This is true. My cats behave like human teenagers. (They are not human teenagers, however; they are cats, so the consequences for their behaviour are different than if they were teenagers.)
He most likely intended to mean that they don’t have eternal life, like we do. Of course animals have souls, but their souls go out when they die - they don’t go to Heaven (or to Hell), or live on as ghosts.
Your human child comes ahead of your pet, for sure. That doesn’t mean that you don’t take good care of your pet, but if there comes a choice between the pet and the child, the child gets priority - if you become unemployed, and the choice is to stop feeding your child, or sell your pet, then of course you sell the pet.
I know, this is what he meant. And, its what I disagree with. Animals go to heaven also. I don’t know if every animal goes to heaven but I think so. Animals are not born with original sin, they do not go to judgement like we do. Animals are more like a gift from God. God loves his creation. He didn’t go to all that effort over something that would just be terminated.
**That is a little extereme to kill yourself, don’t you think? **
I think that where people get confused about the idea of animals go to heaven is that there seems to be a prevalent notion that we can describe heaven. As I understand it, heaven is indescribable in human terms. All through out the Bible this point is clearly made. I agree that The Lord would not create something to just throw it away. I also agree that animals will be in heaven. The problem is that everyone thinks it is going to be just like earth only nice. This arises from the notion of the “RAPTURE”; a misunderstanding of the resurrection. There seems to be this idea that at some undesignated point in time,we will all “change in the twinkling of an eye” at the same time. The Lord already did it. And there are stories of Enoch and Methuselah and then there is Mary and a few others that it has already happened to. Now if Mary is supposed to release souls from purgatory on Saturdays, does this not imply that every Saturday, someone makes into heaven in their glorified body? (and why Saturday?
) The point I am trying to make is that to try and understand this from a human experience perspective is wrong according to the Bible.Just a tidbit about memory and emotion. Maybe you can expand on that.I’m just about to start grad school and I do a lot of work with emotion and memory. We work with animals a lot (note: EVERYTHING must get passed through an ethics board to get the green light) specifically to study emotion, partly because the part of the brain that deals with “base” emotions (especially fear and anger) are in the oldest part of the brain. The idea with emotions is that (like any other trait we have), it serves a purpose, ex: fear can help alert us to danger in the environment.
So in conclusion, YES, I believe animals have emotions! Whether they experience them in the same way or maybe have the range or complexity of emotions we have, is a completely different debate.
There has to be an **appraisal **of the event/situation, same with fear. So it depends how you define thought.
Of course. But as you say, there has to be an appraisal of the event/situation. Then the fear comes, but you aren’t thinking about the fear at all. It just comes. When someone sees something scary, I doubt they are saying to themselves, I want to be afraid and so I will make myself afraid. After the sight is appraised as you say, then the emotion comes. Another example: a mother sees her son doing something bad. She becomes angry. I doubt she thought about being angry. Her anger is an irrational response to the event which she did, as you will, think about. What will she do with her anger? That will take thought.
i figured i was the only dissenter.
). when i call opie, he comes running, is he running to me because he feels some emotion for me?, or that he likes me? or is it that he has become trained to come over time because i usually have a little bacon around? or because i scratch his ears and it stimulates his nervous system? when opie is on the kitchen counter and i walk in there, he immediately jumps down, is that because he is “afraid” or is it a conditioned response from all the times ive had to kick him off the counter?Facial and body expressions, although these can be faked (acting). Then again some can’t.
Hope my boss doesn’t know about this study
you had asked what proof i had. i have, and no one has “proof” that another person is exeriencing emotions, after all, your not in their head, they might be a ceylon like the the infiltrators on “battle star galactica” im kidding, but it illustrates my point.
obviously then, we cannot use 'theory of mind" to judge that animals have emotions, that would be anthropomorphism itself because it is assuming that our mutually shared “theory of mind” is applicable to animals.
even were there proof of a theory of mind in animals, which there is not. that still doesnt come to be evidence that animals have emotions, it would only demonstrate social behavior, that we see in any number of animals, and could just as easily be programmed into machines, to interact with one another as we see rudimentarily in robot soccer, popularmechanics.com/science/robotics/3051166.html?page=3
i admire the curiosity, but i hardly think one needs a poll to understand it is a very common belief. of course if you attempt to use that poll in our conversation on the thread you posted i will point out that it is the fallacy of argument from popularity.
though that is obviously not redhens intention, there are a great number of PETA like organisations and thinkers who do use such common beliefs to argue for equal rights for animals. the devovlement of such arguments lead to our good friend peter singers doorstep of preference utilitarianism, a disgusting way to think in my mind. simply the end justifies any means.I think it is possible people may be asking for your point is because it seems like innocent, simple questions like this are going to be the basis for arguing some agenda that the people who are voting may or may not even want anything to do with, let alone agree with you on. It could be just what it looks like- a simple poll, a matter of curiosity- or it could be the grounds for some other debate, and people don’t like throwing in their opinion only to have it used against them later as “ammo” about something they don’t agree with, because they did not have the chance to qualify/explain their response with an awareness of what you were really getting at in the first place. Hopefully, that’s just a bit of paranoia and you’re really just honestly curious about whether most CAF members think their dog can be frightened.
You have never heard of it, but I have experienced it numerous times. I could tell you stories and stories (I work with animals). Animals *are *very intuitive, above and beyond natural instinct, learned behavior, and interpretation of their environments and factors within their environments. Here’s one good example that sticks out in my mind: I was in great mental distress and grief after the loss of my mother. I was walking down the street, minding my own business, showing no outward signs of my inner emotions, when a dog broke free from its owner (they were walking across the street from me and were not in close proximity to me), The dog bolted across the street toward me–I did not even see him coming–he knocked me to the ground and started licking me tenderly and gently. The owner rushed over and was very startled that her dog would do this. He had never done this before (break away and rush to a stanger). I did not know this dog, or the owner. My only explanation is that this dog perceived that I was in need and responded. After talking to the owner she told me that he was very sensitive and responsive to ***her ***emotions in their day to day contact. It was astounding to both of us that this dog reacted to me in this very positive way, as if he sensed I was distressed and in need of some affection that he was happy to give me–a total stranger.
