Non-Catholics how do you view Catholicism?

[Per_Crucem]

I always wondered if non- Catholics viewed the Catholicism as strange. With rote prayers, incense, sacred tradition, etc. Would love to hear how you think

I like that Catholicism just fine.

It’s the women readers in pant suits, singing Marty Haugen hymns, with a Jesus flying off the cross crucifix behind the altar without a tabernacle Catholicism that is absolutely nauseating.

 

[Denise1957]

It’s the women readers in pant suits, singing Marty Haugen hymns, with a Jesus flying off the cross crucifix behind the altar without a tabernacle Catholicism that is absolutely nauseating.

I’m inclined to agree, but…Marty Haugen is a Lutheran, so why would you have a problem with his hymns? That being said, I stopped attending one parish because of the propensity of the choir singing Protestant hymns, especially “Gather us in” which is a particular annoyance for me.

 

[Peter_J]

Originally Posted by Peter J
Fair enough, although I would have found it more interesting if you had said something about our lack of Non-Catholicness.

Do Catholics have abundance of non-Catholicness?

 

[Per_Crucem]

I’m inclined to agree, but…Marty Haugen is a Lutheran, so why would you have a problem with his hymns?

He was a Lutheran. He’s now United Church of Christ. However, he’s still a heretic no matter what he calls himself.

That being said, I stopped attending one parish because of the propensity of the choir singing Protestant hymns, especially “Gather us in” which is a particular annoyance for me.

Yeah…gag. My wife is Catholic so when I go to Mass with her, assuming it’s a more modern church, I have to leave if they play that song.

 

[Per_Crucem]

Do Catholics have abundance of non-Catholicness?

Not particularly. I was just wondering if that’s what you meant lol

 

[Denise1957]

He was a Lutheran. He’s now United Church of Christ. However, he’s still a heretic no matter what he calls himself.

Yeah…gag. My wife is Catholic so when I go to Mass with her, assuming it’s a more modern church, I have to leave if they play that song.

I didn’t know that Marty Haugen is now Church of Christ. So, is it the modernization of the Catholic church that bothers you? Why didn’t you just find a TLM to attend, where there are no women (or men) readers, the tabernacle is where it should be, and, perhaps best of all, no Marty Haugen tunes.

 

[Per_Crucem]

I didn’t know that Marty Haugen is now Church of Christ. So, is it the modernization of the Catholic church that bothers you? Why didn’t you just find a TLM to attend, where there are no women (or men) readers, the tabernacle is where it should be, and, perhaps best of all, no Marty Haugen tunes.

There is nothing wrong with the novus ordo, if it’s done right.

 

[Miriam1947]

Sent you a PM.

Feel free to post your story, unless you feel it is too personal, then just go ahed and PM me.

 

[benjohnson]

It’s the women readers in pant suits, singing Marty Haugen hymns, with a Jesus flying off the cross crucifix behind the altar without a tabernacle Catholicism that is absolutely nauseating.

Agreed! If anything, what I don’t like about the Catholic Church is when it’s not acting like the Catholic Church.

…

I do however, in toto, love and respect the Catholic Church - and I’m profoundly grateful for their steadfast proclamation on the value of life.

 

[lutheran_farmer]

Feel free to post your story, unless you feel it is too personal, then just go ahed and PM me.

It’s on another Catholic site, so, out of respect for this one, I’ll send it via PM.

 

[benjohnson]

I’m inclined to agree, but…Marty Haugen is a Lutheran, so why would you have a problem with his hymns?

Marty Haugen hymns at a minimum have subtle heresy of putting our own emotions about God as being more important that what God has done for us. That’s just the start - there’s usually an extra bonus heresy thrown in for good measure.

The trouble is that it’s hard to pick out the heresies because the tune is so good, and the lyrics are clever. But once you know there there, it’s hard to ignore.

 

[lutheran_farmer]

I should add that because my parents were Baby Boomers, my views, like many of my generation, are colored by their views of ‘the Establishment’. Sometimes I think my generation was some sort of grand social experiment in raising children without God under the false premise of ‘letting them choose for themselves’. Atheism and Agnosticism is the religion they really chose.

 

[steido01]

Marty Haugen hymns at a minimum have subtle heresy of putting our own emotions about God as being more important that what God has done for us. That’s just the start - there’s usually an extra bonus heresy thrown in for good measure.

The trouble is that it’s hard to pick out the heresies because the tune is so good, and the lyrics are clever. But once you know there there, it’s hard to ignore.

Just to add to what Ben is saying… We Lutherans take our hymns pretty darn seriously. If they’re off a bit, they won’t be in our hymnal.

Haugen is an alum of my alma mater - and I suffered his poetry for four years. It’s a shame because so many of his works, Holden Evening Prayer for example, are musically gorgeous. But they’re wrong.

 

[Peter_J]

Not particularly. I was just wondering if that’s what you meant lol

Well, as we’re talking about Non-Catholics on the one hand, and Catholics on the other hand, it seems obvious that the latter group has a lack of Non-Catholicness (relatively) rather than an abundance. (Just saying. )

 

[Per_Crucem]

Well, as we’re talking about Non-Catholics on the one hand, and Catholics on the other hand, it seems obvious that the latter group has a lack of Non-Catholicness (relatively) rather than an abundance. (Just saying. )

Ah, okay.

Well, on the third hand, we know that you Melkites are the true church and you’re just letting the Latins think they run the show. So don’t even pretend.

 

[QuestLove]

That’s nearly everything!!

Lol…well yes that’s true.

One of the sweetest and most compassionate persons I have met in my life was a catholic nun (Sr. Grace) who taught religious education (10th Grade) at the all girls school I went to. We all thought this woman must be some saint; this woman positively glowed with goodness. So one day in class we were all talking about some of the worst things we had ever done. It was Sr. Grace’s turn and she blushed and stammered and hemmed and hawed…so of course, we are all thinking this is going to be so good and so juicy. We couldn’t wait… Some of the girls were thinking, I’m sure, it had to be sexual immorality or worse.

But you know what was her big sin, she was in a hurry one day and stole some older man’s parking space. Now that was a let down, because of course we are thinking…that’s your big sin? We were expecting some huge juicy, groundbreaking secret. But the thing is, she looked so genuinely upset about that we ended up feeling bad for her. But that was Sr. Grace for you, one of the sweetest persons I have ever met.

 

[Denise1957]

Marty Haugen hymns at a minimum have subtle heresy of putting our own emotions about God as being more important that what God has done for us. That’s just the start - there’s usually an extra bonus heresy thrown in for good measure.

The trouble is that it’s hard to pick out the heresies because the tune is so good, and the lyrics are clever. But once you know there there, it’s hard to ignore.

I’m learning a lot here. I had no idea that Lutherans (or some of you, anyway) have a problem with Marty Haugen. I though it was just Catholic tradies like me who have a problem. I never considered that there were specific heresies in his work, but, as you mentioned, it seems about putting our emotions before God, and basically, IMO, making the Mass people-centered instead of God-centered.

The part of “Gather us in” that makes me want to scream when I hear it is…“Give us the courage to enter the song.” Which is simply dreadful. The song does, as you say have a nice tune, though, which is maybe why a lot of Catholics like it. With so many beautiful Catholic hymns, it amazes me that ones like Gather us in are chosen for Mass.

 

[Per_Crucem]

I’m learning a lot here. I had no idea that Lutherans (or some of you, anyway) have a problem with Marty Haugen. I though it was just Catholic tradies like me who have a problem. I never considered that there were specific heresies in his work, but, as you mentioned, it seems about putting our emotions before God, and basically, IMO, making the Mass people-centered instead of God-centered.

When he was Lutheran, he was in the LCA, which is one of the bodies that merged to form the current ELCA. They have been and have only gotten more liberal as time has gone on.

 

[Per_Crucem]

The part of “Gather us in” that makes me want to scream when I hear it is…“Give us the courage to enter the song.” Which is simply dreadful. The song does, as you say have a nice tune, though, which is maybe why a lot of Catholics like it. With so many beautiful Catholic hymns, it amazes me that ones like Gather us in are chosen for Mass.

Here in this place, our comfortable parish,
All of the statues carried away,
See in each face a vacuous visage,
Brought here by guilt or by R.C.I.A.

Gather us in, by Beemer or Hummer,
Gather us in, so we can feel good,
Come to us now in this barren Zen temple,
With only a shrub and an altar of wood.

We are the young, our morals a mystery,
We are the old, who couldn’t care less,
We have been warned throughout all of history,
But we enjoy this liturgical mess.

Gather us in, our radical pastor,
Gather us in, our unveiled nun,
Call to us now, with guitars and bongos,
Hang up your cellphones and join in the fun!

Here we will take some wine and some water,
Whether it changes, we really don’t care.
But when the Sign of Peace comes, our pastor,
Jumps from the altar and hugs like a bear.

Gather us in, uncatechized masses,
Gather us in, the liberal elite,
Help us to form our personal Credo,
Give us a choice between white bread and wheat.

 

[Denise1957]

Here in this place, our comfortable parish,
All of the statues carried away,
See in each face a vacuous visage,
Brought here by guilt or by R.C.I.A.

Gather us in, by Beemer or Hummer,
Gather us in, so we can feel good,
Come to us now in this barren Zen temple,
With only a shrub and an altar of wood.

We are the young, our morals a mystery,
We are the old, who couldn’t care less,
We have been warned throughout all of history,
But we enjoy this liturgical mess.

Gather us in, our radical pastor,
Gather us in, our unveiled nun,
Call to us now, with guitars and bongos,
Hang up your cellphones and join in the fun!

Here we will take some wine and some water,
Whether it changes, we really don’t care.
But when the Sign of Peace comes, our pastor,
Jumps from the altar and hugs like a bear.

Gather us in, uncatechized masses,
Gather us in, the liberal elite,
Help us to form our personal Credo,
Give us a choice between white bread and wheat.

I think that you’re trying to prove some kind of point with the above little ditty, but you’ll have to explain it to me. I was never very good at interpreting bad poetry (or good even poetry, for that matter). Just tell us what you really think. Just be careful not to say anything that’s banable.