No, you can't call God mother!

[mthomson]

just a view on this topic do u really think god is male of female i think neither just my opinion and do u think that we are meant to actually see god ? should we meet our maker especially if its not what we think it would be ?? would love some opinions

 

[meltzerboy]

Sophia or Wisdom was feminine in the Bible, but God the male Father was always considered Creator, no doubt about it. Judaism is a very patriarchal religion. There were some strong women in the OT but none equivalent to God.

In Christianity, Mary is the Mother of God, and actually the closest you will get to a mother deity. Although she is not a God, she is the highest of all saints and was without sin and assumed into Heaven, and prayed to for intercession most fervently.

In a prior post, I also mentioned the patriarchal nature of Western religions and how that may well play an important role in our concept of G-d as Father. However, upon further reflection about Judaism, there appear to be several matriarchal features in the religion as well. In addition to the feminine aspects of the Shekinah, there is the matrilineal notion concerning who is defined as a Jew, which is based on their mother rather than their father. Further, it is the mother who is responsible for the care of the children and the home in every detail, including making it a kosher home, preparing for the holidays, and nowadays, due to acculturation, even educating both their daughters and sons in the moral values inherent in Judaism. (The truth of the matter is that there is not, and perhaps never was, only one typical Jewish family distinct from its larger cultural context, whether Polish, German, Turkish, or Moroccan.)

 

[steido01]

In a prior post, I also mentioned the patriarchal nature of Western religions and how that may well play an important role in our concept of G-d as Father. However, upon further reflection about Judaism, there appear to be several matriarchal features in the religion as well. In addition to the feminine aspects of the Shekinah, there is the matrilineal notion concerning who is defined as a Jew, which is based on their mother rather than their father. Further, it is the mother who is responsible for the care of the children and the home in every detail, including making it a kosher home, preparing for the holidays, and nowadays, due to acculturation, even educating both their daughters and sons in the moral values inherent in Judaism. (The truth of the matter is that there is not, and perhaps never was, only one typical Jewish family distinct from its larger cultural context, whether Polish, German, Turkish, or Moroccan.)

Haven’t read much of the thread, so maybe it’s already been mentioned… but I wonder if there’s much in the way of historic Jewish writings on the topic? I’m thinking there must be something about someone like Deborah, for example?

 

[Ignatius]

Can it be that anyone actually believes that God the Father and God the Holy Spirit are ‘men’

No, Didn’t you read the article? It is really explains the whole concept

From the article:

1. Jesus tells us to call God “Father” - The really big reason comes first. Jesus himself tells us to call God Father. Of course the feminist activists don’t take something like the Bible or even the words of Jesus seriously.
2. The Old Testament refers to God as Father - From paragraph 238 of the Catechism: Many religions invoke God as “Father”. The deity is often considered the “father of gods and of men”. In Israel, God is called “Father” inasmuch as he is Creator of the world. Even more, God is Father because of the covenant and the gift of the law to Israel, “his first-born son”. God is also called the Father of the king of Israel. Most especially he is “the Father of the poor”, of the orphaned and the widowed, who are under his loving protection.
3. The Liturgy Calls God “Father” - We believe what we pray. We pray what we believe. To tinker with the liturgy is always to tinker with what we actually believe.
4. The Catechism explains why we call God Father and how this includes the mothering attributes of God - By calling God “Father”, the language of faith indicates two main things: that God is the first origin of everything and transcendent authority; and that he is at the same time goodness and loving care for all his children. Of course God transcends the human distinction between the sexes, He is neither man nor woman: he is God.
5. Calling God “Mother” and “Father” is confusing - Our world is confused enough about gender right now. Calling God both Mother and Father makes God some kind of transgendered being. Nope.
6. Gender identification enables a loving relationship - Think about it. What I mean is that we relate to others through gender. I relate to my mother as her son. I relate to my brother as my brother. I relate to my daughter as her father. I am male. They are either male or female. I cannot have a true relationship with someone who is neither male nor female… God wants us to love him and be in relationship with him. That is why he reveals himself as “Father” and why Jesus commands us to call God “Father” so that we can relate to him as his sons and daughters. We cannot be in a loving relationship with an abstract being who is sometimes Mother and sometimes Father.

 

[meltzerboy]

JimmyG88;13023783:

Can it be that anyone actually believes that God the Father and God the Holy Spirit are ‘men’

No, Didn’t you read the article? It is really explains the whole concept

From the article:

1. Jesus tells us to call God “Father” - The really big reason comes first. Jesus himself tells us to call God Father. Of course the feminist activists don’t take something like the Bible or even the words of Jesus seriously.
2. The Old Testament refers to God as Father - From paragraph 238 of the Catechism: Many religions invoke God as “Father”. The deity is often considered the “father of gods and of men”. In Israel, God is called “Father” inasmuch as he is Creator of the world. Even more, God is Father because of the covenant and the gift of the law to Israel, “his first-born son”. God is also called the Father of the king of Israel. Most especially he is “the Father of the poor”, of the orphaned and the widowed, who are under his loving protection.
3. The Liturgy Calls God “Father” - We believe what we pray. We pray what we believe. To tinker with the liturgy is always to tinker with what we actually believe.
4. The Catechism explains why we call God Father and how this includes the mothering attributes of God - By calling God “Father”, the language of faith indicates two main things: that God is the first origin of everything and transcendent authority; and that he is at the same time goodness and loving care for all his children. Of course God transcends the human distinction between the sexes, He is neither man nor woman: he is God.
5. Calling God “Mother” and “Father” is confusing - Our world is confused enough about gender right now. Calling God both Mother and Father makes God some kind of transgendered being. Nope.
6. Gender identification enables a loving relationship - Think about it. What I mean is that we relate to others through gender. I relate to my mother as her son. I relate to my brother as my brother. I relate to my daughter as her father. I am male. They are either male or female. I cannot have a true relationship with someone who is neither male nor female… God wants us to love him and be in relationship with him. That is why he reveals himself as “Father” and why Jesus commands us to call God “Father” so that we can relate to him as his sons and daughters. We cannot be in a loving relationship with an abstract being who is sometimes Mother and sometimes Father.

You have an interesting point. In addition to the gender relationship we have with G-d, we also tend to humanize His emotions, thoughts, motivations, and behaviors. That seems to be the way we can best relate to G-d. Yet, I question whether it is not also a matter of cultural influence: that is, our brain may not be completely hard-wired to relate in terms of gender since our social learning to identify according to gender takes place so early in infant and child development. OTOH, we may have a biological capacity and predisposition to learn to identify and internalize our relationships according to a gender identification.

 

[Thorolfr]

[God wants us to love him and be in relationship with him. That is why he reveals himself as “Father” and why Jesus commands us to call God “Father” so that we can relate to him as his sons and daughters. We cannot be in a loving relationship with an abstract being who is sometimes Mother and sometimes Father.

Of course, the fact that many people now relate to God as “Father” is because we come out of a culture that historically has been patriarchal. If, on the other hand, our culture had been a matriarchal culture, we would probably be relating to God as “Mother” right now.
[/quote]

 

[Ignatius]

Of course, the fact that many people now relate to God as “Father” is because we come out of a culture that historically has been patriarchal.

Are you trying to imply that Jesus was afraid to challenge the cultural norms of His day?
If so, please cite when He showed that He was afraid to do so.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

Of course, the fact that many people now relate to God as “Father” is because we come out of a culture that historically has been patriarchal. If, on the other hand, our culture had been a matriarchal culture, we would probably be relating to God as “Mother” right now.

There has never been a truly matriarchal society on earth. The worship of the mother goddess has always been an adjunct to the father god.

 

[Ben_Riley]

Isn’t the official Catholic teaching that God has no gender? Please let me know

 

[CHRISTINE77]

Isn’t the official Catholic teaching that God has no gender? Please let me know

Although he technically has no gender, He is referred to most often as a man.

'The Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC) #239 states, in reference to the Father: "God transcends the human distinction between the sexes. He is neither man nor woman: he is God."The CCC discusses the traditional imagery and language of God as Father. It notes, however, that God is not limited to this role alone—maternal imagery are also used in the Bible.It also notes that human fatherhood only imperfectly reflects God’s archetypal fatherhood.God is referred to as masculine in Catholic teaching and practice.

Though Church teaching, in line with its Doctors, holds that God has no literal sex because he has no body (a prerequisite of sex), classical and scriptural understanding states that God should be referred to (in most contexts) as masculine by analogy. It justifies this by pointing to God’s relationship with the world as begetter of the world and revelation (i.e. analogous to an active instead of feminine receptive role in sexual intercourse).’ Wiki

 

[Ben_Riley]

Although he technically has no gender, He is referred to most often as a man.

'The Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC) #239 states, in reference to the Father: "God transcends the human distinction between the sexes. He is neither man nor woman: he is God."The CCC discusses the traditional imagery and language of God as Father. It notes, however, that God is not limited to this role alone—maternal imagery are also used in the Bible.It also notes that human fatherhood only imperfectly reflects God’s archetypal fatherhood.God is referred to as masculine in Catholic teaching and practice.

Though Church teaching, in line with its Doctors, holds that God has no literal sex because he has no body (a prerequisite of sex), classical and scriptural understanding states that God should be referred to (in most contexts) as masculine by analogy. It justifies this by pointing to God’s relationship with the world as begetter of the world and revelation (i.e. analogous to an active instead of feminine receptive role in sexual intercourse).’ Wiki

Thank you so much. This is what I thought. So would calling God mother be a heresy by these standards or is it more a matter of preference?

 

[JimmyG88]

Thank you so much. This is what I thought. So would calling God mother be a heresy by these standards or is it more a matter of preference?

Tradition probably. So many so called depictions of God the Father are of an elderly white man with a beard.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

Thank you so much. This is what I thought. So would calling God mother be a heresy by these standards or is it more a matter of preference?

I would say it would be frowned upon. Although God encompasses all aspects, he is generally referred to as God the Father. The Church and the Bible call Him God the Father. We pray to our Father in Heaven.

In almost all religions, past and present, the male god figure is equivalent with mind, spirit and heaven, while the female goddess figure is equivalent to earth, nature and fruition.

 

[Ignatius]

Isn’t the official Catholic teaching that God has no gender?

Didn’t you read the article? It is really explains the whole concept

From the article:

1. Jesus tells us to call God “Father” - The really big reason comes first. Jesus himself tells us to call God Father. Of course the feminist activists don’t take something like the Bible or even the words of Jesus seriously.
2. The Old Testament refers to God as Father - From paragraph 238 of the Catechism: Many religions invoke God as “Father”. The deity is often considered the “father of gods and of men”. In Israel, God is called “Father” inasmuch as he is Creator of the world. Even more, God is Father because of the covenant and the gift of the law to Israel, “his first-born son”. God is also called the Father of the king of Israel. Most especially he is “the Father of the poor”, of the orphaned and the widowed, who are under his loving protection.
3. The Liturgy Calls God “Father” - We believe what we pray. We pray what we believe. To tinker with the liturgy is always to tinker with what we actually believe.
4. The Catechism explains why we call God Father and how this includes the mothering attributes of God - By calling God “Father”, the language of faith indicates two main things: that God is the first origin of everything and transcendent authority; and that he is at the same time goodness and loving care for all his children. Of course God transcends the human distinction between the sexes, He is neither man nor woman: he is God.
5. Calling God “Mother” and “Father” is confusing - Our world is confused enough about gender right now. Calling God both Mother and Father makes God some kind of transgendered being. Nope.
6. Gender identification enables a loving relationship - Think about it. What I mean is that we relate to others through gender. I relate to my mother as her son. I relate to my brother as my brother. I relate to my daughter as her father. I am male. They are either male or female. I cannot have a true relationship with someone who is neither male nor female… God wants us to love him and be in relationship with him. That is why he reveals himself as “Father” and why Jesus commands us to call God “Father” so that we can relate to him as his sons and daughters. We cannot be in a loving relationship with an abstract being who is sometimes Mother and sometimes Father.

 

[Ignatius]

Thank you so much. This is what I thought. So would calling God mother be a heresy by these standards?

Jesus calls Him father. Jesus told us to call Him father. The Gospels call Him father. Contradicting the teachings of Jesus against the foundational principals Christianity.

 

[JimmyG88]

Didn’t you read the article? It is really explains the whole concept

From the article:

1. Jesus tells us to call God “Father” - The really big reason comes first. Jesus himself tells us to call God Father. Of course the feminist activists don’t take something like the Bible or even the words of Jesus seriously.
2. The Old Testament refers to God as Father - From paragraph 238 of the Catechism: Many religions invoke God as “Father”. The deity is often considered the “father of gods and of men”. In Israel, God is called “Father” inasmuch as he is Creator of the world. Even more, God is Father because of the covenant and the gift of the law to Israel, “his first-born son”. God is also called the Father of the king of Israel. Most especially he is “the Father of the poor”, of the orphaned and the widowed, who are under his loving protection.
3. The Liturgy Calls God “Father” - We believe what we pray. We pray what we believe. To tinker with the liturgy is always to tinker with what we actually believe.
4. The Catechism explains why we call God Father and how this includes the mothering attributes of God - By calling God “Father”, the language of faith indicates two main things: that God is the first origin of everything and transcendent authority; and that he is at the same time goodness and loving care for all his children. Of course God transcends the human distinction between the sexes, He is neither man nor woman: he is God.
5. Calling God “Mother” and “Father” is confusing - Our world is confused enough about gender right now. Calling God both Mother and Father makes God some kind of transgendered being. Nope.
6. Gender identification enables a loving relationship - Think about it. What I mean is that we relate to others through gender. I relate to my mother as her son. I relate to my brother as my brother. I relate to my daughter as her father. I am male. They are either male or female. I cannot have a true relationship with someone who is neither male nor female… God wants us to love him and be in relationship with him. That is why he reveals himself as “Father” and why Jesus commands us to call God “Father” so that we can relate to him as his sons and daughters. We cannot be in a loving relationship with an abstract being who is sometimes Mother and sometimes Father.

In other words we use male pronouns etc to describe God. But God has no human gender

 

[Darryl_Revok]

In other words we use male pronouns etc to describe God. But God has no human gender

Wouldn’t it be more logical to use a gender neutral pronoun, like “it”?

 

[JimmyG88]

Wouldn’t it be more logical to use a gender neutral pronoun, like “it”?

Probably not because we ‘see’ by using language

 

[Darryl_Revok]

Probably not because we ‘see’ by using language

So what are we supposed to “see” by using gendered pronouns to describe God?

 

[JimmyG88]

So what are we supposed to “see” by using gendered pronouns to describe God?

Your relationship with God is personal to you. I use gendered pronouns although I know that the nature of God is beyond my comprehension