No miracles in other faiths or religions?

[punisherthunder]

Long.story.short.

I was in a religious discourse with a Protestant co-worker. They brought up the fact that in Islam, there are never any miracles that are either performed by Muhammed or any that are occurring in the present day (let alone through history). Not any earth-shaking miracles, but you never hear about intercession, healings, or visions.

To further the conversation, I offered to my Protestant co-worker that you do not see any miracles in their faith either. No visions, healings, miracles, etc. The Virgin Mary never appears to them. Why is that?

I tried doing some research on this, but keep coming up empty. Does anyone else see a correlation with this? Have you found any evidence of such occuring in other faiths or religions?

 

[Vaseljen]

Orthodox Church is filled with miracles. Even the holy icons cry myyrh or blood. The relics of some saints are also myyrh leaking.

youtube.com/watch?v=7bFKFrf0sHE

 

[ComplineSanFran]

Perhaps you might have fun doing a bit of exploration in comparative religions. There are miracle stories in all the major traditions.

Ken Woodward wrote a book called *The Book of Miracles
The Meaning of the Miracle Stories in Christianity, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam *. Here is a NYT review of it.

nytimes.com/books/00/08/27/reviews/000827.27zaleskt.html

 

[Thorolfr]

They brought up the fact that in Islam, there are never any miracles that are either performed by Muhammed or any that are occurring in the present day (let alone through history).

What about the story of how Muhammad rode a winged beast called a burak to the seven heavens in what is called the Night Journey? That sounds kind of miraculous to me.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buraq

 

[arthra]

Miracles are actually prevalent I’ve found in Hinduism, Buddhism, Islam…even Christianity!

You have to know where they’re found.

There are verses in Qur’an that mention miraculous events…such as the Birth of Jesus Christ… Jesus speaking as an infant… Jesus breathing on clay birds and them flying away…Abraham was cast into flames and emerged unscathed… The Night Journey is referred to…

You can find where Krishna ascended to the heavens … where He appeared to thousands at one time…

The birth of the Buddha was considered miraculous…

If you look for them you’ll find plenty of miracles.

In the Baha’i Faith we do not view miracles as proofs… in this age…as they are sometimes stories passed down second hand. We don’t deny that miracles can happen but we feel that miracles are most relevant to the people experiencing them.

There was an interesting story where Baha’u’llah was confronted by Ulama or priests and asked to perform a miracle for them. Baha’u’llah responded He would produce the miracle on condition that they all must agree on the miracle and would sign an oath that they would agree to follow Him if the miracle were performed. They couldn’t agree and refused to sign anything.

 

[TheAtheist]

Long.story.short.

I was in a religious discourse with a Protestant co-worker. They brought up the fact that in Islam, there are never any miracles that are either performed by Muhammed or any that are occurring in the present day (let alone through history). Not any earth-shaking miracles, but you never hear about intercession, healings, or visions.

To further the conversation, I offered to my Protestant co-worker that you do not see any miracles in their faith either. No visions, healings, miracles, etc. The Virgin Mary never appears to them. Why is that?

I tried doing some research on this, but keep coming up empty. Does anyone else see a correlation with this? Have you found any evidence of such occuring in other faiths or religions?

I’m surprised that the resident Sufi on CAF hasn’t shown up.

Sufism, the mystical wing of Islam, is literally filled with miraculous happenings - heck back in my home country, there are many many shrines to Sufi holy men, i guess you would call them saints, where people make minor pilgramages to in order to get a blessing or a miracle in the same way that you might go to …that place in France… gaah, i can’t remember so well - the one where your Messiah’s mother appeared in a vision.

The interesting tidbit is that at certain particular holy men’s shrines, you’ll liable to see Sunnis and Shi’ites…and Hindus, Jains, Sikhs, heck yes on rare occasions even Christians (although i believe that’s mostly on a “tourism” mentality) who show up to these places precisely because of the virtuous conduct/life of the Sufi mystic in question.

They’ll honor the man (its usually a man) and will put off bickering with each other until they leave the confines of the shrine.

 

[Path_Finder]

I would urge one to do their own research and do a websearch, one will find material addressing “Islam” and “Miracles” and making claims. I use bing.com. One will find pictures and so on.

Buddhist Masters have been cremated such as Hsuan Hua (who set up the city of 10,000 Buddhas in California).

worldwizzy.com/learn/index.php/Hsuan_Hua

According to a tradition in Buddhism, a person can be proven to have possessed great cultivation skills if upon their death the bone remains have obtained a patina which makes them look like gems. This is known as sharira. Master Hua’s bones did in fact become covered in a patina and this was regarded as evidence that he was indeed a good cultivator.

So in other words, I have seen pictures of these remains and they do in fact, have a jade like gem appearance. It is on the web, I can’t find it right off.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hsuan_Hua#Death

And I believe there has been 1 case at least, of a Hindu Master being incorrupt in death though it may have looked different than the way we Catholics might see for example, St. Bernadette Soubirous.

 

[Path_Finder]

Reading some of the posts, I think we might “get” that miracles occur in the Sacred Books of these religions, perhaps in the Zoroastrian faith as well, perhaps with the Sikhs too.

But I thought a bit as to whether they have had miracles since, the way we would assert there have been miracles since Christ walked the earth.

And there are miracles, Protestants and others will proclaim cures as well, Missionaries may tell us that the food they want to give to the poor has been multiplied.

 

[ComplineSanFran]

In the Baha’i Faith we do not view miracles as proofs… in this age…as they are sometimes stories passed down second hand. We don’t deny that miracles can happen but we feel that miracles are most relevant to the people experiencing them.
.

Do most people view miracles as proof? I don’t think I have ever seen Biblical miracles as such, and certainly modern day ones… not so much. Perhaps it’s the Anglican lens I have. I’d be interested to hear what others say.

 

[TonyBS]

Do most people view miracles as proof? I don’t think I have ever seen Biblical miracles as such, and certainly modern day ones… not so much. Perhaps it’s the Anglican lens I have. I’d be interested to hear what others say.

Unfortunately a lot do see and use them as proof, so many posts that prove this to be so.

Miracles are in all Faiths and as Arthra said above, only good for those that witness them, for the rest of us heart warming stories.

God bless and Regards Tony

 

[SAVINGRACE]

Miracles happen to people of faith and people of no faith. Miracles are not peculiar to one faith.

 

[Bob_Crowley]

I suppose it also depends on what you mean by a miracle.

Most, if not all, of Christ’s miracles centred around nature, and usually involved what might be called “speed”.

The virgin birth - children are born everyday, although not to virgins.

The healing of the sick - our bodies heal themselves, but sometimes need help from other sources, and they take time.

The fig tree that withered overnight to the roots - trees die all the time, but not so fast.

The calming of the storm - storms rise and fall all the time. We had one here a day or so ago with 73,000 lightning strikes, but it moved away and died down.

The feeding of the 5000 - bread and fish multiply in the form of wheat and fish fertility all the time, but not so quickly.

Generally speaking what Christ didn’t do was what might be called fanciful miracles.

Even the raising of the dead implied the reversal of the usual death processes and natural decay.

Since Christ made the claim to be the author of nature, then it would be consistent for his miracles to be along super-natural lines.

 

[pianistclare]

Our Lady has appeared to people other than Roman Catholics:

The info re: Zeitoun was sent to the Vatican for investigation about 20+ years ago .
"Our Lady of Light, was a mass Marian apparition that occurred in the Zeitoun district of Cairo, Egypt, over a period of 2–3 years beginning on April 2, 1968.

The Pope of Alexandria Kyrillos VI appointed a committee of high-ranking priests and bishops to investigate the matter, headed by Bishop Gregorios, bishop of postgraduate studies, Coptic culture and scientific research.
On May 4 the Coptic Orthodox Pope of Alexandria in Cairo issued an official statement confirming the apparitions. They were also confirmed by the Jesuit Father Dr. Henry Habib Ayrout, and by Rev. Dr. Ibrahim Said of the Protestant Evangelical Ministries. Nuns of the Society of the Sacred Heart also witnessed the apparitions and sent a detailed report to the Vatican, resulting in the arrival of an envoy on April 28 who also saw the apparitions and sent a report to Pope Paul VI.

The apparitions were also witnessed by President Gamal Abdel Nasser, and captured by newspaper photographers and Egyptian television. Investigations performed by the police could find no explanation for the phenomenon. No device was found within a radius of fifteen miles capable of projecting the image, while the sheer number of photographs from independent sources suggests that no photographic manipulation was involved. Having been unable to produce an alternative explanation for the luminous sightings, the Egyptian government accepted the apparitions as true".

There was no message, so it’s not a typical “Marian apparition” .
But interesting nonetheless.

peace

 

[punisherthunder]

Lots of good replies here.

To clarify something I left out, I was mentioning miraculous things that have happened within the last 300 years or so. In what we were talking about was that there is no sign from Heaven. Take for example Lourdes. The Virgin Mary appears along with giving the location of the springs. The springwater is “cultivated” if you will and people are drawn to it for healings, be it spiritual or physical. From what I have to research deeper is why such things do not happen in Islam or even some Protestant churches.

Private revelations are an entirely different entity that we are by no means bound to observe or hold as canon. Then again, I have found lots of private revelations in the Protestant faith, but nearly all of them involve visions of the Apocalypse, Heaven, or Hell. Nothing about them is for the short term. While they do not offer a clear picture and are contradictory, it is bothersome that a great deal is money off of such things. I know an elderly woman I work with who regularly drops $149.99 on DVD sets that her preacher churns out warning about blood moons, famine, and war.

I’m still researching, and if anyone has anything positive that they have found or can add, please do.

 

[friardchips]

I’m surprised that the resident Sufi on CAF hasn’t shown up.

Sufism, the mystical wing of Islam, is literally filled with miraculous happenings - heck back in my home country, there are many many shrines to Sufi holy men, i guess you would call them saints, where people make minor pilgramages to in order to get a blessing or a miracle in the same way that you might go to …that place in France… gaah, i can’t remember so well - the one where your Messiah’s mother appeared in a vision.

The interesting tidbit is that at certain particular holy men’s shrines, you’ll liable to see Sunnis and Shi’ites…and Hindus, Jains, Sikhs, heck yes on rare occasions even Christians (although i believe that’s mostly on a “tourism” mentality) who show up to these places precisely because of the virtuous conduct/life of the Sufi mystic in question.

They’ll honor the man (its usually a man) and will put off bickering with each other until they leave the confines of the shrine.

Hi! The shrine to our Holy Mother is called Lourdes.

 

[friardchips]

I suppose it also depends on what you mean by a miracle.

Most, if not all, of Christ’s miracles centred around nature, and usually involved what might be called “speed”.

The virgin birth - children are born everyday, although not to virgins.

The healing of the sick - our bodies heal themselves, but sometimes need help from other sources, and they take time.

The fig tree that withered overnight to the roots - trees die all the time, but not so fast.

The calming of the storm - storms rise and fall all the time. We had one here a day or so ago with 73,000 lightning strikes, but it moved away and died down.

The feeding of the 5000 - bread and fish multiply in the form of wheat and fish fertility all the time, but not so quickly.

Generally speaking what Christ didn’t do was what might be called fanciful miracles.

Even the raising of the dead implied the reversal of the usual death processes and natural decay.

Since Christ made the claim to be the author of nature, then it would be consistent for his miracles to be along super-natural lines.

Hi. I enjoyed this post.

How would you explain water into wine?

 

[punisherthunder]

Very true that Lourdes is a private revelation. But are there subtle levels of revelation? This link in particular has lead to some helpful information.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_revelation

But I’m still curious as to why these revelations are not wholly inherent to Protestantism, more specifically to Islam as well.

 

[friardchips]

Very true that Lourdes is a private revelation. But are there subtle levels of revelation? This link in particular has lead to some helpful information.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_revelation

But I’m still curious as to why these revelations are not wholly inherent to Protestantism, more specifically to Islam as well.

Hi! Just to say that I’d wondered the same thing. When JC correctly said Lourdes was private revelation I was miffed but it is true. But we have the Dogma of the Immaculate Conception and we know that the Virgin Birth was true also in Scripture and so I would have thought that something as important as that particular series of visions would be understood as rooted in Revelation. I would say the same for St. Faustina’s private revelations too, because her communication with our Lord helped the understanding of the Mercy of the Creator’s Heart to really grow, so I think (my opinion so don’t quote me on it) is, although private revelations came through private means, they are messages for the Church, for the world, and deepen our awareness of the Truth revealed in Scripture. So they are indeed rooted in Scripture in the sense that they illumine our understanding of Revelation that happened. Private revelations help us to live the faith of the Church as taught and demonstrated and shared in Scripture. We understand this relationship as being between the Church and Scripture. I tend to think of part way through Acts as being where Salvation History begins, as we are, and the Church is, a continuation of Acts, in a way, because after the Lord has Ascended and the Holy Spirit come down upon Our Lady and the Apostles, and with St. Peter as the Rock having been established, the understanding of Revelation is what comes next. I would imagine this begins with St. Paul, and then us. Maybe someone could better explain…sorry if not well described.

 

[punisherthunder]

Hi! Just to say that I’d wondered the same thing. When JC correctly said Lourdes was private revelation I was miffed but it is true. But we have the Dogma of the Immaculate Conception and we know that the Virgin Birth was true also in Scripture and so I would have thought that something as important as that particular series of visions would be understood as rooted in Revelation. I would say the same for St. Faustina’s private revelations too, because her communication with our Lord helped the understanding of the Mercy of the Creator’s Heart to really grow, so I think (my opinion so don’t quote me on it) is, although private revelations came through private means, they are messages for the Church, for the world, and deepen our awareness of the Truth revealed in Scripture. So they are indeed rooted in Scripture in the sense that they illumine our understanding of Revelation that happened. Private revelations help us to live the faith of the Church as taught and demonstrated and shared in Scripture. We understand this relationship as being between the Church and Scripture. I tend to think of part way through Acts as being where Salvation History begins, as we are, and the Church is, a continuation of Acts, in a way, because after the Lord has Ascended and the Holy Spirit come down upon Our Lady and the Apostles, and with St. Peter as the Rock having been established, the understanding of Revelation is what comes next. I would imagine this begins with St. Paul, and then us. Maybe someone could better explain…sorry if not well described.

I see what you are saying. In light of all the ramblings about Islam I looked further into things, but have still yet to come up with anything that is even a recent private revelation. I’m not sure if that’s a good thing or a bad thing.

 

[spedteacherita]

Miracles happen all the time within the Protestant faiths and traditions - healings, going to heaven and/or hell and coming back, prayer intercessions, etc. My question is this - do we need miracles to grow in our faith? For me, at least at this point in my life, filling my life with His Word, through song, scripture, fellowship with other believers, and sharing in His Presence through His Body and Blood at the Lord’s table continually strengthen me in my faith walk.

The Peace of God to all,

Rita