Non Catholic Absolution of Mortal Sins?

[Jon_S_1]

I read this earlier, but have not yet responded. It deserves an answer. Too often we say “these are the rules” without explaining the “why” of things.

The reason is that Confession (specifically absolution) reconciles us to both God and the Church. Think about the “and the Church” part. In order to be reconciles to anything, that is, in order to be brought back into good standing with any organization, community, or even person, one must first be united to the other. If I’m a member of the Raccoon Lodge, but fail to attend mandatory meetings, I’m no longer a member in good standing. In order to be returned to full status, I have to make good what was lacking before. I can have my membership re-instated and be brought back to full membership. But realize this: I cannot be restored to membership unless I was a member in the first place.

Sin separates us from the Church, to a greater or lesser degree depending upon the severity of the sin. A very minor sin separates us, but only a little. A very serious sin separates us more so. Absolution then restores us to full Communion (as much or as little as is needed).

Since non-Catholics are not first full members of the Church, they cannot be restored to a state which they never had in the first place. Only after being received into the Church as full members can they be in need of restoration. That’s the reason why absolution is only possible for Catholics.

I hope that can address your concerns.

Now for some rambling thoughts…

The already-baptized go to Confession as one of the final stages before being received into the Church. This is a necessary exception. Frankly, there is a contradiction between the theology of absolution (what I wrote above) and the necessity of being absolved before First Communion and Confirmation.

The actual way that RCIA for the already baptized was designed (and this is still the Church’s current norm of law) so that a person would be received into the Church but NOT at the Easter Vigil Mass. This is a practice that developed in recent years—to combine the non-baptized with the previously-baptized. Once we started that, it opened new problems. The previously-baptized should actually FIRST be received into the Church, THEN go to first Confession THEN receive First Communion and Confirmation. Most people don’t realize it, but the practice of receiving adults into the Church is still reserved to the bishop, and only by special delegation from the bishop may pastors receive them. The way we often see it is not the intended way, it’s only done by special permission.

Thanks for all the info Father. It helps a lot and makes sense.

Do you think one can be absolved of sin in the confessional separate from being reconciled with the Catholic Church ?

If someone came to your confessional seeking forgiveness of sin and told you they were baptized outside the church, how would you handle such a situation?

Thanks!

 

[Publisher]

Thanks and praise to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ I, nor anyone else need an “official” ecclesial communities pronouncement of my absolution…it is a free gift of God through Christ…no “official” pronouncement needed.

 

[JonNC]

Thanks and praise to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ I, nor anyone else need an “official” ecclesial communities pronouncement of my absolution…it is a free gift of God through Christ…no “official” pronouncement needed.

You’re welcome to hold that view. As for me, I find great comfort in the announcement of the Gospel, and that of absolution by my pastor, who by his ordination, speak in persona christi: “As a called and ordained servant of Christ and by His authority, I therefore forgive you all of your sins, in the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit. Amen”



Jon

 

[Jon_S_1]

Thanks and praise to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ I, nor anyone else need an “official” ecclesial communities pronouncement of my absolution…it is a free gift of God through Christ…no “official” pronouncement needed.

I held that view for 30 years. Let me tell you there is nothing more healing than the Sacrament of Reconciliation. I had sins that bothered me despite praying for forgiveness many times. Did Christ forgive me for those things, yes I am confident he did. Did I forgive myself? Did I truly feel reconciled with God? Did I truly lay down my cross and let him carry it?

No…not until I participated in the Sacrament.

I have done a lot of apologetic study seeking truth and pursuing Catholicism and accepting it intellectually.

Nothing proved it’s truth to me more than the tremendous Grace and power of the Holy Spirit felt in the confessional when absolution is given.

It was something like I have never felt before. In all my years as an evangelical I had plenty if emotional experiences…this was something far greater.

I wish you could experience it…it’s beyond description.

 

[Publisher]

I held that view for 30 years. Let me tell you there is nothing more healing than the Sacrament of Reconciliation. I had sins that bothered me despite praying for forgiveness many times. Did Christ forgive me for those things, yes I am confident he did. Did I forgive myself? Did I truly feel reconciled with God? Did I truly lay down my cross and let him carry it?

No…not until I participated in the Sacrament.
I
I have done a lot of apologetic study seeking truth and pursuing Catholicism and accepting it intellectually.

Nothing proved it’s truth to me more than the tremendous Grace and power of the Holy Spirit felt in the confessional when absolution is given.

It was something like I have never felt before. In all my years as an evangelical I had plenty if emotional experiences…this was something far greater.

I wish you could experience it…it’s beyond description.

I rejoice with you friend concerning your own absolution and the profundity you experience when your brother pronounces it.

I too am profoundly moved each First Day as I await expectantly and experience the Risen Christ in our midst as He give comfort, mercy and absolution as we worship and minister to one another as priests who share in His Priesthood as we sometime are called to offer vocal ministry to one another.

The healing forgiving and redeeming Presence in our midst as we share in His Spirit. Ministry to us…it is beyond description…but I believe you too know the depth of His love that has absolved us from sin and the work He undertakes to make us each day more like Him.

 

[FrDavid96]

Thanks for all the info Father. It helps a lot and makes sense.

Do you think one can be absolved of sin in the confessional separate from being reconciled with the Catholic Church ?

No. By definition, absolution reconciles us to God and the Church. So there’s no absolution without being reconciled to the Church.

If someone came to your confessional seeking forgiveness of sin and told you they were baptized outside the church, how would you handle such a situation?

Thanks!

Hypotheticals are always hard to answer. One thing I would have to do is to explain that only Catholics can participate in the Sacrament of Confession. I would offer to pray for and with the person. I would invite the person to become Catholic. Of course, these are just short answers. The actual conversation would involve much more than that. I’m just addressing the main points.

Right now, we’re less than 2 weeks away from Easter. That means that it’s possible that someone in that situation might be preparing for reception into the Church. That would change things, since such a person can indeed participate in Confession. Of course, I’d add some words of encouragement and welcoming.

 

[grandfather]

Thanks and praise to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ I, nor anyone else need an “official” ecclesial communities pronouncement of my absolution…it is a free gift of God through Christ…no “official” pronouncement needed.

People trying to convince themselves that what they want to be true is true can find many ways to tell themselves why what they believe is so.

We can not know what certain things are like unless we experience them. A woman can imagine what it is like to give birth to a baby, but until she does she does not know the physical, emotional experience.

You have no idea, no concept of what the experience of confessing your sins sacramentally and being absolved is.

I can do what you do and know what the experience is. I can recognize my sinfulness and pray for mercy. I know the experience.

You do not know what the experience of making a confession is. You can’t know it. We can describe it and that might help you know what it is like, but you still will not know it.

Maybe a physical analogy can help. Imagine you had a backpack on filled with a forty pound stone. Everywhere you go it is there. You might even get used to it, because it is always there. You sleep with it, shower with it, carry it to work, eat with it.

Suddenly the burden is taken away. You have never felt so light and free.

I can and do do what you do. It does not take the burden away. Tell yourself whatever you want to believe about what you need or don’t need. You just do not understand not having known the experience.

Additionally, the sacramental grace received strengthens us to avoid the sin again.

 

[Publisher]

People trying to convince themselves that what they want to be true is true can find many ways to tell themselves why what they believe is so.

We can not know what certain things are like unless we experience them. A woman can imagine what it is like to give birth to a baby, but until she does she does not know the physical, emotional experience.

You have no idea, no concept of what the experience of confessing your sins sacramentally and being absolved is.

I can do what you do and know what the experience is. I can recognize my sinfulness and pray for mercy. I know the experience.

You do not know what the experience of making a confession is. You can’t know it. We can describe it and that might help you know what it is like, but you still will not know it.

Maybe a physical analogy can help. Imagine you had a backpack on filled with a forty pound stone. Everywhere you go it is there. You might even get used to it, because it is always there. You sleep with it, shower with it, carry it to work, eat with it.

Suddenly the burden is taken away. You have negver felt so light and free.

I can and do do what you do. It does not take the burden away. Tell yourself whatever you want to believe about what you need or don’t need. You just do not understand not having known the experience.

Additionally, the sacramental grace received strengthens us to avoid the sin again.

I agree, one has a difficult time explaining some things that are experienced.

This IS the Quaker position…we believe in an experiential faith, and placing ones faith in the Risen Christ who in our midst cleanses and forgives and absolves sin and cleanses the soul from sin…an amazing experience to feel and know one is clean and absolved of our sins…because the Risen Christ our High Priest pronounces absolution and we who are gathered in His Name affirm His cleansing Spirit that indwells us.

 

[grandfather]

I agree, one has a difficult time explaining some things that are experienced.

This IS the Quaker position…we believe in an experiential faith, and placing ones faith in the Risen Christ who in our midst cleanses and forgives and absolves sin and cleanses the soul from sin…an amazing experience to feel and know one is clean and absolved of our sins…because the Risen Christ our High Priest pronounces absolution and we who are gathered in His Name affirm His cleansing Spirit that indwells us.

Scripture tells us Jesus gave the power to forgive or hold bound the sins of everyone. We have His own words. The power was given to living men. These men can not forgive your sins unless they know what they are. They can’t know what they are unless you tell them. They can tell you your sins are forgiven or you can try to tell and convince yourself. Only God can forgive sins. He tells men what they bind on earth He binds in heaven. You are rejecting scripture and this power given to the Church by Jesus when you insist you do not need it. To make matters worse for yourself you are trying to convince others they don’t need it.

 

[Publisher]

Scripture tells us Jesus gave the power to forgive or hold bound the sins of everyone. We have His own words. The power was given to living men. These men can not forgive your sins unless they know what they are. They can’t know what they are unless you tell them. They can tell you your sins are forgiven or you can try to tell and convince yourself. Only God can forgive sins. He tells men what they bind on earth He binds in heaven. You are rejecting scripture and this power given to the Church by Jesus when you insist you do not need it. To make matters worse for yourself you are trying to convince others they don’t need it.

Friend I understand your position, it is part of your religious beliefs as espoused by your faith community.

I do not hold your faith traditions, so I’m not sure how it “makes matters worse”…for myself or others, I am not part of your faith tradition…so why would I “teach” something contrary to my own tradition?

As a Friend, I share in the priesthood of all believers…and when something serious occurs that I need “clearness”, I have access to some “weighty Friends” who can listen to my concerns…my “confession” if you will…and offer advice and “clearness” as we pray and seek the will of God on any matter, including the issue of “sin”.

With Paul I can say…“For I KNOW WHOM I have believed and am convinced that He is able to keep what I have committed to him against that day.”

He is able to keep what I’ve committed to Him…He is Keeper and I am Kept.

 

[FathersKnowBest]

As a Friend, I share in the priesthood of all believers

This, unfortunately, is a priesthood without the authority to definitively forgive sins* in persona Christi* (among other things).

This authority was given by Christ to be passed down by the laying on of hands from bishop to bishop or priest in perpetuity.

Currently, this authority is only to be found in the Catholic Church and some Orthodox Churches.

 

[grandfather]

Friend I understand your position, it is part of your religious beliefs as espoused by your faith community.

I do not hold your faith traditions, so I’m not sure how it “makes matters worse”…for myself or others, I am not part of your faith tradition…so why would I “teach” something contrary to my own tradition?

As a Friend, I share in the priesthood of all believers…and when something serious occurs that I need “clearness”, I have access to some “weighty Friends” who can listen to my concerns…my “confession” if you will…and offer advice and “clearness” as we pray and seek the will of God on any matter, including the issue of “sin”.

With Paul I can say…“For I KNOW WHOM I have believed and am convinced that He is able to keep what I have committed to him against that day.”

He is able to keep what I’ve committed to Him…He is Keeper and I am Kept.

Take a look at your first post. There is a discussion between Catholics. You step in and tell them essentially you know their faith is in error. You have it all figured out and the ancient doctrines of the Church and promises made to her by Jesus, who also promised to lead His Church into all truth for all time, as taken from scripture are wrong.

I understand what the claims of Quakers are regarding remittance of sin. It is essentially the same as the rest of Protestant denominations and nondenominations. My wife is from a Quaker family. She now knows the grace of sacramental confession.

I understand what your position is. It denies the role of the Church in God’s dispensation of mercy as clearly explicated in scripture by Jesus. You may or my not need clearness. You definitely need mercy. Your weighty friends may be able to offer you their best advice, but they can not absolve you, take away your guilt.

In the gospel reading from the Mass today Jesus tells the Pharisees they will die in their sins. He is telling them they are going to hell. You do not want to die in your sins. We do not want to die in our sins.

 

[Taurks]

This, unfortunately, is a priesthood without the authority to definitively forgive sins* in persona Christi* (among other things).

This authority was given by Christ to be passed down by the laying on of hands from bishop to bishop or priest in perpetuity.

Currently, this authority is only to be found in the Catholic Church and some Orthodox Churches.

All Orthodox Churches.

 

[Publisher]

Take a look at your first post. There is a discussion between Catholics. You step in and tell them essentially you know their faith is in error. You have it all figured out and the ancient doctrines of the Church and promises made to her by Jesus, who also promised to lead His Church into all truth for all time, as taken from scripture are wrong.

I understand what the claims of Quakers are regarding remittance of sin. It is essentially the same as the rest of Protestant denominations and nondenominations. My wife is from a Quaker family. She now knows the grace of sacramental confession.

I understand what your position is. It denies the role of the Church in God’s dispensation of mercy as clearly explicated in scripture by Jesus. You may or my not need clearness. You definitely need mercy. Your weighty friends may be able to offer you their best advice, but they can not absolve you, take away your guilt.

In the gospel reading from the Mass today Jesus tells the Pharisees they will die in their sins. He is telling them they are going to hell. You do not want to die in your sins. We do not want to die in our sins.

Than you for your concern friend. I am confident in the work of Christ through the Holy Spirit and have the assurance my sins are forgiven and that Work He began in me some 40 odd years ago will be completed on That Day.

If the discussion was for Catholics only…why is it in NonCathllic religions?

Curiouser and curiouser it seems.

 

[Vico]

I am a Catholic who is dating a non Catholic, she has decided to go through RCIA courses; however, we will not enroll until next year for it. We’ve talked Catechism many times, and she understands what is a mortal sin, what makes one, and what sins are included within. We have both committed mortal sins, but I can receive confession. How am I supposed to help her receive absolution? What does the Church teach in this instance? Does she have to wait until she is initiated?

Thanks for all the help!

In addition to what others have posted:

Catechism of the Catholic Church1452 When it arises from a love by which God is loved above all else, contrition is called “perfect” (contrition of charity). Such contrition remits venial sins; it also obtains forgiveness of mortal sins if it includes the firm resolution to have recourse to sacramental confession as soon as possible. 51

51 Cf. Council of Trent (1551): DS 1677.

 

[Publisher]

Take a look at your first post. There is a discussion between Catholics. You step in and tell them essentially you know their faith is in error. You have it all figured out and the ancient doctrines of the Church and promises made to her by Jesus, who also promised to lead His Church into all truth for all time, as taken from scripture are wrong.
.

Oh, also I’m surprised you would not think a non-Catholic in the non- Catholic forum would just sit quietly in the corner and not say anything when “we” are being talked about " while we’re all in the same room where we can hear you Catholics discuss " ain’t it awe cul" Protestants can’t be absolved and the same euphemisms of “in danger of our mortal souls” when we see no reason to go outside our own traditions to seek out a man who’s religious institution validates his ability to remit or bind other people’s sins…the Quaker belief…and most Protestants for that matter do not believe your priests have any such authority or powers to do so…especially since as “Protestants” we have direct and unmediated access to the Father.

Then to suggest I or anyone else in the Non-Catholic section shouldn’t speak as “we” are being discussed “among yourselves” as though “we’re not even in the room”…

Interesting indeed.

 

[FathersKnowBest]

we see no reason to go outside our own traditions to seek out a man who’s religious institution validates his ability to remit or bind other people’s sins.

That would be Jesus Christ who validates his ability to remit or bind other people’s sins.
I guess you could consider Him part of our “religious institution” since it is He who founded our Church, but it is a rather large understatment.

…the Quaker belief…and most Protestants for that matter

I.e. “man-made” beliefs which make null the Word of God.

do not believe your priests have any such authority or powers to do so…

Despite the scriptures. Hmmm …

 

[smichhertz]

I am a Catholic who is dating a non Catholic, she has decided to go through RCIA courses; however, we will not enroll until next year for it. We’ve talked Catechism many times, and she understands what is a mortal sin, what makes one, and what sins are included within. We have both committed mortal sins, but I can receive confession. How am I supposed to help her receive absolution? What does the Church teach in this instance? Does she have to wait until she is initiated?

Thanks for all the help!

Hi truthSeeker319,

This is from the Catholic perspective (just FYI).

She should pray a fervent Act of Contrition. Because Confession and Communion are not options, she should probably do a daily examination of conscience followed by an act of contrition.

When she’s accepted into the Church, then she can participate in the sacrament of confession!