Nobody goes to Hell if they don't want to?

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yellow8yellowM

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I have heard it said that “nobody goes to Hell if they don’t want to”, or if they love God they will go to Heaven. Obviously this is an oversimplification of the matter, but sometimes I think it confuses people.

For example, many otherwise devout Catholics take birth control. They pray the Rosary sometimes, go to Mass regularly, and do not commit a single other grave sin. How do you reconcile their love for God with their sinning? Is it simply a delusion or self-denial or can these people legitimately believe the above quote and continue to sin?
 
In my experience, most people are completely oblivious to the gravity of sin. Also, our culture (American) has a very warped view of what it is to be a “good person”.
The American view (IMHO) is that a good person is anyone who does not harm others.
That is not a good person, that is a neutral person, and to quote Jesus “since you are neither warm nor cold, I shall spit you out of my mouth”. God expects you to actually do some good works, not just be harmless.

As to Hell, whether the aprticular person “wants to go” or not is irrelevant. Do they actually love God? If you love Him, do what He says.

Jesus’ last message for the world was “I am your peace, follow my commandments.”
 
yellow8yellowM said:
I have heard it said that “nobody goes to Hell if they don’t want to”, or if they love God they will go to Heaven. Obviously this is an oversimplification of the matter, but sometimes I think it confuses people.

For example, many otherwise devout Catholics take birth control. They pray the Rosary sometimes, go to Mass regularly, and do not commit a single other grave sin. How do you reconcile their love for God with their sinning? Is it simply a delusion or self-denial or can these people legitimately believe the above quote and continue to sin?
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Jimmy Akin did a good thing on this, you can watch the video here.
 
I don’t know if people agree, but I think society has gotten squishy on the concept of hell and mortal sin. And I largely blame relativism for this change. I have heard from people I thought were “good” Catholics all sorts of justification for missing mass, supporting Planned Parenthood, endorsing the SSA lifestyle (including marriage), to name a few. Most of the reasoning goes like this: The God I know or love would not let these things occur (fill in the blank with whatever you want).

I have been told to “get real” when I choose to follow all doctrine of the Church. I get everything from “your thinking is out of date” to “don’t worry, God will forgive you.” I usually politely answer: I have one shot getting to Heaven, and I trust 2000 yrs of inspired wisdom.

Finally, I think our priests need to emphasize the Sacrament of Reconciliation far more than is currently done. However, I have noticed an uptick in people going to Cofession.
 
90Domer said:
I don’t know if people agree, but I think society has gotten squishy on the concept of hell and mortal sin. And I largely blame relativism for this change. I have heard from people I thought were “good” Catholics all sorts of justification for missing mass, supporting Planned Parenthood, endorsing the SSA lifestyle (including marriage), to name a few. Most of the reasoning goes like this: The God I know or love would not let these things occur (fill in the blank with whatever you want).

I have been in many similar conversations and I think that this is just the start of a crisis in the Catholic Church.
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Christ put it very simply - perhaps this would be considered an oversimplification too, if He hadn’t said it: “if you love me, you’ll keep my commandments.”

Period.

An “otherwise devout Catholic” who is fully knowledgeable about the sinfulness of birth control and deliberately consents to it is committing a mortal sin. Someone committing a mortal sin is not under the shield of ignorance - and someone committing a mortal sin cannot at once love and not love God. So, fairly simply, under these specific circumstances, the person loves self more than God. And it is impossible for them not to commit any other grave sins.

If this person, on the other hand, ignores the sinfulness of the act, then he is, if anything, guilty of not finding out something so important (since moral diligence to defeat vincible ignorance is possible and obligatory), but probably is not deprived of sanctifying grace (given the absence of full knowledge and deliberate consent, though this is matter for the confessor to discern), and is perhaps disposed to the sacrifice of a radical change and giving up what is now known to be not in accordance with God’s will.

Regarding the original quote, then, we see it does confuse people because it’s not accurate. The right thing would be: “nobody goes to Hell without knowing that they are.” Because full knowledge of sinfulness and deliberate consent are the “prerequisites” to lose sanctifying grace, and someone who knows he’s sinning mortally and doesn’t repent literally knows he’s headed to the state of hell.
 
yellow8yellowM said:
I have heard it said that “nobody goes to Hell if they don’t want to”, or if they love God they will go to Heaven. Obviously this is an oversimplification of the matter, but sometimes I think it confuses people.

For example, many otherwise** devout Catholics take birth control**. They pray the Rosary sometimes, go to Mass regularly, and do not commit a single other grave sin. How do you reconcile their love for God with their sinning? Is it simply a delusion or self-denial or can these people legitimately believe the above quote and continue to sin?
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That’s a contradiction. Anyone who is a devout Catholic will not take birth control. You are either devout or not. You cannot be partly devout.
 
That is why the author of that post said “otherwise devout”. I think he/she meant to imply that these Catholics would be considered devout if they did not use birth control.
 
I’ve often heard the sentiment ‘that a good God wouldn’t send anyone to hell’; thereby giving them the excuse to live in any way they chose.

sigh.
 
yellow8yellowM said:
I have heard it said that “nobody goes to Hell if they don’t want to”, or if they love God they will go to Heaven. Obviously this is an oversimplification of the matter, but sometimes I think it confuses people.
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Perhaps it is better to say that “nobody goes to Hell if they don’t *choose *to”.

Naturally, no one *wants *to go to hell, but people can *choose *to reject God, thereby choosing hell.
yellow8yellowM said:
For example, many otherwise devout Catholics take birth control. They pray the Rosary sometimes, go to Mass regularly, and do not commit a single other grave sin. How do you reconcile their love for God with their sinning? Is it simply a delusion or self-denial or can these people legitimately believe the above quote and continue to sin?
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If they are properly catechises, therein knowing that ABC is grave matter, and choose to do so anyway, then they certainly make a choice that is dangerous to their eternal souls. God will judge them with regard to their knowledge and free choice in the matter. It is possible, however unlikely some will argue, that for any given Catholic who uses ABC their sins are insufficient in either of these areas and thus not mortal sins.
 
yellow8yellowM said:
I have heard it said that “nobody goes to Hell if they don’t want to”, or if they love God they will go to Heaven. Obviously this is an oversimplification of the matter, but sometimes I think it confuses people.

For example, many otherwise devout Catholics take birth control. They pray the Rosary sometimes, go to Mass regularly, and do not commit a single other grave sin. How do you reconcile their love for God with their sinning? Is it simply a delusion or self-denial or can these people legitimately believe the above quote and continue to sin?
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St_Hilary:
again, you place your state of being in heaven or hell. If you are using birth control pills you knkow it is wrong, so what do you expect?

If you are dying, there is so sin that God cannot forgive, so in your confession mentionn of your birth control, but I would stop usiong it ow because you never know the hour or day that God is gong call you to his eternal home.

God bless you
 
90Domer said:
I don’t know if people agree, but I think society has gotten squishy on the concept of hell and mortal sin. And I largely blame relativism for this change. I have heard from people I thought were “good” Catholics all sorts of justification for missing mass, supporting Planned Parenthood, endorsing the SSA lifestyle (including marriage), to name a few. Most of the reasoning goes like this: The God I know or love would not let these things occur (fill in the blank with whatever you want).

I have been told to “get real” when I choose to follow all doctrine of the Church. I get everything from “your thinking is out of date” to “don’t worry, God will forgive you.” I usually politely answer: I have one shot getting to Heaven, and I trust 2000 yrs of inspired wisdom.

Finally, I think our priests need to emphasize the Sacrament of Reconciliation far more than is currently done. However, I have noticed an uptick in people going to Cofession.
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Very good answer and accurate description of what we as Catholics are up against these days. 👍 I especially like your 2nd paragraph and I’m like you, I don’t choose to gamble when what’s at stake is my eternal soul, and my destination “smoking or non-smoking” 😉 . Now there are those who would make fun of me and call me an ignorant unthinking sheep or a coward or something for taking that position. Sticks and stones. They aren’t the ones I’m going to have to answer to.
 
yellow8yellowM said:
I have heard it said that “nobody goes to Hell if they don’t want to”, or if they love God they will go to Heaven. Obviously this is an oversimplification of the matter, but sometimes I think it confuses people.

For example, many otherwise devout Catholics take birth control. They pray the Rosary sometimes, go to Mass regularly, and do not commit a single other grave sin. How do you reconcile their love for God with their sinning? Is it simply a delusion or self-denial or can these people legitimately believe the above quote and continue to sin?
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It could be any of those things, or other things. You’re asking us to do the impossible – not only to peer into the soul of another, but to peer into the soul of an imaginary other.
 
If someone does not want to go to Hell then they will join the Catholic Church if they have learned that it is Christ’s Church. They will also obey the Church’s teachings which are God’s commands to the best of their ability and they will strive to always be in a state of grace. If one does those things and they die in a state of grace then they will go to Heaven.
 
If we go to hell, I think it will be something we neglected to do or just defaulted to doing nothing. We know that when a person gets old and down, their mind doesn’t work well and it dosen’t occur to them what they need to do. So the default is because of this condition forgetfullness to take care of matters. The same would hold for those sick. They feel very lathargic and inept, and don’t care at that moment to do anything or spend any effort.

This is where we can provide for our loved ones the spiritual care they need. To whisper in their ear the act of contrition and to call in the priest to give them the anointing of the sick. And as a group, to pray aloud the rosary so they hear the prayers and will be moved in thought.

Just a thought.
 
The thing about sin is that we are very good at self-deception, convincing ourselves that things are good, or not as bad, as they really are. So with something like birth control: we’ve convinced ourselves as a culture that it’s OK, or at worst a minor sin.

This is why we need the Church–to provide us with an objective teaching on what is right and good, versus what is wrong and evil. If we fail to use that help, we are asking for trouble. A Catholic who only has one sin, especially one which they have access to correct teaching, if they disregard that teaching, can we really call them faithful to God? No.

What of a person who is upright and moral in every way, but who steals? Would the courts say, “Well, he’s really a good person, we shouldn’t send him to prison just because he takes things”? No–he’s guilty of this crime, and so is a criminal, despite the thousands of laws he has not broken.

To reject one commandment is a sin, and needs repentance.
 
So, if someone in their heart disagrees with the Church’s position on contraception being a sin, and uses, it, but otherwise is an upstanding Catholic, what is the state of their soul? Or is that something only God can answer?
 
It only takes one.

I don’t want to come across as having no shred of kindness in me, but unfortunately that is the way it is. I wish it were different and if I said such it would be my religion of my invention.

On the good side, I don’t know of anyone who is stuck on one sin and good at every other part of their life. It just dosen’t seem very likely. I think indifference is something like a sickness that is spread thuout the organs. Or at least makes the whole body sick.

I wish I could minimize one serious sin and say everything will be all right. But I know that isn’t true, the person has died supernaturally and the life of Jesus in the soul died.
It is like blowing out a candle, it only takes one breath to do it. And the spirit leaves.

Just a thought.
 
So basically you’re implying…

Hitler: I wound up in hell because I was responsible for the death of millions of people. What did you do?
99% Catholic: I had sex with my wife using a condom

I’m sorry, but if that’s the limit of God’s compassion, that’s beyond stupid.
 
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