Non religious meditation

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AmericanFighter

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I get on the internet all the time and I see Christians of multiple sects saying meditation is wrong but they always seem to talk about meditation in the bhudist and zan zen state however to me it seems like meditation doesn’t have to be religious.

I can understand if it alters your perception of God or morality but for me I just like meditate to clear my mind. For instance I play pool competat and right before a big match I like to meditate and clear my mind of doubt and pressure to block distractions. I do it to have the same effect in other aspects of my life but nothing religious.

My morals my life and my beliefs are rooted in the holy trinity and the bible even when I meditate that never changes.

If it has nothing to do with religion God or morality why is it wrong?
 
It is wrong to meditate and clear your mind. Even it is not for religious purposes you could put yourself in a trance on accident.

If you close your eyes and think of something good this is ok.
 
AmericanFighter said:
I get on the internet all the time and I see Christians of multiple sects saying meditation is wrong but they always seem to talk about meditation in the bhudist and zan zen state however to me it seems like meditation doesn’t have to be religious.

I can understand if it alters your perception of God or morality but for me I just like meditate to clear my mind. For instance I play pool competat and right before a big match I like to meditate and clear my mind of doubt and pressure to block distractions. I do it to have the same effect in other aspects of my life but nothing religious.

My morals my life and my beliefs are rooted in the holy trinity and the bible even when I meditate that never changes.

If it has nothing to do with religion God or morality why is it wrong?
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What you describe sounds more like focussing and getting your “game face” on than meditating to me.

What exactly is your primary Catholic Teaching source for saying it is wrong?
If you haven’t found one then maybe your intuitions are correct.
 
AmericanFighter said:
I get on the internet all the time and I see Christians of multiple sects saying meditation is wrong but they always seem to talk about meditation in the bhudist and zan zen state however to me it seems like meditation doesn’t have to be religious.

I can understand if it alters your perception of God or morality but for me I just like meditate to clear my mind. For instance I play pool competat and right before a big match I like to meditate and clear my mind of doubt and pressure to block distractions. I do it to have the same effect in other aspects of my life but nothing religious.

My morals my life and my beliefs are rooted in the holy trinity and the bible even when I meditate that never changes.

If it has nothing to do with religion God or morality why is it wrong?
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It is almost as if some people are afraid to stop thinking as though they could only keep the devil out of their mind by constant thinking so as to not allow any room for him. They forget that Jesus and the Holy Spirit dwell in us, and that by suspending our self centered thoughts we draw closer to Him even, quite possibly if that is not our main intent.
 
Deus_tecum said:
It is almost as if some people are afraid to stop thinking as though they could only keep the devil out of their mind by constant thinking so as to not allow any room for him. They forget that Jesus and the Holy Spirit dwell in us, and that by suspending our self centered thoughts we draw closer to Him even, quite possibly if that is not our main intent.
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You know that thought had crossed my. If you are secure in your soul and secure in you connection to the father son and the Holy Spirit why are you afraid?

Although I walk through the vally of death I shall fear no evil for The Lord is with me.

The Lord is my Shepard and salvation of whom shall I be afraid?

Why do we fear the devil will take us over if we sit in silence if our faith is so strong? Do these people feel insecure in their faith?
 
This letter, approved and published by the Vatican, might be helpful:
Letter To The Bishops Of The Catholic Church On Some Aspects Of Christian Meditation
from the Congregation For The Doctrine Of The Faith
It is a bit lengthy, and I have only skimmed it, but it does not disapprove generally of these meditation practices. The letter mentions several errors to avoid, for example, to equate God (or the divine) with any human experience or state of mind, to pretend that we can become God (or become a part of God), to look only within ourselves for the divine, or to deny the necessity of Jesus as the way to God. I am vastly oversimplifying it and may have said it wrong, so feel free to read it for yourself.

Here are a few excerpts:
In order to draw near to that mystery of union with God, which the Greek Fathers called the divinization of man, and to grasp accurately the manner in which this is realized, it is necessary in the first place to bear in mind that man is essentially a creature, and remains such for eternity, so that an absorbing of the human self into the divine self is never possible, not even in the highest states of grace. However, one must recognize that the human person is created in the “image and likeness” of God, …
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The majority of the great religions which have sought union with God in prayer have also pointed out ways to achieve it. Just as “the Catholic Church rejects nothing of what is true and holy in these religions,” neither should these ways be rejected out of hand simply because they are not Christian. On the contrary, one can take from them what is useful so long as the Christian conception of prayer, its logic and requirements are never obscured…
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… one has to interpret correctly the teaching of those masters who recommend “emptying” the spirit of all sensible representations and of every concept, while remaining lovingly attentive to God. In this way, the person praying creates an empty space which can then be filled by the richness of God…
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On this topic St. Augustine is an excellent teacher: if you want to find God, he says, abandon the exterior world and re-enter into yourself. However, he continues, do not remain in yourself, but go beyond yourself because you are not God: He is deeper and greater than you. “I look for his substance in my soul and I do not find it; I have however meditated on the search for God and, reaching out to him, through created things, I have sought to know ‘the invisible perfections of God’ (Rom 1:20).” “To remain in oneself”: this is the real danger. The great Doctor of the Church recommends concentrating on oneself, but also transcending the self which is not God, but only a creature. God is “deeper than my inmost being and higher than my greatest height.” In fact God is in us and with us, but he transcends us in his mystery.
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From the dogmatic point of view, it is impossible to arrive at a perfect love of God if one ignores his giving of himself to us through his Incarnate Son, who was crucified and rose from the dead. In Him, under the action of the Holy Spirit, we participate, through pure grace, in the interior life of God… While he raises us up, God is free to “empty” us of all that holds us back in this world, to draw us completely into the Trinitarian life of his eternal love. However, this gift can only be granted “in Christ through the Holy Spirit,” and not through our own efforts, withdrawing ourselves from his revelation.
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Eastern Christian meditation has valued psychophysical symbolism, often absent in western forms of prayer. It can range from a specific bodily posture to the basic life functions, such as breathing or the beating of the heart. The exercise of the “Jesus Prayer,” for example, which adapts itself to the natural rhythm of breathing can, at least for a certain time, be of real help to many people… Understood in an inadequate and incorrect way, the symbolism can … become an idol… it can degenerate into a cult of the body and can lead surreptitiously to considering all bodily sensations as spiritual experiences.
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From the rich variety of Christian prayer as proposed by the Church, each member of the faithful should seek and find his own way, his own form of prayer. But all of these personal ways, in the end, flow into the way to the Father, which is how Jesus Christ has described himself. In the search for his own way, each person will, therefore, let himself be led not so much by his personal tastes as by the Holy Spirit, who guides him, through Christ, to the Father.
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And so, AmericanFighter, the bottom line is that it is not wrong.
 
Beryllos said:
This letter, approved and published by the Vatican, might be helpful:
Letter To The Bishops Of The Catholic Church On Some Aspects Of Christian Meditation
from the Congregation For The Doctrine Of The Faith
It is a bit lengthy, and I have only skimmed it, but it does not disapprove generally of these meditation practices. The letter mentions several errors to avoid, for example, to equate God (or the divine) with any human experience or state of mind, to pretend that we can become God (or become a part of God), to look only within ourselves for the divine, or to deny the necessity of Jesus as the way to God. I am vastly oversimplifying it and may have said it wrong, so feel free to read it for yourself.

Here are a few excerpts:

And so, AmericanFighter, the bottom line is that it is not wrong.
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Great post thank you
 
AmericanFighter said:
I get on the internet all the time and I see Christians of multiple sects saying meditation is wrong but they always seem to talk about meditation in the bhudist and zan zen state however to me it seems like meditation doesn’t have to be religious.
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There are Christian meditations you can use, such as Saying the Jesus Prayer.

Some Buddhist preliminary practices do not involve any religious content, such as counting breaths: you breathe and count to ten breaths.

rossum
 
I would like to add something from SOME ASPECTS OF CHRISTIAN MEDITATION that people conveniently miss when they use it to argue against non-religious meditation:
Some people today turn to these methods for therapeutic reasons. The spiritual restlessness arising from a life subjected to the driving pace of a technologically advanced society also brings a certain number of Christians to seek in these methods of prayer a path to interior peace and psychic balance. This psychological aspect is not dealt with in the present letter, which instead emphasizes the theological and spiritual implications of the question.
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The letter from the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith explicitly excludes psychological motivations.
 
myway said:
It is wrong to meditate and clear your mind. Even it is not for religious purposes you could put yourself in a trance on accident.

If you close your eyes and think of something good this is ok.
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Why? You put yourself into a “trance” every time you go to sleep. Meditation doesn’t put you into mental states you don’t already experience in your daily life.
 
mrbean007 said:
Why? You put yourself into a “trance” every time you go to sleep. Meditation doesn’t put you into mental states you don’t already experience in your daily life.
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As far as I can tell the CC says do not use meditation, other than prayer, for religious purposes which makes sense. In a similar thread there is a discussion on the demerits of meditating on nothingness or to quiet the mind because it opens you to demons. Perhaps someone more familiar with Catholic beliefs can shed light on that.
 
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