agree that the Precious Blood is to be reverenced. If you don’t invite someone into your home, wouldn’t you at least acknowledge their presence on your street?)

Lux

 

[japhy]

Using your logic if I am carrying a ciborium full of consecrated hosts I should still genuflect when I pass a tabernacle?

One does not genuflect when holding something, which is why in the entrance procession, candle-bearers and the crucifix-bearer only bow their heads if the tabernacle is in the sanctuary… they don’t genuflect.

And as for making a sign of reverence to the Chalice… well, if you receive from it, yes, you should (cf. GIRM 160)… if you don’t, you are technically in a procession and so that probably excuses you (cf. GIRM 274).