Non-Catholics going to confession

[Lampo]

My wife is a non-Catholic and goes to a “Mom’s Group” at our Catholic Parish. Today was “coffee and confessions” day. My wife just told me that there are a few non-Catholic women that went to confession today and do regularly. They told my wife the priest knows they are not Catholic. They also told my wife she could go to confession. These ladies told my wife that when they go into the confessional, they start off by telling the priest they are not Catholic. They confess their sins and then the priest has them say an “Our Father.” The ladies didn’t say whether or not they say an Act of Contrition and if the priest says the words of Absolution. In these cases, are these valid sacramental confessions? What should I tell my wife? Thanks.

 

[benedictgal]

My wife is a non-Catholic and goes to a “Mom’s Group” at our Catholic Parish. Today was “coffee and confessions” day. My wife just told me that there are a few non-Catholic women that went to confession today and do regularly. They told my wife the priest knows they are not Catholic. They also told my wife she could go to confession. These ladies told my wife that when they go into the confessional, they start off by telling the priest they are not Catholic. They confess their sins and then the priest has them say an “Our Father.” The ladies didn’t say whether or not they say an Act of Contrition and if the priest says the words of Absolution. In these cases, are these valid sacramental confessions? What should I tell my wife? Thanks.

Only in extreme (grave) circumstances may a non-Catholic be permitted to receive the Sacrament of Penance. There is, in fact, a thread that is devoted to this very question. It’s probably either at page 2 or 3 of this particular forum.

Reception of the sacraments requires the the person be a baptized Catholic. In Marriage, the non-Catholic party participates in the sacrament by virtue of the Catholic spouse. However, even after the Nuptial Mass, the sacrament of Marriage does not entitle the non-Catholic carte blanche access to the Sacraments. They cannot receive Holy Communion. They need to be in full communion with the Church in order to receive the Sacraments. The sacraments require that the faithful believe in the precepts of the Church. Included in this is the fact that Christ himself instituted these Sacraments. Unfortunately, members of Protestant ecclesiastical communities do not believe in confession nor do they believe in the Real Presence of Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament. It is difficult to participate, let alone, receive, something in which you do not believe.

Obviously, because the women in question are not Catholic, they would not know what the formula and prayer of absolution are. While it is commendable that they are making some effort, perhaps it would be better to direct them through an RCIA program so that they can become full members of the Church.

The priest, while perhaps well-meaning, is not taking the correct approach. The sacraments are valuable treasures of the Church that need to be dispensed with all due reverence. They cannot be used as vehicles for ecumenism.

 

[LilyM]

It’s perfectly OK for a non-Catholic to approach a priest for confession at any time, inside or outside the confessional, for advice and prayer (though not sacramental absolution).

Assuming they’re not holding up the line for others who need sacramental confession, what’s the problem? Sacramental confession can occur any place any time, so can non-sacramental advice and prayer about sin.

And surely it’s not that difficult to determine whether or not the priest used the sacramental formula - ie said ‘I absolve you from your sins’ - is it?

I don’t think this is a tool for ecumenism at all - rather for evangelisation. I trust that the priest would rather see them become Catholic than not, and I assume he would take the right opportunity to gently steer them into RCIA or what have you.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

My wife is a non-Catholic and goes to a “Mom’s Group” at our Catholic Parish. Today was “coffee and confessions” day. My wife just told me that there are a few non-Catholic women that went to confession today and do regularly. They told my wife the priest knows they are not Catholic. They also told my wife she could go to confession. These ladies told my wife that when they go into the confessional, they start off by telling the priest they are not Catholic. They confess their sins and then the priest has them say an “Our Father.” The ladies didn’t say whether or not they say an Act of Contrition and if the priest says the words of Absolution. In these cases, are these valid sacramental confessions? What should I tell my wife? Thanks.

No these would not be the Sacrament Reconciliation. And would not be covered under the seal of the Sacrament either so they need to be careful. The Priest would generally not be able to offer Sacramental Absolution.

 

[cameron_lansing]

“In Marriage, the non-Catholic party participates in the sacrament by virtue of the Catholic spouse.”

While it is true that marriage to a Catholic imparts no right to other Catholic sacraments, some further precision is useful here. The participation of a non Catholic baptized party in the sacrament when married to a Catholic is not derivative.

The valid marriage of two baptized non Catholics is a sacrament as well. The valid marriage of a Catholic and a non baptized person is not a sacrament. The valid marriage of a Catholic and a baptized person is a sacrament, and the parties share equally in the sacrament.

“Only in extreme (grave) circumstances may a non-Catholic . . .”

The conditions under which a baptized non Catholic may receive the sacrament of penance lawfully from a Catholic priest are set forth in canon 844. A non Catholic who is not baptized, even though a member of a non Catholic Christian ecclesial community, cannot receive the sacrament of penance validly.

Note the distinction between members of the separated Eastern Churches (and those in the same condition, as below) and of other Christian ecclesiastical communities.

Can. 844 §3. Catholic ministers administer the sacraments of penance, Eucharist, and anointing of the sick licitly to members of Eastern Churches which do not have full communion with the Catholic Church if they seek such on their own accord and are properly disposed. This is also valid for members of other Churches which in the judgment of the Apostolic See are in the same condition in regard to the sacraments as these Eastern Churches. §4. If the danger of death is present or if, in the judgment of the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops, some other grave necessity urges it, Catholic ministers administer these same sacraments licitly also to other Christians not having full communion with the Catholic Church, who cannot approach a minister of their own community and who seek such on their own accord, provided that they manifest Catholic faith in respect to these sacraments and are properly disposed. §5. For the cases mentioned in §§2, 3, and 4, the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops is not to issue general norms except after consultation at least with the local competent authority of the interested non-Catholic Church or community.

An individual assessment of each person who seeks the sacrament or his or her accord, in addition to the other conditions, is required.

Let us recall that the original post offers no specific details that would permit any speculation on the individual cases. We only know these women are not Catholic. We don’t know if any are baptized, and if so, whether they are members of Eastern Churches not in full communion, or members of other Christian ecclesial communities.

A blanket treatment of a group, however, seems wrong.

The difficulty in offering something like the sacrament, just a devotional retelling of sins and some counselling, while the Catholics are receiving the sacrament, is that it tends to confusion about what the sacrament is.

 

[benedictgal]

“In Marriage, the non-Catholic party participates in the sacrament by virtue of the Catholic spouse.”

While it is true that marriage to a Catholic imparts no right to other Catholic sacraments, some further precision is useful here. The participation of a non Catholic baptized party in the sacrament when married to a Catholic is not derivative.

The valid marriage of two baptized non Catholics is a sacrament as well. The valid marriage of a Catholic and a non baptized person is not a sacrament. The valid marriage of a Catholic and a baptized person is a sacrament, and the parties share equally in the sacrament.

“Only in extreme (grave) circumstances may a non-Catholic . . .”

The conditions under which a baptized non Catholic may receive the sacrament of penance lawfully from a Catholic priest are set forth in canon 844. A non Catholic who is not baptized, even though a member of a non Catholic Christian ecclesial community, cannot receive the sacrament of penance validly.

Note the distinction between members of the separated Eastern Churches (and those in the same condition, as below) and of other Christian ecclesiastical communities.

Can. 844 §3. Catholic ministers administer the sacraments of penance, Eucharist, and anointing of the sick licitly to members of Eastern Churches which do not have full communion with the Catholic Church if they seek such on their own accord and are properly disposed. This is also valid for members of other Churches which in the judgment of the Apostolic See are in the same condition in regard to the sacraments as these Eastern Churches. §4. If the danger of death is present or if, in the judgment of the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops, some other grave necessity urges it, Catholic ministers administer these same sacraments licitly also to other Christians not having full communion with the Catholic Church, who cannot approach a minister of their own community and who seek such on their own accord, provided that they manifest Catholic faith in respect to these sacraments and are properly disposed. §5. For the cases mentioned in §§2, 3, and 4, the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops is not to issue general norms except after consultation at least with the local competent authority of the interested non-Catholic Church or community.

An individual assessment of each person who seeks the sacrament or his or her accord, in addition to the other conditions, is required.

Let us recall that the original post offers no specific details that would permit any speculation on the individual cases. We only know these women are not Catholic. We don’t know if any are baptized, and if so, whether they are members of Eastern Churches not in full communion, or members of other Christian ecclesial communities.

A blanket treatment of a group, however, seems wrong.

The difficulty in offering something like the sacrament, just a devotional retelling of sins and some counselling, while the Catholics are receiving the sacrament, is that it tends to confusion about what the sacrament is.

Thanks for the clarification, Deacon Cameron. Your last statement hit the nail on the head and was a more accurate reaqding of the problem than my initial response was. I fear that we tread on dangerous ground when someone, even with the best intentions, muddies the waters, so to speak, by engaging in activities such as that listed by the OP.

 

[puzzleannie]

My wife is a non-Catholic and goes to a “Mom’s Group” at our Catholic Parish. Today was “coffee and confessions” day. My wife just told me that there are a few non-Catholic women that went to confession today and do regularly. They told my wife the priest knows they are not Catholic. They also told my wife she could go to confession. These ladies told my wife that when they go into the confessional, they start off by telling the priest they are not Catholic. They confess their sins and then the priest has them say an “Our Father.” The ladies didn’t say whether or not they say an Act of Contrition and if the priest says the words of Absolution. In these cases, are these valid sacramental confessions? What should I tell my wife? Thanks.

nobody should be telling anybody anything about anybody if it has do do with confession. nobody’s business who speaks to the priest, what they say, what he says or does. just remind ladies in this group confession is entirely private and not a matter for third party discussion.

 

[benedictgal]

nobody should be telling anybody anything about anybody if it has do do with confession. nobody’s business who speaks to the priest, what they say, what he says or does. just remind ladies in this group confession is entirely private and not a matter for third party discussion.

This part was not discussed in the OP. The problem is that one must be Catholic in order to receive the Sacrament of Penance. Deacon Cameron gave a very good and detailed explanation. You are right that these women must exercise prudence regarding what was said during their meeting with the priest. They may be unaware that whatever is said in the confessional stays there.

 

[NewUlm1976_2000]

I have posted on this before (look a couple of pages back). Non-Catholics can go to confession. There will be some type of grace imparted when the priest does his blessing and the person will walk out with less of a burden then when they came in. There is no clear theological definition for this as it is one matter that cannot truly be known (e.g. see references to Fr Grochel’s 5th Luminous mystery discussion).

Through all the schisms and sub-schisms the theological definition of God has not changed, so that common bond continues, so there is no reason some graces would not be imparted through confession.

 

[benedictgal]

I have posted on this before (look a couple of pages back). Non-Catholics can go to confession. There will be some type of grace imparted when the priest does his blessing and the person will walk out with less of a burden then when they came in. There is no clear theological definition for this as it is one matter that cannot truly be known (e.g. see references to Fr Grochel’s 5th Luminous mystery discussion).

Through all the schisms and sub-schisms the theological definition of God has not changed, so that common bond continues, so there is no reason some graces would not be imparted through confession.

Unfortunately, you have not substantiated your point. Please refer to what Deacon Cameron posted. There are grave circumstances in which this may be done; however, what the OP described is not one of them.

 

[NewUlm1976_2000]

Unfortunately, you have not substantiated your point. Please refer to what Deacon Cameron posted. There are grave circumstances in which this may be done; however, what the OP described is not one of them.

I appreciate the official listing of what the Deacon has posted and I referred to that in my last post. Yet what I described also fits with the OP’s description. Some grace is imparted, it cannot officially have the sacrament designation, but help is given to lift burdens. I do not believe that to forgive or not even under non-“grave” circumstances would not be given. Remember that non-Catholics (if they are from a Christian sect) still have the same theological definition of God which no schism has gone after. Why should forgiveness be held back due to human pettiness in the past?

 

[THurifer2]

still have the same theological definition of God which no schism has gone after. Why should forgiveness be held back due to human pettiness in the past?

You are wrong. Ever heard of Transubstantiation?

With each of your posts I recognize a more and more watered down Catholicism

Every form of protestantism is very way off the mark when it comes to theological understanding. there is nothing unique to protestantism which is a benefit to Catholicism.

 

[NewUlm1976_2000]

You are wrong. Ever heard of Transubstantiation?

With each of your posts I recognize a more and more watered down Catholicism

Every form of protestantism is very way off the mark when it comes to theological understanding. there is nothing unique to protestantism which is a benefit to Catholicism.

I will refer you to Fr Grochel’s 5th Luminous Mystery discussion. He says that even now the Eucharist is in many ways beyond the human mind, which is Transubstantiation. Just as that process is not truly known, the same can be said for confessions, as the true process is not known to the priest or any member of this world.

I would disagree about it being “watered down”. I see it as digging deeper into the day to day human side of the Faith. As the world is not all black and white, but an infinite shade of grays, so goes spirituality.

 

[jmcrae]

I have posted on this before (look a couple of pages back). Non-Catholics can go to confession.

Under certain circumstances, they can appear to go to Confession, and they can receive a blessing. However, if they have committed mortal sin, and even if they confess their mortal sins, they are still not absolved of their sins. They will still go to Hell when they die, despite the fact that they will feel better after going.

If they want to participate in the Sacraments, and if they want to be absolved of their sins, then they need to become Catholics.

Based on the little I know about Father Groechel, I feel certain that he would not encourage Protestants to “play pretend” at participating in the Sacraments, nor encourage priests to indulge this sort of thing.

 

[NewUlm1976_2000]

However, if they have committed mortal sin, and even if they confess their mortal sins, they are still not absolved of their sins. They will still go to Hell when they die, despite the fact that they will feel better after going.

“Will” go to hell? That is an big unknown as nobody has been able to report from beyond the grave. The best we can do is have theologians hypothesize about it. Just because the sacrament is not given according to the current definitions does not mean a fast-track to hell.

 

[jmcrae]

“Will” go to hell? That is an big unknown as nobody has been able to report from beyond the grave. The best we can do is have theologians hypothesize about it. Just because the sacrament is not given according to the current definitions does not mean a fast-track to hell.

Is it not a fact that someone who dies with unconfessed mortal sin will go to Hell? The only thing in doubt is whether or not someone has committed a mortal sin, or not - other than the person himself, of course.

The danger of a “let’s pretend” non-confession is that the person might think that they have been absolved of their mortal sins, when in fact, they haven’t.