No Natural Disasters, Disease, Death Before "The Fall'?

[GUYMAN]

I realize that science can’t explain everything involved with our faith but I just can’t accept such a fanciful, un-scientific scenario.

 

[upant]

why does it have to be un-scientific?

the big bang proves creation. there was nothing before it!

disease, death and disaster had to be added at a later time.

 

[BornInMarch]

One explanation I heard was that the lack of death and disease was metaphorical, and that before the fall people still physically died but death was not seen as a scary thing as people knew for a fact that God was waiting on the other size.

 

[Benadam]

There was a kind of suffering before the fall

8 Then the Lord God said, “It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper as his partner.”

God said there was something that wasn’t good in paradise. Adam was lonely. Notice though how God informs Adam not Adam complaining about it to God.

Death happened but animals aren’t capable of the kind of thinking that would be able to know it exists.
When God made Adam he became a ‘living’ soul. Once there is a living soul on earth death can enter the world if the living one dies.

Don’t think that pre fall human experience wasn’t profoundly different than we experience today in a fallen world. The body changed in how it related to the soul. Their body was a visible sign of the fall,

Gen 3
7 Then the eyes of both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together and made loincloths for themselves.

Before the fall the natural powers, within and without served. We didn’t suffer involuntary movements of the body before the fall. Those movements are revealing and embarrassing that’s why they covered themselves. The sense of modesty emerged. God intended that our earthly lives end in heaven body and soul.No death, no graves, a growing community of ancestors that have spiritual bodies that can visit when needed. The entire history of human life among the living in heaven as well as earth.
hope that helps a little

 

[Roseeurekacross]

What does the Vatican teach about this?

 

[Benadam]

You have to believe Adam and Eve are literal. That the fall is a true event that happened. That the event has a profound effect on human history. That everyone on earth descended from them. The Church hasn’t defined much at all when it comes to Genesis. It is so rich in symbols, there is too much that could be lost binding it up with definitions of it’s meaning.

 

[Cathoholic]

GUYMAN:

I realize that science can’t explain everything involved with our faith but I just can’t accept such a fanciful, un-scientific scenario.

.
Please source what Catholic teaching you are drawing this from so I can respond better to your objection (I think I know but I want to hear it from you so I have YOUR perspective).

God bless.

Cathoholic

 

[Cathoholic]

GUYMAN does not seem to be coming back here.

Remember it wasn’t just Adam’s sin that helped in the fall of creation.

CCC 413 (excerpt) “God did not make death, and he does not delight in the death of the living. . . It was through the devil’s envy that death entered the world” (Wis 1:13; 2:24).

For those who insist that animals died before the sin of Adam and Eve (and modern science certainly suggests these are correct thoughts), this sin of fallen angels may well explain “death” even BEFORE Adam’s sin.

 

[De_Maria]

No Natural Disasters, Disease, Death Before “The Fall’?

Where’d you get this from?

I realize that science can’t explain everything involved with our faith but I just can’t accept such a fanciful, un-scientific scenario.

You can be Catholic and have your opinion about Creation. About the only things the Catholic Church has defined is that the Universe was created by God and one man and woman were the first humans.

But I’m interested of the source for your question. Because the Catechism says:

400 The harmony in which they had found themselves, thanks to original justice, is now destroyed: the control of the soul’s spiritual faculties over the body is shattered; the union of man and woman becomes subject to tensions, their relations henceforth marked by lust and domination.282 Harmony with creation is broken: visible creation has become alien and hostile to man.283 Because of man, creation is now subject “to its bondage to decay”.284 Finally, the consequence explicitly foretold for this disobedience will come true: man will “return to the ground”,285 for out of it he was taken. Death makes its entrance into human history.286

Note the focus on the human consequences of the Fall.