Some theorists have proposed that near-death experiences are an illusion. Often the case is that the brain may still be active even when the heart stops (“death”), even if ever so faintly. Another idea is that the time of acctual “death” and the “out-of-body experience” are discrepant: what seems to’ve been an out-of-body experience while dead is accutally an in-body experience which approximated the time of “death” (or rather, the heart stopping).I’ve read about people who have had near-death experiences. They talk about seeing themselves on the operating table, feeling a great sense of peace, etc. I’m wondering, have there been any documented cases of a non-Catholic having a near death experience that has caused them to convert to Catholicism? If so, do they explain what part of the experience caused them to convert (seeing Jesus, seeing Heaven, etc.)?
One has to wonder how these same ‘some theorists’ like to pontificate over the ‘hogwash’ lives of the Saints.Some theorists have proposed that . . .
One doesn’t have to wonder too heavily. Ideas about God and all that seem merely to not reflect the rest of the physical universe. God and science are two different explanations regarding the same wordly phenomena. When an idea actually contradicts science, we chuck it out (like near-death experiences which have a better explanation at hand than the ones that all walks of attention-grabbing, new-age gurus have extoled). Besides, what makes us so certain that we have the kind of autonomy in death that would even allow us to whimsically hang about our own dead bodies? I’m just warning against the efficacy of these claims - I wouldn’t make them any small portion of my faith or reasoning.One has to wonder how these same ‘some theorists’ like to pontificate over the ‘hogwash’ lives of the Saints.
I’m not sure what is so “worldly” about near-death experiences, or how ideas about a transcendent and immanent infinite God should reflect the dull physical universe. Is seeing God supposed to be a “worldly phenonenon” to Christians? How do these “some theorists” try to explain away what happened to Saint Paul on the road to Damascus? Indigestion or “illusion” and “hogwash”?One doesn’t have to wonder too heavily. Ideas about God and all that seem merely to not reflect the rest of the physical universe. God and science are two different explanations regarding the same wordly phenomena. When an idea actually contradicts science, we chuck it out (like near-death experiences which have a better explanation at hand than the ones that all walks of attention-grabbing, new-age gurus have extoled). Besides, what makes us so certain that we have the kind of autonomy in death that would even allow us to whimsically hang about our own dead bodies? I’m just warning against the efficacy of these claims - I wouldn’t make them any small portion of my faith or reasoning.
Sorry, but it sounds like a quote from the secular and anti-Catholic History Channel when it tries to pooh-pooh the resurrection, or any of God’s miracles for that matter.When an idea actually contradicts science, we chuck it out . . . .
No one besides the recipient is obligated to believe in any particular Private Revelation, but certanly no one is obligated to call Private Revelation as “illusion” or “hogwash” either.I’m just warning against the efficacy of these claims - I wouldn’t make them any small portion of my faith or reasoning.
I’m not sure either. Lucky for me, I said nothing regarding any of that. Read my reply again, carefully.I’m not sure what is so “worldly” about near-death experiences, or how ideas about a transcendent and immanent infinite God should reflect the dull physical universe.
“Some theorists” have relegated Paul on the road to Damascus to the religious sphere. Claims about near-death experiences happen literally every day, and reasonable scientific explanations can account for those experiences. Why elaborate?Is seeing God supposed to be a “worldly phenonenon” to Christians? How do these “some theorists” try to explain away what happened to Saint Paul on the road to Damascus? Indigestion or “illusion” and “hogwash”?
I Agree. There are good scientific explanations about near-death experiences and there’s no reason to add them to the Christian Roster. I have good reason to believe that such events are fantastic and are hogwash. I have no intention to deny somebody what they believe is personal revelation, which is why my only caveat was to be leary of making such claims a substantial part of one’s faith or reasoning.Science has it’s sphere of knowledge while religion has it’s own sphere of knowledge. It always becomes ludicrous when one side tries to explain away an event which properly belongs to the other sphere’s knowledge.
I Agree, of course. But this has nothing to do with my point, if this was still a response to my post.Why would any true scientist be so emotionally distraught over the mere idea of life continuing after physical death? What is it that seems to grip their loathing of such consistent observations of others? Perhaps these “some theorists” need to take a hard look at their false assumptions which are blinding them to reality, and try to approach the Science of Life without prejudice or angst.
Can’t argue with that. Although these events are not the type of typical every-day events I’m talking about (such as with near-death experiences). Science studies what can be repeatedly observed. The resurrection and Miracles are at at best (to science’s disadvantage) unfalsifiable. Furthermore, I noticed you didn’t address my point about autonomy in death.Sorry, but it sounds like a quote from the secular and anti-Catholic History Channel when it tries to pooh-pooh the resurrection, or any of God’s miracles for that matter.
As if saying it made it so. Refer above to my statement on autonomy in death.it’s real.
False dilemma.There are 2 types of skeptics in the world. The first is the type that doesn’t care how much evidence is weighed against them. They need to see, touch, hear, and taste for themselves and even if they do they have already made up their minds.
The 2nd type are those that have a real want and need to learn and grow and if that means them having to admit they were wrong so be it. Which skeptical category do you fall under, 1 or 2?
By the way, even Einstein admitted God exists. But I’m sure he was wrong.
Glad to hear that you are not one of those “some theorists”.I’m saying, “be a descerning person when it comes to near-death claims”, not, “write those off as wingnuts that make such remarks about the afterlife!”
Haha my goodness. No, I’m not. I will sit down every now and then to sip from a steaming hot cup of good-reason though.Glad to hear that you are not one of those “some theorists”.
Realizing that the NDE results in a heightened appreciation for life, it would not be surprising to discover that the majority do convert.I’ve read about people who have had near-death experiences. They talk about seeing themselves on the operating table, feeling a great sense of peace, etc. I’m wondering, have there been any documented cases of a non-Catholic having a near death experience that has caused them to convert to Catholicism? If so, do they explain what part of the experience caused them to convert (seeing Jesus, seeing Heaven, etc.)?
I saw Sister Angelica’s interview with Fr Scheier several months ago. There may be those who are skeptical … but he took the experience very seriously. Hallucination or not … it was the wake up call that he needed … and it emboldened him to say publicly … wake up and take this life seriously. Otherwise why would a Priest subject himself to public scrutiny by telling that kind of a story in front of Catholics … and the fierce criticism that comes with that territory.I spent a few minutes googling “NDE and Catholic” and found many interesting links:
Here’s a typical NDE from someone who returned to the Catholic Church afterwards:
nderf.org/mary’s_NDE.htm
Here’s one from a Catholic priest, posted on this forum:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=6449
From CatholicIreland.net:
catholicireland.net/pages/index.php?nd=235&art=764