No Salvation Outside The Church?

[JohnCS]

I find your statement about the Catechism , “but it leaves a little bit to interpretation” difficult to understand. The words of Catechism Articles Nos. 846 & 846 are perfectly clear to me. I suppose one could “misinterpret” the Catechism by adding unwritten thoughts and using a far stretch of one’s imagination. To “know” the Church is the full realization, without doubt, that the CC is the one, true Church founded by Jesus Christ. For a non-Catholic, who searches the history of Christianity, through books and by way of logic “knows” the CC, realizing that the CC is the one, true Church, yet denies CC doctrine, then Catechism No.846 applies to him/her, “they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it …”

In my opinion, anyone who supports abortion rights has thoughts contrary to one of the Ten Commandments, handed down by God to Moses – the one that states, “Thou shalt not kill.” Is this Christian thinking? They should know better if they’re true Catholics.

Once again, can you cite the book, chapter, verse and line(s) in the Catholic Douay Rheims bible where I can find “"Amen, amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day.
For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink.
Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him?”

And is it anywhere that says that whoever doesn’t eat my flesh and drink my blood doesn’t have eternal life? There are exceptions to just about every rule.

Hope this helps you. I will pray for you, and God bless!

Hello again and thank you for your answers and prayers.

I used the USCCB website to pull off the John 6 quote I posted, here is the Douay Rheims John 6:53-55
[53] The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying: How can this man give us his flesh to eat? [54] Then Jesus said to them: Amen, amen I say unto you: Except you eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, you shall not have life in you. [55] He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath everlasting life: and I will raise him up in the last day.

Except those who eat and drink will not have eternal life…those that do have everlasting life and He will raise them up on the last day?

This teaching over all just seems a little relativistic to me. On one hand we know that if WE die with a mortal sin on our souls we are damned… thus we need to frequent reconcilliation. Outside of the Catholic Church and Orthodox, how many Christians go to people capable of sitting in persona Christi for absolution? So the only people in the world who are damned no matter what if they have a mortal sin on their souls are catholics? Everyone else it is okay, they can be forgiven post death? We chalk this up to the parable that tells us to do the best we can with what we are given? Again thank you for your time and patience.

 

[inkaneer]

Hi Tom,

Inkaneer,

As I have said repeatedly, “No, I am not a Feeneyite”. Feeney separated justification and Baptism and I don’t think this is possible after the promulgation of the Gospel.
I don’t condemn anyone to Hell. Those who are open will be led by Divine Providence to the Catholic Church, even if it should require a miracle. God does not disappoint. Anyone can be saved.

So are you saying that salvation is still possible for a protestant baptized with proper form and matter?

 

[AnneElliot]

So are you saying that salvation is still possible for a protestant baptized with proper form and matter?

Of course, with the grace of an act of perfect contrition a ‘protestant’ properly baptized would be Catholic.

As I said before… salvation is possible for anyone. Anyone can be brought to the Catholic Faith.

 

[twb1621]

…

*Membership of the CC (or for that matter any religion) does not guarantee the said knowledge. I find that the majority in any religion, are either ignorant or misinformed of the teachings of their own religion. This includes well educated members too.

Allow me to reiterate; “A Catholic has been given or offered the salvation of Christ through His Church and in His sacraments”. Although I agree with you in that “ the majority in any religion, are either ignorant or misinformed of the teachings of their own religion”, wanton ignorance is not an excuse, that position is scriptural. Ignorance based on distorted teachings or on a person’s refusal to accept the truth or refuse to hear it is wanton.

*Being saved remains a mystery. Our Lord Himself said that unless His Father willed so, no one can come to Him. No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day. (John 6:44)

But He also said no one can go to the Father except through Him: I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. (John 14:6)

That is absolutely true, I agree, and it is not in opposition to What I presented at all. Now, why would a person think Our Lord would choose who He wills to be saved? Could it be He would will those who believe in Him and accept Him and live according to His teachings be saved? I believe that would be more likely than just “picking out of the hat” so to speak. Refer to the following two of many verses and see how your reference and the following work in unison in this regard.

1 Timothy CH2; 3 This is good and pleasing to God our savior, 4 who wills everyone to be saved and to come to knowledge of the truth.”
Romans CH10; 10 For one believes with the heart and so is justified, and one confesses with the mouth and so is saved. 11 For the scripture says, “No one who believes in him will be put to shame.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; the same Lord is Lord of all, enriching all who call upon him. 13 For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Acts CH16; 28 But Paul shouted out in a loud voice, “Do no harm to yourself; we are all here.” 29 He (the jailer) asked for a light and rushed in and, trembling with fear, he fell down before Paul and Silas. 30 Then he (the jailer) brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” 31 And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus and you and your household will be saved.” 32 So they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to everyone in his house. 33 He took them in at that hour of the night and bathed their wounds; (note the act of humility and charity on the part of the jailer as is called for in Matthew CH25) then he and all his family were baptized at once. 34 He brought them up into his house and provided a meal and with his household rejoiced at having come to faith in God.

Man’s free will is never taken from him so it is man who must choose to accept and follow God’s word. But nowhere in scripture does it say God will not accept some who in heart call upon Him.

continued…

 

[twb1621]

…

continued from previous post…

*So it is quite clear that, God draws people to Jesus for His own reasons which probably are beyond our comprehension and we have no business to attribute any.
*Baptism, is an extraordinary source of grace that draws people to Jesus; however they need to prove worthy of it and so must anyone who is drawn to Jesus. Recall the Parable of the Wedding Banquet (Matt 22:1-14) and the fate of the one without wedding clothes. This parable is most relevant to this debate.

People must choose to come to Christ and be Baptized unless Baptized at infancy. The parable you speak of shows disregard or wanton ignorance on the part of one who comes without proper preparation of himself.

*The THREE CLEAR MESSAGES are:

1. There is no place for the unworthy in God’s Kingdom

Absolutely agreed.

*2. There is NO ROOM for complacency in God’s Kingdom

Complacency toward Christ’s teachings would certainly not be acceptable to gain salvation and enter God’s kingdom, you are correct.

*3. There is no pre-condition or bar to enter God’s kingdom.

Not sure I get what you are saying here.

Therefore IT IS NOBODY’S RIGHT TO SPECULATE WHO IS SAVED AND WHO IS DAMNED.

As is proclaimed above, it is “ …who wills everyone to be saved and to come to knowledge of the truth. The Church does not “speculate” in this teaching and we are responsible to learn the Truth, that is in the teachings of Christ through His Church. What I have presented in previous posts is not a judgment of the soul of any particular man, but rather the understanding we should have in what is required based on what is proclaimed and what results may come from the choices of acceptance or refusal. I was very specific about “ only God knows the hearts of man.

Our only concern should be "How to live a life worthy of our calling and through our lives, attract others to Jesus by being shining examples

"
Kind of a simplistic statement…

 

[inkaneer]

Of course, with the grace of an act of perfect contrition a ‘protestant’ properly baptized would be Catholic.

As I said before… salvation is possible for anyone. Anyone can be brought to the Catholic Faith.

But is a validly baptized protestant inside or outside the Church? No other qualifiers apply.

 

[AnneElliot]

But is a validly baptized protestant inside or outside the Church? No other qualifiers apply.

At what age? Before the age of reason, any validly baptized person is Catholic.

Afterwards, the embrace of heresy puts one outside the Church. Just as a Catholic in mortal sin is outside the Church until he is reconciled.

 

[inkaneer]

Quote:
Originally Posted by inkaneer
But is a validly baptized protestant inside or outside the Church? No other qualifiers apply.

At what age? Before the age of reason, any validly baptized person is Catholic.

I’m sure protestants will be glad to hear that.

Afterwards, the embrace of heresy puts one outside the Church. Just as a Catholic in mortal sin is outside the Church until he is reconciled.

And of course, in order to be a mortal sin, the embrace of heresy must be done with full knowledge that it is a heresy. But what of the validly baptized protestant who does not have that full knowledge? Is salvation possible?

 

[AnneElliot]

I’m sure protestants will be glad to hear that.

That’s irrelevant.

And of course, in order to be a mortal sin, the embrace of heresy must be done with full knowledge that it is a heresy. But what of the validly baptized protestant who does not have that full knowledge? Is salvation possible?

Salvation is *possible *for any validly baptized person. Salvation is possible for anyone… anyone can be brought to the Catholic Faith. This is why the Church fosters the missions with care and attention-- to procure the salvation of those who are open but yet outside the Church…

Pope Pius XII, Mystici Corporis Christi “103. As you know, Venerable Brethren, from the very beginning of Our Pontificate, We have committed to the protection and guidance of heaven those who do not belong to the visible Body of the Catholic Church, solemnly declaring that after the example of the Good Shepherd We desire nothing more ardently than that they may have life and have it more abundantly. Imploring the prayers of the whole Church We wish to repeat this solemn declaration in this Encyclical Letter in which We have proclaimed the praises of the “great and glorious Body of Christ” and from a heart overflowing with love We ask each and every one of them to correspond to the interior movements of grace, and to seek to withdraw from that state in which they cannot be sure of their salvation. For even though by an unconscious desire and longing they have a certain relationship with the Mystical Body of the Redeemer, they still remain deprived of those many heavenly gifts and helps which can only be enjoyed in the Catholic Church. Therefore may they enter into Catholic unity and, joined with Us in the one, organic Body of Jesus Christ, may they together with us run on to the one Head in the Society of glorious love. Persevering in prayer to the Spirit of love and truth, We wait for them with open and outstretched arms to come not to a stranger’s house, but to their own, their father’s home.”

 

[tqualey]

Hi, Anne,

Perhaps you could give me the source for your statement… Since Feeneyism was condemned as a heresy I am confident that the Bishop of Worceser knows about it and is not allowing heresy to be encouraged on his watch. Maybe this group, like Fr. Feeney, himself, saw the light of truth and renounced the heresy? … or, maybe you are in error on this point?

God bless

Hi Tom,

Perhaps you should write the Bishop of the Diocese of Worcester, MA and ask him why the Diocese supports a (supposed) heretical religious order AND lists it on the Diocesan website.

Anyway, I am not here to defend Fr. Feeney, I do not hold all of Fr. Feeney’s views. I stick with the Church and abide by her official teachings (as found in Ecumenical Councils, Papal documents, etc.). There is only one Church which has taught and continues to teach the same Truth.

Inkaneer,

As I have said repeatedly, “No, I am not a Feeneyite”. Feeney separated justification and Baptism and I don’t think this is possible after the promulgation of the Gospel.

I don’t condemn anyone to Hell. Those who are open will be led by Divine Providence to the Catholic Church, even if it should require a miracle. God does not disappoint. Anyone can be saved.

 

[AnneElliot]

Tom,

Perhaps you could show me the document where a) the term “Feeneyism” was coined and b) where the Church has condemned “Feeneyism”?

Link to the Diocese of Worcester site: worcesterdiocese.org/vicar/ReligiousCommunities/tabid/478/Default.aspx
Benedictine’s of Still River are the “Feeneyite” communities, as well as the “Slaves of the Immaculate Heart of Mary” and their school by the same name.
abbey.org/
sistersofstbenedictcenter.org/index.html
saintbenedict.com/
Check out their “history” tab…
“In 2002, Bishop Reilly of Worcester came to the Center and after a ceremony in the Chapel where the community recited and signed a copy of the Creed, he gave his formal blessing and “regularized” the community in the diocese. His successor, Bishop McManus has come to the Chapel several times since then to administer the sacrament of Confirmation in the Traditional Rite to the student of IHM…
With the help of God we pray to continue the legacy of our founder Father Leonard Feeney, in the spirit of St. Louis De Montfort.”
saintbenedict.com/theorder/history.html?start=3

If this is not enough for you, Tom (et. al.) you are free to contact the community in Still River yourself that they may reassure you that they hold the doctrinal position on EENS the same as Fr. Feeney (and the Church) and that they are in good standing with the Church.

Not only are the communities in Still River, MA approved… Fr. Frank Pavone of Priests for Life held a retreat there: priestsforlife.org/clippings/95,04-07catholicfreepressstillriverretreat.html

The infamous Fr. Z (Father John Zuhsdolf) has also commented about the so-called “Feeneyites” being in good standing with the Church:
“I call to mind also the situation of the late Fr. Leonard Feeney, SJ, and his “wildcat group” the Slaves of the Immaculate Heart of Mary. They took a black and white position on the Church’s true teaching that “outside the Church there is no salvation”. This got them in hot water with the Holy See. Eventually an understanding was hammered out. The so-called “Feeneyites” were able to be in union with the Church but without having to abjure their position about extra Ecclesiam nulla salus.”
wdtprs.com/blog/2009/01/some-thoughts-about-the-sspx-rome-and-unity/

 

[tqualey]

Hi, Anne,

My error in using the wrong word to identify this heresy. I am in the process of doing the research on the links you have provided.

I did come across one that you may be interested in - it gives a lot of detail on how this axiom of “Outside the chruch there is no salvation” is to be understood. Here is the link:the-pope.com/feeneyite.html

God bless

Tom,

Perhaps you could show me the document where a) the term “Feeneyism” was coined and b) where the Church has condemned “Feeneyism”?

Link to the Diocese of Worcester site: worcesterdiocese.org/vicar/ReligiousCommunities/tabid/478/Default.aspx
Benedictine’s of Still River are the “Feeneyite” communities, as well as the “Slaves of the Immaculate Heart of Mary” and their school by the same name.
abbey.org/
sistersofstbenedictcenter.org/index.html
saintbenedict.com/
Check out their “history” tab…
“In 2002, Bishop Reilly of Worcester came to the Center and after a ceremony in the Chapel where the community recited and signed a copy of the Creed, he gave his formal blessing and “regularized” the community in the diocese. His successor, Bishop McManus has come to the Chapel several times since then to administer the sacrament of Confirmation in the Traditional Rite to the student of IHM…
With the help of God we pray to continue the legacy of our founder Father Leonard Feeney, in the spirit of St. Louis De Montfort.”
saintbenedict.com/theorder/history.html?start=3

If this is not enough for you, Tom (et. al.) you are free to contact the community in Still River yourself that they may reassure you that they hold the doctrinal position on EENS the same as Fr. Feeney (and the Church) and that they are in good standing with the Church.

Not only are the communities in Still River, MA approved… Fr. Frank Pavone of Priests for Life held a retreat there: priestsforlife.org/clippings/95,04-07catholicfreepressstillriverretreat.html

The infamous Fr. Z (Father John Zuhsdolf) has also commented about the so-called “Feeneyites” being in good standing with the Church:
“I call to mind also the situation of the late Fr. Leonard Feeney, SJ, and his “wildcat group” the Slaves of the Immaculate Heart of Mary. They took a black and white position on the Church’s true teaching that “outside the Church there is no salvation”. This got them in hot water with the Holy See. Eventually an understanding was hammered out. The so-called “Feeneyites” were able to be in union with the Church but without having to abjure their position about extra Ecclesiam nulla salus.”
wdtprs.com/blog/2009/01/some-thoughts-about-the-sspx-rome-and-unity/

 

[LittleSoldier]

How many do you want?

+Ven. Mary of Agreda bilocated no less than 500 times to convert the Native Americans. She told them missionaries would come to baptize them, and when the Franciscan priests got there, they found the Indians already knowledgeable in the Faith who said a “lady in blue” appeared to them and taught it to them so they were baptized by the missionaries, as she had promised. (Mysteries, Marvels, Miracles in the Lives of the Saints by Joan Carroll Cruz, et. al.)

+St. Colette and St. Joan of Arc raised dead infants to life so that they might receive the Sacrament of Baptism.
(Saints Who Raised the Dead by Fr. Albert Hebert)

+St. Patrick raised 2 dead pagan women back to life who then renounced their idols and proclaimed that Christ was the true God, and they and many of the witnesses were baptized.
(Saints Who Raised the Dead by Fr. Albert Hebert)

I recommend both of the above books, as they include many more examples. Neither books were written for such a purpose, but they do demonstrate the occasion of such miracles occurring in the lives of the Saints. Most of these miracles were used in the beatification/canonization process for these Saints (and the many others) who worked the miracles recorded in both books. Those books are not the only places the miracles are recorded, but they are like a compendium of sorts, and good to have for one’s own inspiration and edification.

Thank you very much! It looks like I have some interesting reading to do. It’s weird that I never heard of this happening before you mentioned it.

I especially appreciate the book titles and authors. That is a big help!

God bless!

 

[LittleSoldier]

That’s irrelevant.

Salvation is *possible *for any validly baptized person. Salvation is possible for anyone… anyone can be brought to the Catholic Faith. This is why the Church fosters the missions with care and attention-- to procure the salvation of those who are open but yet outside the Church…

Pope Pius XII, Mystici Corporis Christi “103. As you know, Venerable Brethren, from the very beginning of Our Pontificate, We have committed to the protection and guidance of heaven those who do not belong to the visible Body of the Catholic Church, solemnly declaring that after the example of the Good Shepherd We desire nothing more ardently than that they may have life and have it more abundantly. Imploring the prayers of the whole Church We wish to repeat this solemn declaration in this Encyclical Letter in which We have proclaimed the praises of the “great and glorious Body of Christ” and from a heart overflowing with love We ask each and every one of them to correspond to the interior movements of grace, and to seek to withdraw from that state in which they cannot be sure of their salvation. For even though by an unconscious desire and longing they have a certain relationship with the Mystical Body of the Redeemer, they still remain deprived of those many heavenly gifts and helps which can only be enjoyed in the Catholic Church. Therefore may they enter into Catholic unity and, joined with Us in the one, organic Body of Jesus Christ, may they together with us run on to the one Head in the Society of glorious love. Persevering in prayer to the Spirit of love and truth, We wait for them with open and outstretched arms to come not to a stranger’s house, but to their own, their father’s home.”

I am just becoming more confused now. What about a person in a small tribe in the jungles of South America who has never met a missionary and has never met a Catholic yet does her best to be a good and kind person (a sheep vs. a goat)? She is dying today. Can she be saved? There is no way she will be able to join the Catholic Church while she is alive on this earth. So are we going back to limbo?

Isn’t the heresy of Feeneyism that nobody who is not a member of the Catholic Church can be saved? I think there’s part of the story that I don’t know about. CAF states that Feeneyism is a heresy. Now I’m hearing different things.

 

[LittleSoldier]

Hi, Anne,

My error in using the wrong word to identify this heresy. I am in the process of doing the research on the links you have provided.

I did come across one that you may be interested in - it gives a lot of detail on how this axiom of “Outside the chruch there is no salvation” is to be understood. Here is the link:the-pope.com/feeneyite.html

God bless

Thank you for the link, Tom. I’ve read about a third of it and skimmed a lot of the rest. It seems clear that Feeneyism is a heresy, that Fr. Feeney was excommunicated (although the reasons are complicated) and that those who continue to believe in Feeneyism are believing in a heresy.

 

[LittleSoldier]

At what age? Before the age of reason, any validly baptized person is Catholic.

Afterwards, the embrace of heresy puts one outside the Church. Just as a Catholic in mortal sin is outside the Church until he is reconciled.

But before the age of reason it would be difficult to have a baptism of desire or a baptism of blood, wouldn’t it? So a child under the age of reason must be baptised with water. Right?

I mean no disrespect to you or to anyone but I have been thinking about this for years now and I am no closer to an answer than I was when I started. You see, I am very frightened for my son. He was removed from my custody (illegally - long story) and I wasn’t attending the Church then. I don’t know if he has been baptised. I haven’t seen him for 26 years and it hurts so much to think that he may be damned to hell because I blew it. It’s my fault because I could have poured some water over his head the few times I was able to hold him and I didn’t. I just can’t believe that God would damn him for something that is my fault.

But what I really don’t understand is:

WHY WATER???

 

[inkaneer]

I am just becoming more confused now. What about a person in a small tribe in the jungles of South America who has never met a missionary and has never met a Catholic yet does her best to be a good and kind person (a sheep vs. a goat)? She is dying today. Can she be saved? There is no way she will be able to join the Catholic Church while she is alive on this earth. So are we going back to limbo?

Isn’t the heresy of Feeneyism that nobody who is not a member of the Catholic Church can be saved? I think there’s part of the story that I don’t know about. CAF states that Feeneyism is a heresy. Now I’m hearing different things.

Feeneyism is a strict literal understanding of the axiom “outside the Church there is no salvation.” For them, to be inside the church one must be an actual member of the Catholic Church. To them, your example of the dying tribal person who never heard the gospel is doomed to hell. Feeneyism would damn all protestants and I would imagine all Orthodox too.

A person enters the Church through valid Baptism and the Church recognizes the Baptisms of many protestant denominations as being valid. Therefore, while not an actual member of the Catholic Church they are not “outside the church” either. However, they are not out of the woods either. They still have the problem of mortal sin to deal with. Unlike Catholics, protestants have no way to remit mortal sin as they deny the authority to forgive sin and thus “perfect charity” becomes a necessity. Still there is the problem of whether they possess true “invinceable ignorance”. All this makes for a very complicated scenario. In a nut shell, when protestants go around claiming they are saved they probably aren’t because while the Church holds out the possibility of salvation for them the probability is another matter. As for your example of the tribal person who would die before ever seeing a missionary. I think the parable of the talents would apply and the judgement to someone who was given little would be at a lesser standard than one who was given much. I would not think that they would be automatically damned to Hell as Feeney and some protestant sects would claim as that would then violate the scriptures that say that God wills that all men be saved. For one to miss out on salvation because they were the innocent victim of being born in the wrong place at the wrong time would contradict the scriptures. Put another way, their ignorance is trule invinceable. So, yes, salvation is possible for them also.

P.S. Do, by all means, check out Fr. Albert Hebert fully. He claims to have had an apparition of the Blessed Virgin in 1980. That apparition claim has been ruled to be not worthy of belief. His writings are therefore suspect so unless there is an imprimatur on them do go cautiously.

 

[AnneElliot]

P.S. Do, by all means, check out Fr. Albert Hebert fully. He claims to have had an apparition of the Blessed Virgin in 1980. That apparition claim has been ruled to be not worthy of belief. His writings are therefore suspect so unless there is an imprimatur on them do go cautiously.

Interesting… I never heard that bit about the supposed apparition. Can you tell me where found that? It doesn’t say anything about it in the book I mentioned above.

His book, Saints Who Raised the Dead does carry an Imprimatur along with a Nihil Obstat, and Imprimi Potest

 

[LittleSoldier]

Feeneyism is a strict literal understanding of the axiom “outside the Church there is no salvation.” For them, to be inside the church one must be an actual member of the Catholic Church. To them, your example of the dying tribal person who never heard the gospel is doomed to hell. Feeneyism would damn all protestants and I would imagine all Orthodox too.

A person enters the Church through valid Baptism and the Church recognizes the Baptisms of many protestant denominations as being valid. Therefore, while not an actual member of the Catholic Church they are not “outside the church” either. However, they are not out of the woods either. They still have the problem of mortal sin to deal with. Unlike Catholics, protestants have no way to remit mortal sin as they deny the authority to forgive sin and thus “perfect charity” becomes a necessity. Still there is the problem of whether they possess true “invinceable ignorance”. All this makes for a very complicated scenario. In a nut shell, when protestants go around claiming they are saved they probably aren’t because while the Church holds out the possibility of salvation for them the probability is another matter. As for your example of the tribal person who would die before ever seeing a missionary. I think the parable of the talents would apply and the judgement to someone who was given little would be at a lesser standard than one who was given much. I would not think that they would be automatically damned to Hell as Feeney and some protestant sects would claim as that would then violate the scriptures that say that God wills that all men be saved. For one to miss out on salvation because they were the innocent victim of being born in the wrong place at the wrong time would contradict the scriptures. Put another way, their ignorance is trule invinceable. So, yes, salvation is possible for them also.

P.S. Do, by all means, check out Fr. Albert Hebert fully. He claims to have had an apparition of the Blessed Virgin in 1980. That apparition claim has been ruled to be not worthy of belief. His writings are therefore suspect so unless there is an imprimatur on them do go cautiously.

Thank you!! You’ve brought out the finer points that I was not aware of. It makes sense that baptism in a church other than the Catholic Church is still important. I married a non-Catholic and that is the first question we were asked. At the time I thought it was weird but our classes were very poor (I know they have improved immensely since then; this was quite awhile ago).

I went to Catholic school and I was taught that the boys in Africa (strange that the girls were never mentioned) who didn’t know about Jesus would go to limbo when they died and limbo was a great place to be. The only thing that made limbo different from heaven is that God isn’t there. I felt so sorry for those people and even back then I didn’t think it was fair. How could limbo be great without God? How horrible. But we were told they could have all the ice cream they wanted. I was just a dumb kid. I wanted the ice cream, too!!

I’ll check your reference and I’ll be very careful.

Thanks again!!

 

[itinerant1]

Local sources for "Extra ecclesiam nulla salus"

1. What “No Salvation Outside the Church” Means
By Jim Blackburn
One of the most misunderstood teachings of the Catholic Church is this one: “Outside the Church there is no salvation” (Extra ecclesiam nulla salus)

2. No Salvation Outside the Church
By Fr. Ray Ryland

3. Salvation outside the Church
(NIHIL OBSTAT; IMPRIMATUR)

4. Salvation Outside the Church
The Fathers Know Best

5. Can Non-Christians Be Saved?
By Kenneth J. Howell

6. It Didn’t Go Out with Vatican II
The Church’s Position on Salvation outside the Church Is Unchanged
By Mark P. Shea

7. Salvation for Non-Christians Explained Sola Scriptura
By Joan Summers