Non-Catholic reactions to Pope Benedict's resignation.

[GaryTaylor]

Past Popes were not really required to travel. Now, with travel the way it is, travel is expected. It is needed.

Being The Holy Father is not as much a position for old men anymore. That is what made Pope JPII such an amazing Pope.

Its a different world today with communication and technology. The days of never leaving Rome are past. Odd that we hear complaining about the antiquity of Rome and the Church. When they do change in light of modern times we have many who think the Pope is required to die in office. Including Catholic’s, which I listened to on the news last night.

Doomed if you do, doomed if you don’t. I remain convinced its solid planning. I caught the elevation of Cardinal Dolan and the other Bishops. There came a point in the ceremony when Pope Benedict needed help lifting the hats. That I found shocking in that I knew at that moment his health and age were no doubt a concern.

 

[ffg]

Leaving before death doesn’t diminish what he was called to do as Pope.

The man became Pope late in life.

Dying doesn’t complete the job and it’s great to be living during this time where we get to see another conclave. The Church at work at it’s highest level!

For all the evil in the world today, here is the leader of the largest congregation, handing over the keys and basically saying - ‘I’ll be over there praying for you’.

After getting back up off the floor, the next Pope knows he has some serious prayer power going on here.

Maybe the Pope is telling all of us, there isn’t enough prayer these days, so while I’m still able I can lead that march while a more able body leads the activities.

 

[smaneck]

Then it isn’t an issue as to whether he resigned to a higher authority, is it? Kings abdicate, regular people resign and well, Unam Sanctum.

 

[lonelypetunia]

Again, the Vatican is a country all unto itself. It is not governed by US laws, or any other country’s laws.

There needs to be an extradition treaty in place before he could be forced to testify. Even if he is tried in absentia, it wouldn’t matter, because the Vatican is a country unto itself and not subject to US laws.

It isn’t hard to see how many are in it for the money. Especially the lawyers. Sorry Texan

Do you remember the case where a young man accused Cardinal Bernadine of Chicago of abuse? It was all over the news.

The part where the guy recanted his story got very little coverage. It happens all the time.

I think the fact the accuser recanted his story and it received little coverage is a disgrace… It was unfair to the Cardinal it also left the accusations of falsehoods alive in people’s minds. It is a great injustice to conceal the truth for a personal political or personal agenda. Regardless of how one felt personally writing the story, they had an obligation to tell the truth. The accuser recanted that should have received equal coverage. I felt for the Cardinal, I couldn’t imagine being accused of such a crime, but then to have his vindication swept aside is inexcusable. I’m done with that rant.

The news of the Pope’s resignation was emotional. My heart goes out to him as well to the Catholic Church. I have no agenda on who will be elected. I have faith that it won’t be a political move but one guided by the holy spirit.

 

[smaneck]

Because it outlines the relationship between Popes and kings:

 

[LisaA]

I respectfully disagree.

Indeed. I haven’t shared the details of the case. I am wondering if I should.

Again don’t mistake your opinion or a personal anecdote as Catholic “doctrine” being destructive. Further please consider the post regarding the mental, physical and emotional damage of contracepting, particularly the birth control pill, Depo-Provera, or some of the implant methods.

Looking back, I think we can see the tremendous societal damage caused by the “freedom” of the birth control pill. On balance, we might consider that as well as an individual case.

Back to the thread, interesting how the Pope’s resignation has brought out non-Catholic vitriol against Catholic doctrine…most notably anything that would infringe upon our libertine sexual activities. Interesting set of priorities isn’t it?

Lisa

 

[HappyPagan]

Here is a response from one of the biggest Pagan news sources.

The Wild Hunt

Warning not Catholic Friendly.

 

[jediliz]

By progressive I don’t mean socially liberal, I mean be willing to revise many of the Catholic Church’s disciplines. For example, opening up the Latin priesthood to married men would be a good start. Also revising the rules for divorced and remarried people to come back to church. Also re examining the churches rules about contraception.

If not revising the rules, it would be nice if the new pope is willing to have any discussion at all on these issues where dissenters have been stonewalled on for 30 or 40 years.

Yes and where did reexamining rules on contraception get those protestant churches that gave in at that conference in the 1930s? Abortion, 50% divorce rate, etc, etc, etc

God should plan parenthhood!

The Pope can NOT change doctrine that is GOD"S LAWS.

 

[JohnVIII]

It was more than 10 years ago now, back when I was a member of the Russian Orthodox Church Outside Russia, I was in conversation with my Russian godfather about our Chief Hierarch, Metropolitan Vitaly, “retiring”. You see the whole matter caused a schism in the church because Met. Vitaly was highly pressured into retiring, and then afterword continued to serve. The matter caused my godfather to say that he wished that the Russian Church did it the way the Roman Catholics do, namely that the pope had to remain as head of the church until death. He thought that if the Russian Church had the same rule it would not have undergone the problems it did.

Evidently, my godfather must have been wrong about it not being possible for the pope to retire. I find this all very interesting though! I’m sure the Roman hierarchy will not mess it up like the Russian Orthodox Church Outside Russia did. I’m certainly going to keep an eye on how this all turns out.

Blessings to Pope Benedict and to the Roman hierarchy and to the believers under their care!

 

[twopekinguys]

By progressive I don’t mean socially liberal, I mean be willing to revise many of the Catholic Church’s disciplines. For example, opening up the Latin priesthood to married men would be a good start. Also revising the rules for divorced and remarried people to come back to church. Also re examining the churches rules about contraception.

If not revising the rules, it would be nice if the new pope is willing to have any discussion at all on these issues where dissenters have been stonewalled on for 30 or 40 years.

1. There are married Latin Rite Priests
2. Divorce and remarriage? Those are God’s rules. They cannot be changed, especially for social convenience. What part of “until death”, or "What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder (Mark 10:9) do people not understand during the wedding ceremony?
3. Contraception? Again, God’s rule. “Though shall not kill”. Many forms of birth control actually allow for fertilization (life begins), but do not allow the embryo to attach to the uterus. Therefore, forcing it to die. i.e. murdered, killed.

I’m thinking you need to do some research into what is discipline, and what is dogma. Also, look at the Church’s history, and see how many times it has bent to social pressure or convention. I’m thinking you’ll find that answer to be 0

ETA: The annulment process, while lengthy, also forces people to face their past mistakes,(assuming it was a mistake), and to heal. I say “assuming it was a mistake” because I have seen where annulments have not been granted. That a sacramental marriage did in fact exist.

 

[ComeHome2Rome]

What will Pope Benedict XVI be called in March?

Will he drop “Pope” keep the name Benedict? Or will he go back to being Cardinal Ratzinger? Or will go back to Fr.? Or will he take on a new name altogether?

Is he going to begin collecting a pension from the Church? Or will he join a Monastery?

 

[LisaA]

What will Pope Benedict XVI be called in March?

Will he drop “Pope” keep the name Benedict? Or will he go back to being Cardinal Ratzinger? Or will go back to Fr.? Or will he take on a new name altogether?

Is he going to begin collecting a pension from the Church? Or will he join a Monastery?

Per EWTN panel, he is Bishop Emeritus of Rome, he is still a Cardinal and he is supposed to move into what was/is a convent within Vatican. According to Joan Lewis the convent building(s) is being renovated and she did not know if any Religious Sisters were currently in residence.

He will clearly be taking on a more simple life of prayer and study as was his wish even before being named Pope.
Lisa

 

[LilyM]

What will Pope Benedict XVI be called in March?

Will he drop “Pope” keep the name Benedict? Or will he go back to being Cardinal Ratzinger? Or will go back to Fr.? Or will he take on a new name altogether?

Is he going to begin collecting a pension from the Church? Or will he join a Monastery?

Just to add to the above, he will no longer go by the name Benedict either, so it wil be back to Joseph Ratzinger.

 

[ComeHome2Rome]

Per EWTN panel, he is Bishop Emeritus of Rome, he is still a Cardinal and he is supposed to move into what was/is a convent within Vatican. According to Joan Lewis the convent building(s) is being renovated and she did not know if any Religious Sisters were currently in residence.

He will clearly be taking on a more simple life of prayer and study as was his wish even before being named Pope.
Lisa

Wow interesting! As Cardinal, he gets to cast a vote for his succesor

 

[LisaA]

Wow interesting! As Cardinal, he gets to cast a vote for his succesor

No he over 80. I imagine he has some influence but he has specifically stated he will not participate in the Conclave.

Lisa

 

[vsedriver]

Many Cardinals demanded reform during the Vatican II council:

Pope Paul VI’s commission on birth control voted overwhelming to overturn Casti Connubii, the most ardent opponent was Cardinal Leo Suenens. Unfortunately out of the 72 members, 3 bishops on the commission convinced Pope Paul to not listen to the recommendations of the commission and the commission itself was stonewalled in 1968 when Pope Paul VI issued Humanae Vitae. Since then, the issue is not even on the table for discussion even though his own commission found the opposite.

obviously the Holy Spirit thought the cardinals and bishops on the commission were wrong and Pope Paul was right. Humanae Vitae is quite prophetic. Much of what PPVI warned about has come to pass.

The commission found that artificial birth control was not intrinsically evil and Catholic couples should be allowed to decide for themselves what to employ.

of course this was before Humanae Vitae. Artificial birth control does interfer with God’s plans so it is an evil.

Other dissenters were Patriarch Patriarch Maximus IV Saigh, along with Cardinal Suenens, Cardinal Leger, and Cardinal Alfrink. These dissenting voices were roundly ignored.

they were ignored because they were wrong.

I understand it and I still reject it. And it still needs reform.

no, it needs no reform, we as a society need to reform our thinking about sex and it’s function in our lives.

 

[Petergee]

Many Cardinals demanded reform during the Vatican II council:

Pope Paul VI’s commission on birth control voted overwhelming to overturn Casti Connubii, the most ardent opponent was Cardinal Leo Suenens. Unfortunately out of the 72 members, 3 bishops on the commission convinced Pope Paul to not listen to the recommendations of the commission and the commission itself was stonewalled in 1968 when Pope Paul VI issued Humanae Vitae. Since then, the issue is not even on the table for discussion even though his own commission found the opposite.

The commission found that artificial birth control was not intrinsically evil and Catholic couples should be allowed to decide for themselves what to employ.

Other dissenters were Patriarch Patriarch Maximus IV Saigh, along with Cardinal Suenens, Cardinal Leger, and Cardinal Alfrink. These dissenting voices were roundly ignored. .

So that myth is still making the rounds eh?

Both Blessed John XXIII in his statement setting up the Commission, and Paul VI in his statement expanding it, stated emphatically that there was NO possiblity that the end result would be that the Church would say that contraception can ever be moral. That was not the purpose of the Commission, which was to advise the pope on new ways to present the truth that contraception is gravely immoral, and to answer the claim, then quite popular, that the then-new hornonal contraceptives such as “the Pill”, were NOT really contraceptives because they do not physically interfere with the actual act of copulation and are therefore morally permissible. They said using condoms was evil and couldn’t imagine why anyone would still want to use them when we had the wonderful modern, “not really a contraceptive” Pill.

Even pro-contraception people admit today that this was a ludicrous argument.

20 years later we were being told by the powers that be in society that although the Pill is terribly dangerous to women’s health (true), condoms are wonderful and our salvation, and using condoms equals “safe sex”. Imagine how stupid the Chruch would have seemed if she had declared in the 1960s that the Pill is OK but condoms are not. Thank God the Holy Spirit kept the Church’s teachings from error despite the pressures piled on by secular society.

 

[Porknpie]

The commission found that artificial birth control was not intrinsically evil and Catholic couples should be allowed to decide for themselves what to employ.

I understand it and I still reject it. And it still needs reform.

Augustus, you believe then that taking the pill is morally ok?

If I respond and say that in its third means of preventing pregancy it acts an abortificient…in otherwords, it kills human life by not letting a fertilized human egg to implant.

I assume you believe that killing human life in any form is immoral?

If so, you must reject the Pill as an abortificient as immoral, unless you propose the killing human life is ok.

Is that what you are believing? I’m not sure what you are thinking.

The fact that some disagreed at a church council and the council continued Church teaching in saying contraception is immoral, shows the Holy Spirit act work, protecting Christ’s Church from error.

Pork

 

[maltmom]

I would like to thank all of the non-Catholics who have posted their love and support of us at this time. God Bless you.

 

[Offdoodykcrn]

Quite frankly, my respect for Pope Benedict has increased with this decision. It takes wisdom and humility to relinquish power when one believes they are no longer able to serve the post as someone else might.