Non Catholics stand with your Catholic Brothers

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Alix1912

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I am not Catholic. I am Lutheran MS. I do not have any moral issue with barrier birth control, though I do major issues with anything that harms an already conceived child. Despite the fact that I do not completely share the Catholic Church’s beliefs, I do believe that they have a right to those beliefs, and that right is and should be protected by the 1st Ammendment.

That being said the recent HHS ruling is WRONG, on every level, and it is a direct and clear violation to the US constitution.

I am so glad that the Catholic Clergy and leadership of America are not taking this assault to their Religion lightly. Thank you for standing up, and know that many of your non Catholic brothers and sisters are standing with you. I have already spoken and written to my elected officals and I will continue to do so until this mandate is removed.

I call on everyone who regularly visits this page and is not Catholic to stand with their Catholic brothers and sisters and fight this assault on our freedom.
 
Alix1912 said:
I am not Catholic. I am Lutheran MS. I do not have any moral issue with barrier birth control, though I do major issues with anything that harms an already conceived child. Despite the fact that I do not completely share the Catholic Church’s beliefs, I do believe that they have a right to those beliefs, and that right is and should be protected by the 1st Ammendment.

That being said the recent HHS ruling is WRONG, on every level, and it is a direct and clear violation to the US constitution.

I am so glad that the Catholic Clergy and leadership of America are not taking this assault to their Religion lightly. Thank you for standing up, and know that many of your non Catholic brothers and sisters are standing with you. I have already spoken and written to my elected officals and I will continue to do so until this mandate is removed.

I call on everyone who regularly visits this page and is not Catholic to stand with their Catholic brothers and sisters and fight this assault on our freedom.
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Thanks for posting this. The Catholic Church is a big and unified organization that stands in the way of Obama’s agenda. Obama wants to break us, but he will not succeed. The gates of Hell will not prevail.

I’m sure the Church represents many non-Catholic denominations that don’t have a loud enough voice to be heard on this matter.
 
qui_est_ce said:
Thanks for posting this. The Catholic Church is a big and unified organization that stands in the way of Obama’s agenda. Obama wants to break us, but he will not succeed. The gates of Hell will not prevail.

I’m sure the Church represents many non-Catholic denominations that don’t have a loud enough voice to be heard on this matter.
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If this administration knocks down the Catholic Church, no other religious groups (excepting perhaps Muslims) have a hope of an effective voice in this country again.
 
Ridgerunner said:
If this administration knocks down the Catholic Church, no other religious groups (excepting perhaps Muslims) have a hope of an effective voice in this country again.
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He won’t succeed.

Did you have the letter read in your parish this week-end? It was very somberly and shockingly received in our parish. The young people seemed the most shocked. They often don’t keep up with the news and are more prolife than the middle aged.

I really liked your post about the Catholic Church standing in the way of Obama’s agenda in another thread. Your observation than he placed pro-choice Catholics in his administration in order to muddy Catholic teaching was spot on. You should post that in other threads for everyone to see.
 
qui_est_ce said:
He won’t succeed.

Did you have the letter read in your parish this week-end? It was very somberly and shockingly received in our parish. The young people seemed the most shocked. They often don’t keep up with the news and are more prolife than the middle aged.

I really liked your post about the Catholic Church standing in the way of Obama’s agenda in another thread. Your observation than he placed pro-choice Catholics in his administration in order to muddy Catholic teaching was spot on. You should post that in other threads for everyone to see.
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Thank you for your kind words.

My bishop is very much supportive of the letter. I’m in two parishes for historical reasons. In one, it was read. In another, it was not. I’m not sure how the latter pastor got away with not doing it, but he sure didn’t read it. He’s known as a “lib”, so he might simply have defied the bishop.
 
Alix1912 said:
I am not Catholic. I** am Lutheran MS. I do not have any moral issue with barrier birth control,** though I do major issues with anything that harms an already conceived child. Despite the fact that I do not completely share the Catholic Church’s beliefs, I do believe that they have a right to those beliefs, and that right is and should be protected by the 1st Ammendment.

That being said the recent HHS ruling is WRONG, on every level, and it is a direct and clear violation to the US constitution.

I am so glad that the Catholic Clergy and leadership of America are not taking this assault to their Religion lightly. Thank you for standing up, and know that many of your non Catholic brothers and sisters are standing with you. I have already spoken and written to my elected officals and I will continue to do so until this mandate is removed.

I call on everyone who regularly visits this page and is not Catholic to stand with their Catholic brothers and sisters and fight this assault on our freedom.
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Bold Lettering Mine.

Thank you for your sentiments **-**However- I am curious…

Hmmmmmmm… So if Our Lord is a creator and he gives us the gift of creating, (a new life) then I ask you; as a Lutheran, at what point is a soul formed- made manifest on this earth of ours? Espcially since we read - Jeremiah 1:5 “Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations.”

I realize I am not addressing Barrier birth control - I am adressing birth control issues. Also as a Lutheran would you be morally opposed to voteing for a rabid abortionist i.e. Obama?
 
Ridgerunner said:
Thank you for your kind words.

My bishop is very much supportive of the letter. I’m in two parishes for historical reasons. In one, it was read. In another, it was not. I’m not sure how the latter pastor got away with not doing it, but he sure didn’t read it. He’s known as a “lib”, so he might simply have defied the bishop.
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We got the letter.
 
Nimzovik said:
Bold Lettering Mine.

Thank you for your sentiments **-**However- I am curious…

Hmmmmmmm… So if Our Lord is a creator and he gives us the gift of creating, (a new life) then I ask you; as a Lutheran, at what point is a soul formed- made manifest on this earth of ours? Espcially since we read - Jeremiah 1:5 “Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations.”

I realize I am not addressing Barrier birth control - I am adressing birth control issues. Also as a Lutheran would you be morally opposed to voteing for a rabid abortionist i.e. Obama?
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  1. PLEASE do not attempt to hyjack this thread. This is not about the differences between our faiths but it is about standing together in the face of a blantant attempt to undermine everyone of any religons right to freely practice their faith. The only thing you accomplish buy being contrary is running off all those who believe differently than you, but still want to help you. If you do that, then you will have to fight alone.
  2. The crux of this issue is not birth control but religoius freedom. Replace birth control with some other thing…like Chocolate Bars. Say a religon had an objection to eating Chocolate, is it OK for the Federal government to force organizations affliated with that religon and run by it to provide free chocolate to all their employee’s, simply because the government feels it’s in people’s best interest to eat chocolate at work?
  3. I do not know when the soul is formed, I would not even presume to understand that process at all. However, I do believe that the moment an egg and a sperm meet…a unique human individual is created, and that person deserves a right to life.
  4. I would never vote for Obama, and never have. He was a terrible senator and has been an even worse President. Pick just about any issue from abortion to taxes, and I pretty much disagree with him 100%. I look at everything a candidate stands for before making a decision to support them, that includes social and economical issues. I have yet to encouter a candidate that I liked everything about them except their stance on abortion. Most conservatives are conservative in all areas.
Again PLEASE do not hyjack this thread into a debate about different beliefs about Birth Control. THis is about standing up for the right of people to freely practice their religon.
 
Alix1912 said:
  1. PLEASE do not attempt to hyjack this thread. This is not about the differences between our faiths but it is about standing together in the face of a blantant attempt to undermine everyone of any religons right to freely practice their faith. The only thing you accomplish buy being contrary is running off all those who believe differently than you, but still want to help you. If you do that, then you will have to fight alone.
  2. The crux of this issue is not birth control but religoius freedom. Replace birth control with some other thing…like Chocolate Bars. Say a religon had an objection to eating Chocolate, is it OK for the Federal government to force organizations affliated with that religon and run by it to provide free chocolate to all their employee’s, simply because the government feels it’s in people’s best interest to eat chocolate at work?
  3. I do not know when the soul is formed, I would not even presume to understand that process at all. However, I do believe that the moment an egg and a sperm meet…a unique human individual is created, and that person deserves a right to life.
  4. I would never vote for Obama, and never have. He was a terrible senator and has been an even worse President. Pick just about any issue from abortion to taxes, and I pretty much disagree with him 100%. I look at everything a candidate stands for before making a decision to support them, that includes social and economical issues. I have yet to encouter a candidate that I liked everything about them except their stance on abortion. Most conservatives are conservative in all areas.
Again PLEASE do not hyjack this thread into a debate about different beliefs about Birth Control. THis is about standing up for the right of people to freely practice their religon.
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👍

:blessyou:
 
Alix1912 said:
  1. The crux of this issue is not birth control but religoius freedom. Replace birth control with some other thing…like Chocolate Bars. Say a religon had an objection to eating Chocolate, is it OK for the Federal government to force organizations affliated with that religon and run by it to provide free chocolate to all their employee’s, simply because the government feels it’s in people’s best interest to eat chocolate at work?
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Well said!!

However, we do not need to replace the birth control issue with “chocolate bars”. We can replace it with the "ministerial exception"in the case of a Lutheran school. This administration is in full attack mode against religious organizations, including the LCMS.
nytimes.com/2012/01/12/us/supreme-court-recognizes-religious-exception-to-job-discrimination-laws.html?pagewanted=all

If we allow our doctrinal differences to get in the way of standing together against anti-religious tyranny, we are in trouble. As was said by Thomas Paine, “If we do not hang together, we shall surely hang separately.”

If we stand shoulder to shoulder now, and win these battles, perhaps we can discuss our doctrinal differences later. If we don’t, the chances are our freedom of speech will fall alng side our freedom of religion.

Right now, in this country, we really need each other.

Jon
 
JonNC said:
Well said!!

However, we do not need to replace the birth control issue with “chocolate bars”. We can replace it with the "ministerial exception"in the case of a Lutheran school. This administration is in full attack mode against religious organizations, including the LCMS.
nytimes.com/2012/01/12/us/supreme-court-recognizes-religious-exception-to-job-discrimination-laws.html?pagewanted=all

If we allow our doctrinal differences to get in the way of standing together against anti-religious tyranny, we are in trouble. As was said by Thomas Paine, “If we do not hang together, we shall surely hang separately.”

If we stand shoulder to shoulder now, and win these battles, perhaps we can discuss our doctrinal differences later. If we don’t, the chances are our freedom of speech will fall alng side our freedom of religion.

Right now, in this country, we really need each other.

Jon
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Thank you.

Everyone please…write your congressman and senators. Tell them that this is NOT ok and you are opposed to it…hold them to protecting the constitution.
 
This is a statement by the LCMS.

lcms.org/page.aspx?pid=1330

In part, it says,
“In addition, I encourage the members of the LCMS to join with me in supporting efforts to preserve our essential right to exercise our religious beliefs. This action by HHS will have the effect of forcing many religious organizations to choose between following the letter of the law and operating within the framework of their religious tenets. We add our voice to the long list of those championing for the continued ability to act according to the dictates of their faith, and provide compassionate care and clear Christian witness to society’s most vulnerable, without being discriminated against by government.
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Jon
 
Alix1912 said:
I am not Catholic. I am Lutheran MS. I do not have any moral issue with barrier birth control, though I do major issues with anything that harms an already conceived child. Despite the fact that I do not completely share the Catholic Church’s beliefs, I do believe that they have a right to those beliefs, and that right is and should be protected by the 1st Ammendment.

That being said the recent HHS ruling is WRONG, on every level, and it is a direct and clear violation to the US constitution.

I am so glad that the Catholic Clergy and leadership of America are not taking this assault to their Religion lightly. Thank you for standing up, and know that many of your non Catholic brothers and sisters are standing with you. I have already spoken and written to my elected officals and I will continue to do so until this mandate is removed.

I call on everyone who regularly visits this page and is not Catholic to stand with their Catholic brothers and sisters and fight this assault on our freedom.
Click to expand...
Thank you brother in Christ! What I believe our Protestant brothers and sisters in Christ and other religions as well are (hopefully) acutely aware of, is that this seems to be only the beginning…yes, they’re now coming after Catholics mainly, and after that…like Archbishop Dolan has said…“What’s Next?” If they keep up the attack on freedom for those of faith…it will affect everyone.
Thank you again and yes! We must now stand united!!
 
JonNC said:
Well said!!

However, we do not need to replace the birth control issue with “chocolate bars”. We can replace it with the "ministerial exception"in the case of a Lutheran school. This administration is in full attack mode against religious organizations, including the LCMS.
nytimes.com/2012/01/12/us/supreme-court-recognizes-religious-exception-to-job-discrimination-laws.html?pagewanted=all

If we allow our doctrinal differences to get in the way of standing together against anti-religious tyranny, we are in trouble. As was said by Thomas Paine, “If we do not hang together, we shall surely hang separately.”

If we stand shoulder to shoulder now, and win these battles, perhaps we can discuss our doctrinal differences later. If we don’t, the chances are our freedom of speech will fall alng side our freedom of religion.

Right now, in this country, we really need each other.

Jon
Click to expand...
I agree with you. There aren’t a whole lot of Lutherans around here (though those that are, are all LCMS…this being Southern Missouri and all) but there are worlds of Evangelicals and even more Fundamentalists. I have not the least problem standing shoulder to shoulder with any of those folks for the sake of religious freedom and the right to life.

I’m not in any way a person who thinks one religion is as “right” as another. I’m Catholic, and I’ll remain Catholic forever. But there are a lot of extremely moral and genuinely religious Protestants. I grew up in the Bible Belt and live here still, and most of my friends are Protestants. I respect that, and them.

Certainly, Lutherans ought to be commended for holding the line in the Hosana Tabor case. It was an important case. The Obama administration actually argued that the government, rather than the churches, ought to be able to determine who is a “minister” of a church and who isn’t. An astounding bit of arrogance and disrespect, and it tells one just how contemptuous of religious convictions Obama really is.

I truly do believe devout Protestants ought to be alarmed at this latest decree of the Obama administration (among others). As the largest single church in the U.S., if the Catholic Church gets swept aside in this, smaller churches will have little chance to successfully resist new suppressions of religion, the Hosana Tabor victory notwithstanding. Obama’s attempt to dominate religious organizations will not end with Hosana Tabor, nor will it end with the Obamacare abortion coverage mandates.
 
Our churches might not always agree but our Churches both know that this is Wrong.

Glad to have your help.
 
Like others mentioned, there is more here than meets the eye. I can imagine this
should help change the amount of Catholic support this administration got last
time around…
 
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