Noah, the movie 2014

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The Watchers are meant to be representations of the Grigori, which are a type of angel. This “Noah” movie took some inspiration from the Book of Enoch. In Enoch, they are angels dispatched to earth to watch over mankind. There are wicked and righteous Watchers.

I am not sure why the film decided to depict them as “Transformers” style rock monsters, but their presence is inspired by the roles they play in Enoch. The director did not solely use the Bible as a reference point since the details regarding Noak and the Ark are fairly scarce in Genesis. So he looked to extra biblical sources to provide more detail for the film.
Yes The Watchers do come from the book of Enoch and the director put them into it because the Flood of Noah ties into the book of Enoch. The reason for the Flood was because of what the fallen angels did with mating with human women and creating giants and disturbing the natural order of the world and mankind that the book of Enoch talks about. So the director wrote that based on Genesis as well as the book of Enoch. 👍 I haven’t seen the movie but it sounds like it might be very interesting, I’ll have to check it out. 🙂

Like another poster mentioned, the world was pretty messed up worse than it is now for God to hit the reset button like that. As bad as the world is now, we don’t have half human and half fallen angel giants living among us like back then polluting the world with evil and messing up the human bloodline. The Flood was an act of mercy for mankind.
 
Yes The Watchers do come from the book of Enoch and the director put them into it because the Flood of Noah ties into the book of Enoch. The reason for the Flood was because of what the fallen angels did with mating with human women and creating giants and disturbing the natural order of the world and mankind that the book of Enoch talks about. So the director wrote that based on Genesis as well as the book of Enoch. 👍 I haven’t seen the movie but it sounds like it might be very interesting, I’ll have to check it out. 🙂

Like another poster mentioned, the world was pretty messed up worse than it is now for God to hit the reset button like that. As bad as the world is now, we don’t have half human and half fallen angel giants living among us like back then poluting the world with evil and messing up the human bloodline. The Flood was an act of mercy for mankind.
Cute pics on your page. The Book of Enoch is not found in my Bible.
 
They are meant to represent the Nephilim (giants), I think they just made them ‘rock people’ for a bit of extra CG effects.

I asked a very intelligent priest ( has a PHD), about the Nephilim once, he gave me a great explanation of them…in short, they were Satans first attempt at corrupting the human seed, so Jesus could not be born, back then, Satan went with brute force (giants), he would never do that today, as he doesnt want people to know what hes up to! In fact this is probably why we dont hear alot about the Nephilim, I went to catholic school up until 8th grade and I never heard them mentioned once??? Its just Satans efforts to fool people, trying to make them think the Nephilim were not real, or not real giants, etc. He is pretty sneaky!
Yes, the Nephelim were very real and I wish more would talk about them too. I noticed a lot of Christians like to try to deny that giants existed when the Bible clearly says there were giants on the earth back then. When you remove the existence of giants then the flood is taken out of context and is seen in a very different way than if you realize God was cleansing the earth of the giants and their seed and their presence which was polluting the world and mankind. The book of Enoch talks about how it was the giants that taught war and evil to mankind and taught mankind how to worship the stars and other gods etc. and taught them about vanity and all kinds of sins. The book of Enoch is identical to the Genesis account of the flood except the book of Enoch goes into more details about describing the Nephelim etc. I wish they would make a movie based off the book of Enoch! 🙂
 
Cute pics on your page. The Book of Enoch is not found in my Bible.
Thanks! 🙂

No, the book of Enoch is not in the Bible, The book of Enoch is one of the Pseudepigrapha books and was written during the first century before Jesus Christ, that goes into more detail of the flood of Noah but the Book of Enoch is quoted in the Bible in Jude 14.

. . . Behold, the Lord came with many thousands of His holy ones, to execute judgment upon all, and to convict all the ungodly of all their ungodly deeds which they have done in an ungodly way, and of all the harsh things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him. (NASB) Jude 14-15

. . . Behold, he will arrive with ten million of the holy ones in order to execute judgment upon all. He will destroy the wicked ones and censure all flesh on account of everything that they have done, that which the sinners and the wicked ones committed against him. - Enoch 1:9

Hebrews Chapter 11
  1. By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for BEFORE HIS TRANSLATION HE HAD THIS TESTIMONY, THAT HE PLEASED GOD.
Genesis Chapter 6
  1. There were GIANTS IN THE EARTH in those days; and also after that, when the SONS OF GOD CAME UNTO THE DAUGHTERS OF MEN, AND THEY BARE [CHILDREN] to them, the same [became] mighty men which [were] of old, men of renown.
  2. And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein [is] the breath of life, from under heaven; [and] every thing that [is] in the earth shall die.
The Book of Enoch: Chapter 7
  1. It happened after the sons of men had multiplied in those days, that daughters were born to them, elegant and beautiful.
  2. And when the angels, THE SONS OF HEAVEN, beheld them, they became enamoured of them, saying to each other, Come, let us select for ourselves wives from the progeny of men, and LET US BEGET CHILDREN.
  3. THEN THEY TOOK WIVES, each choosing for himself; whom they began to approach, and with whom they cohabited; teaching them sorcery, incantations, and the dividing of roots and trees.
  4. AND THE WOMEN conceiving BROUGHT FORTH GIANTS,
  5. Whose stature was each three hundred cubits. These devoured all which the labor of men produced; until it became impossible to feed them;
  6. When they turned themselves against men, in order to devour them;
  7. And began to injure birds, beasts, reptiles, and fishes, to eat their flesh one after another, and to drink their blood.
The Book of Enoch: Chapter 8
  1. And MEN, BEING DESTROYED, CRIED OUT; and their voice reached to heaven.
KJV: Genesis Chapter 6
  1. And, BEHOLD, I, even I, DO BRING A FLOOD waters upon the earth, TO DESTROY ALL FLESH, wherein [is] the breath of life, from under heaven; [and] every thing that [is] in the earth shall die.
 
Okay, some of us really ought to rethink our antipathy toward this film. Please consider watching Father Barron’s analysis or reading it here.
I lost all sympathy for Noah when he let that one poor girl die.
That was horrible indeed. I was mad, too.
It made God out to be an indiscriminate monster in his destruction.
Well, that’s utterly ridiculous to say. For one thing, God did not tell Noah to let that girl die; she could have been Ham’s wife had things played out differently.

For another, you can’t seriously whine about that scene “making God out to be an indiscriminate monster” and have no qualms about the rest of the Old Testament. You are aware that the Old Testament itself records God giving instructions far more horrific than “let a girl be trampled,” right? Such as not sparing any men, women, or children in certain attacks?

See, this is what I mean. Aronofsky’s film doesn’t whitewash the brutality of such stories (drowning every man, woman, and child on Earth?), and people flip out because they expect Noah to be nice. :rolleyes:

Old Testament patriarchs, prophets, and kings were often not nice. Frankly, I’d rather be trampled than drowned.
Besides this , all of Noah’s sons were married before they entered the Ark.
Doesn’t say that. It just says that Noah, his wife, his sons, and his sons’ wives were on the Ark.

Which they technically were in this film. It was a stretching of the text for Ham’s and Japheth’s wives to be in Ila’s womb, but not a contradiction.

I’m okay with that. It’s creative license that’s not thematically contrary to the source material.
The whole idea that humankind was meant to die out after Noah’s family was ridiculous, besides denying God’s promise to Adam and Eve that he would send a deliverer. It didn’t wash with me nor was it true to Scripture.
I agree. Even in the context of this film, Aronofsky’s Noah was mistaken, which was part of the point of his journey as a character. More on this below…
Sure, I can see Noah having some doubts about the future of humanity, but his “zero population growth” concept isn’t a godly one, it’s straight from the pits of hell.
Yes, and that’s part of the drama of the film. Look, no one ever said Noah was infallible. The Bible simply says he was “righteous in his generation.” Confronted with the terrible depravity that caused God to wipe out most of humanity, it’s perfectly understandable that he mistakenly believed none of them were supposed to survive.

What makes Aronofsky’s Noah “righteous” in the Biblical sense is that he never failed to seek and attempt to carry out God’s will, even if he was mistaken about what God’s will is through most of the movie.
As for his relenting and not killing his granddaughters, they played it as a failure to keep to God’s command to wipe out humanity.
Not exactly. Remember the last scene with Noah and Ila, in which she asserted that God left the choice in his hands?

The implication was - and this is a bit of a departure from the source material, sure - that God was leaving the ultimate decision in Noah’s hands.

If even someone as devoted to God as Noah couldn’t see the value of his own granddaughters, if even Noah could be so depraved that he would be willing to kill them, then there really would be no point in keeping humanity alive.

If, on the other hand, he could see the value of these children and let his love for them sway him, then that shows that there’s goodness in humanity that’s worth preserving.

The implication - and yes, this part was obviously not from the source material - was that God was implicitly leaving the final decision in Noah’s hands. When he found he could not kill his granddaughters because he loved them, that was Noah’s de facto decision: humanity lives on.

Ila helped him start to realize this near the end of the film.
The movie does send an underlying message; God is cruel,
God is no more cruel in Noah than He is in Genesis 6-9.
mankind will always be evil,
No. Noah’s final decision made it clear that humanity was worth saving.

Besides, you don’t think it’s appropriate to depict humanity as depraved in a story whose source material literally has God deciding to wipe out all but eight of us because we’re so evil?

Again, too many of us have a whitewashed, Sunday school version of this story in our heads. If a movie about Noah failed to make us think, “Wow, people are awful,” then it wouldn’t be fitting the source material, in which our terrible wickedness was indeed the cause of our near-total destruction.
 
Yes, the Nephelim were very real and I wish more would talk about them too. I noticed a lot of Christians like to try to deny that giants existed when the Bible clearly says there were giants on the earth back then. When you remove the existence of giants then the flood is taken out of context and is seen in a very different way than if you realize God was cleansing the earth of the giants and their seed and their presence which was polluting the world and mankind. The book of Enoch talks about how it was the giants that taught war and evil to mankind and taught mankind how to worship the stars and other gods etc. and taught them about vanity and all kinds of sins. The book of Enoch is identical to the Genesis account of the flood except the book of Enoch goes into more details about describing the Nephelim etc. I wish they would make a movie based off the book of Enoch! 🙂
I agree. the only thing I dont understand is why, if God created the flood to kill off all these beasts, why did he allow some to live, as the bible verse says, there were giants in those days AND after the flood…??? Why would some have survived? I dont think it ever went into how many actually survived, but if it were 2 or more, they could have continued their race!
 
Another thing that I dont understand about the Nephilim…

The bible says they were 300 cubits, this means they were 450 ft tall…??

I always believed they were more like 30-50 ft tall, 450 ft is pretty tall!!! LOL
 
The movie does send an underlying message; God is cruel, mankind will always be evil, parents don’t know anything, rebellious teens and their desires rule over all. That’s the entertaining message I pulled from it.:o
Interesting. I haven’t seen the film yet, but most of the people I’ve talked to who have seen it say exactly the opposite. They got a very pro-God and even pro-life message from the movie.

Funny how there can be so many different reactions and interpretations of the exact same film. Makes me want to see it now just to judge for myself.
 
Interesting. I haven’t seen the film yet, but most of the people I’ve talked to who have seen it say exactly the opposite. They got a very pro-God and even pro-life message from the movie.

Funny how there can be so many different reactions and interpretations of the exact same film. Makes me want to see it now just to judge for myself.
It’s all in the perspective of how you see life that makes each interpretation different;)
 
Another thing that I dont understand about the Nephilim…

The bible says they were 300 cubits, this means they were 450 ft tall…??

I always believed they were more like 30-50 ft tall, 450 ft is pretty tall!!! LOL
Where does it say that?
 
Okay, some of us really ought to rethink our antipathy toward this film.
I always see films with the desire to like it, but this wasn’t one I could like for the reasons I cited.
That was horrible indeed. I was mad, too.
Indeed, but why when many other innocents died too? It’s because Noah had a choice to make–to try to save her or not. He chose not to because he make a judgment about the state of her soul he had no right to make.
Well, that’s utterly ridiculous to say. For one thing, God did not tell Noah to let that girl die; she could have been Ham’s wife had things played out differently.
It’s precisely because God did not tell Noah to let the girl die that it flew in the face of God’s instructions to him. All through the film Noah ASSUMES God’s will instead of simply DOING God’s spoken will.
For another, you can’t seriously whine about that scene “making God out to be an indiscriminate monster” and have no qualms about the rest of the Old Testament. You are aware that the Old Testament itself records God giving instructions far more horrific than “let a girl be trampled,” right? Such as not sparing any men, women, or children in certain attacks?
I most certainly can complain (whine is a pegorative that doesn’t apply) that the scene made it appear that God was a monster because Noah had no orders to leave anyone in particular behind or to let anyone die. He was simply told to build an ark and bring the animals and his family on board. Again, he ASSUMED something God did not tell him to do. And as for God giving instructions for “horrific acts”–he didn’t do that. He ordered the destruction of pagan cultures because he brought judgment against them. We have to keep firmly in mind that this all took place before the age of grace when the Holy Spiirt would be poured out on all mankind through Christ’s redemption. In the OT judgment was swift, violent and sure and God was well within his rights to order it.

(continued next post…)
 
See, this is what I mean. Aronofsky’s film doesn’t whitewash the brutality of such stories (drowning every man, woman, and child on Earth?), and people flip out because they expect Noah to be nice. :rolleyes:
And I never claimed that Noah had to be “nice.” Rather in this version he went off on his own, making judgments calls he was not told to make. That’s the problem here.
Old Testament patriarchs, prophets, and kings were often not nice. Frankly, I’d rather be trampled than drowned.
Jesus often wasn’t “nice.” We are not called to be nice but to be loving, and love is a fierce thing not a soft, sweet emotion. Many bad things have been done in the name of niceness that never happen in the name of divine love.
Doesn’t say that. It just says that Noah, his wife, his sons, and his sons’ wives were on the Ark.
Yes, but there was no command from God to exclude any others who wished to come.
Which they technically were in this film. It was a stretching of the text for Ham’s and Japheth’s wives to be in Ila’s womb, but not a contradiction.
Stretching it to the point of the ridiculous, yes. And it was event no one knew if the unborn babies would be boys or girls, so this simply doesn’t work.
I’m okay with that. It’s creative license that’s not thematically contrary to the source material.
Me too. 🙂 I loved the LOTR movies even though Jackson strayed from pure Tolkien. But fudging Scripture stories can be dangerous because many don’t know the difference nor do they have a good enough grasp of theology to understand why the changes are so bad.
I agree. Even in the context of this film, Aronofsky’s Noah was mistaken, which was part of the point of his journey as a character. More on this below…
Fine, but the audience gets the impression that it is God who is ordering Noah to do things God never commanded him to do–to judge souls and to leap to assumptions about their fate…
Yes, and that’s part of the drama of the film. Look, no one ever said Noah was infallible. The Bible simply says he was “righteous in his generation.” Confronted with the terrible depravity that caused God to wipe out most of humanity, it’s perfectly understandable that he mistakenly believed none of them were supposed to survive.
But he should have erred on the side of mercy. A truly righteous person would do that.
What makes Aronofsky’s Noah “righteous” in the Biblical sense is that he never failed to seek and attempt to carry out God’s will, even if he was mistaken about what God’s will is through most of the movie.
A small case could be made for this point of view, but it’s a long stretch and doesn’t convince me or many others.
Not exactly. Remember the last scene with Noah and Ila, in which she asserted that God left the choice in his hands?
She said that, not Noah. He still thought he’d let God down.
The implication was - and this is a bit of a departure from the source material, sure - that God was leaving the ultimate decision in Noah’s hands.
Indeed, that was the implication. The movie is filled with implications with nothing to back it up except the filmmaker’s slant on the story.
If even someone as devoted to God as Noah couldn’t see the value of his own granddaughters, if even Noah could be so depraved that he would be willing to kill them, then there really would be no point in keeping humanity alive.
That’s the problem here. Noah was not devoted to God, rather this Noah was devoted to doing what he ASSUMED God wanted. God does not ask us to assume his will but to follow his will. This same line of reasoning didnt’ wash when King Saul used it. I doubt it would have with Noah, either.

(continued next post…)
 
FB:
If, on the other hand, he could see the value of these children and let his love for them sway him, then that shows that there’s goodness in humanity that’s worth preserving.
No, I’m afraid it doesn’t show that. It only shows that natural love is a natural thing. It says nothing at all about mankind’s worthiness or unworthiness to be preserved.
The implication - and yes, this part was obviously not from the source material - was that God was implicitly leaving the final decision in Noah’s hands. When he found he could not kill his granddaughters because he loved them, that was Noah’s de facto decision: humanity lives on.
Again, God didn’t do that, so it leaves the WRONG impression on the audience.
Ila helped him start to realize this near the end of the film.
She certainly attempted to do that. It’s not made clear that she succeeded.
God is no more cruel in Noah than He is in Genesis 6-9.
Indeed he isn’t. It’s Noah who was cruel, not God according to the film. Besides this, God is never cruel in his judgements or actions. He has the sovereign right to judge mankind. That he withholds his judgement in our days is thanks to the redemptive work of Christ.
No. Noah’s final decision made it clear that humanity was worth saving.
No, it doesn’t show that at all. It only shows what I cited above–that Noah had a natural love for his grandchildren, which is fine, but it’s not enough to show that mankind is worth saving.
Besides, you don’t think it’s appropriate to depict humanity as depraved in a story whose source material literally has God deciding to wipe out all but eight of us because we’re so evil?
I never made that claim, so I don’t know where you are getting that idea. 🤷
Again, too many of us have a whitewashed, Sunday school version of this story in our heads. If a movie about Noah failed to make us think, “Wow, people are awful,” then it wouldn’t be fitting the source material, in which our terrible wickedness was indeed the cause of our near-total destruction.
If people have a whitewashed version of Noah’s story in their heads that is the result of poor catechises. That tells us nothing at all about whether or not “our terrible wickedness was indeed the cause of our near-total destruction.” I certainly learned in Sunday School that mankind had become so wicked that God decided to destroy all but Noah’s family. The teacher didn’t go into the kind of details that wouldn’t be suitable for young children. I never heard any other version but then I was brought up in the 50’s not the 70’s and onwards. I pity our children if they aren’t being told the truth in order to keep the less pleasant aspects of human nature from them.
 
Where does it say that?
Yeah, I was wondering that too. There are only two references to the Nephilim in the Bible, one in Genesis 6 and one in Numbers 13, and neither of those mention their actual size.
 
Yeah, I was wondering that too. There are only two references to the Nephilim in the Bible, one in Genesis 6 and one in Numbers 13, and neither of those mention their actual size.
not sure of the actual verse, but there is one that states that mankind is but a grasshopper compared to the Nephilim, its not word for word, but thats the ‘jist’ of the verse. anyone know which one im talking about?

Not in the bible, but Enoch does go into detail about their size, although Im still not sure they are literally 450 ft tall, I tend to think they were closer to 25-50 ft, but who knows, maybe they were that tall, it would make man look like grasshoppers in their eyes!
 
not sure of the actual verse, but there is one that states that mankind is but a grasshopper compared to the Nephilim, its not word for word, but thats the ‘jist’ of the verse. anyone know which one im talking about?

Not in the bible, but Enoch does go into detail about their size, although Im still not sure they are literally 450 ft tall, I tend to think they were closer to 25-50 ft, but who knows, maybe they were that tall, it would make man look like grasshoppers in their eyes!
Looking up the word grasshopper in the RSV search I found this:

Num.13[33] And there we saw the Nephilim (the sons of Anak, who come from the Nephilim); and we seemed to ourselves like grasshoppers, and so we seemed to them."

It might be a good starting point if you wish to pursue this line of inquiry. 🙂
 
I just finished watching this movie with Russell Crowe and Sir Anthony Hopkins and I was curious as the creatures called the Watchers. I missed the first 15 minutes of the show and these interesting creatures played a great roll in this cinematic show. I don’t recall reading of these creatures in the biblical story of Noah. Would have these creatures truly existed or was it a directors creative addition, I thought?
The Watchers are taken from Jewish apocrypha, specifically 1 and 2 Enoch, as well as the Book of Jubilees. They are by no means creative license or inventions of the director. According to the apocrypha, they indeed played significant roles in the days of Noah, and were the creatures who mated with human women, resulting in the Nephilim.

It has also been theorized that the Watchers are the “spirits in prison” to whom Jesus preached in 1 Peter 3:18ff.
 
I agree. the only thing I dont understand is why, if God created the flood to kill off all these beasts, why did he allow some to live, as the bible verse says, there were giants in those days AND after the flood…??? Why would some have survived? I dont think it ever went into how many actually survived, but if it were 2 or more, they could have continued their race!
I believe God’s purpose was to kill them off so that there wasn’t so many like before and He did that. Even though some found a way to escape, their number was cut down almost to nothing and so was their rule over mankind. He cut their numbers down enough to where what few survived dwindled down to nothing then they disappeared completely. So the flood did the job or else they would still be here today. 👍
 
I believe God’s purpose was to kill them off so that there wasn’t so many like before and He did that. Even though some found a way to escape, their number was cut down almost to nothing and so was their rule over mankind. He cut their numbers down enough to where what few survived dwindled down to nothing then they disappeared completely. So the flood did the job or else they would still be here today. 👍
Yes, that does make sense, but strange that a flood sent by God for the very purpose of killing these things off, would not succeed in killing ALL of them.

I also wonder about how they will return, since the bible clearly tells us the end times will be like the days of Noah, and the nephilim will be around again…So Satan must have something up his sleeve in order to get these things going again, but as the senior priest at my parish told me, the nephilim that appear in the end times may not be actual giants, like they were back then, he said satan can try a number of things in order to corrupt the human seed, maybe this time, we wont even recognize them if we pass them on the street?!

Ive pondered whether the whole alien abduction events are nothing more than Satan trying to work some evil plan, if his demons are actually what we are calling aliens from another world, and they are abducting people and then returning them to society, they are clearly doing something to them in this time…I think this is the key to what is going on (if this is really what the alien abductions are)
 
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