Non_catholics Feel Free

[traillius]

Feel free to mock my beliefs.
Feel free to doubt my salvation.
Feel free to call the catholic church names.
Feel free to question my christianity.

This oughta sum it up:
" If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first. "
" blessed are you when they persecute you for my sake. "

Doing any of those things above is simply fulfilling the scriptures listed.
I will leave it to others to convince you that Catholics are the most complete christians.
Meanwhile I will praise God for any persecution that any non catholics throw my way. For my reward will be great in heaven… And when you get to purgatory, God and you can work out any score that is against you on account of any evil you spoke or did.

 

[JonNC]

=traillius;5355367]
Feel free to mock my beliefs.

Judge not that ye be not judged.

Feel free to doubt my salvation.

Your salvation is between you and God.

Feel free to call the catholic church names.

How about “The Holy Catholic Church”

Feel free to question my christianity.

See my first response.

This oughta sum it up:
" If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first. "
" blessed are you when they persecute you for my sake. "

Doing any of those things above is simply fulfilling the scriptures listed.
I will leave it to others to convince you that Catholics are the most complete christians.
Meanwhile I will praise God for any persecution that any non catholics throw my way. For my reward will be great in heaven… And when you get to purgatory, God and you can work out any score that is against you on account of any evil you spoke or did.

What brought this on?

Jon

 

[Eleve]

Feel free to mock my beliefs.
Feel free to doubt my salvation.
Feel free to call the catholic church names.
Feel free to question my christianity.

This oughta sum it up:
" If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first. "
" blessed are you when they persecute you for my sake. "

Doing any of those things above is simply fulfilling the scriptures listed.
I will leave it to others to convince you that Catholics are the most complete christians.
Meanwhile I will praise God for any persecution that any non catholics throw my way. For my reward will be great in heaven… And when you get to purgatory, God and you can work out any score that is against you on account of any evil you spoke or did.

I think most of us would prefer not to do any of those things. As Jon asked: is there something in this forum in particular that worries you?

 

[rinnie]

Judge not that ye be not judged.

Your salvation is between you and God.

How about “The Holy Catholic Church”

See my first response.

What brought this on?

Jon

I agree with you Jon, I don’t feel real christians would ever really want to do any if those things. I think we are all Called to God in different ways. God understands everyone.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

This thread is perplexing? I don’t know that many Protestants who deserve this? Most Protestants I know spend about ten seconds a year pondering Catholicism. They, just like most regular Catholics, go about their worship, daily lives, and fellowship trying to serve Christ and do the best they can. They don’t actively wake up in the morning denying transubstantiation and apostolic succession and more than the common Catholic wakes up in the morning ready to argue about faith-alone doctrines and the Formula of Concord or the 95 Theses of Luther. This thread is a tad bizarre. What brought it on?

 

[phoenix3212]

This thread is perplexing? I don’t know that many Protestants who deserve this? Most Protestants I know spend about ten seconds a year pondering Catholicism. They, just like most regular Catholics, go about their worship, daily lives, and fellowship trying to serve Christ and do the best they can. They don’t actively wake up in the morning denying transubstantiation and apostolic succession and more than the common Catholic wakes up in the morning ready to argue about faith-alone doctrines and the Formula of Concord or the 95 Theses of Luther. This thread is a tad bizarre. What brought it on?

Unfortunately, many do. Go look up a video about Catholicism on YouTube and read the comments. You’re likely to find plenty calling it a “prison” or “the biggest pedophile organization in the world” or something like that.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

Feel free to mock my beliefs.
Feel free to doubt my salvation.
Feel free to call the catholic church names.
Feel free to question my christianity.

This oughta sum it up:
" If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first. "
" blessed are you when they persecute you for my sake. "

Doing any of those things above is simply fulfilling the scriptures listed.

You do realise there is a flaw in your reasoning ? It goes like so:​

• Major Premise - Great poets are persecuted
• Minor Premise - I am persecuted
• Conclusion - therefore, I am a great poet

What your syllogism ignores, is that it is possible to be hated not because one is Christ’s, but because one acts in a manner deserving of condemnation: as St. Peter points out in 1 Peter 4:

• 12([Z (http://forums.catholic-questions.org/#cen-NASB-30459Z))Beloved, do not be surprised at the (AA)fiery ordeal among you, which comes upon you for your testing, as though some strange thing were happening to you;
• 13but to the degree that you (AB)share the sufferings of Christ, keep on rejoicing, so that also at the (AC)revelation of His glory (AD)you may rejoice with exultation.
• 14If you are reviled (AE)for the name of Christ, (AF)you are blessed, (AG)because the Spirit of glory and of God rests on you.
• 15Make sure that (AH)none of you suffers as a murderer, or thief, or evildoer, or a (AI)troublesome meddler;
• 16but if anyone suffers as a (AJ)Christian, he is not to be ashamed, but is to (AK)glorify God in this name.
• 17For it is time for judgment (AL)to begin with (AM)the household of God; and if it (AN)begins with us first, what will be the outcome for those (AO)who do not obey the (AP)gospel of God?

Stalin was well hated: but nobody is likely to say that his being hated is evidence - let alone proof - of his splendid Christian chararacter. The known facts do not on the whole suggest he was terribly Christian.

Besides, if being hated were enough to prove people Christian, where would that leave Catholic attacks on the Reformers ? Protestants could apply those verses to Protestantism, which attracts a great deal of Catholic ridicule & dislike. If your syllogism is logically valid for Catholicism, it is logically valid for Protestantism. There is not much to be gained by a valid syllogism that proves more than one wants it to. Since however it is logically flawed, the syllogism is not valid but invalid, so no inferences can be drawn from it, whether against or for either form of faith.

I will leave it to others to convince you that Catholics are the most complete christians.
Meanwhile I will praise God for any persecution that any non catholics throw my way. For my reward will be great in heaven… And when you get to purgatory, God and you can work out any score that is against you on account of any evil you spoke or did.

Why do so many Christians in the US seem to have persecution mania ? STM you lot are pampered rotten - not persecuted. What would not be “persecution” ? ​

 

[Eucharisted]

Why do so many Christians in the US seem to have persecution mania ? STM you lot are pampered rotten - not persecuted. What would not be “persecution” ?

A persecution complex comes up when you believe your group is being unfairly treated. But it’s certainly not persecution to be called names or insulted. That’s just bad manners.

 

[survive]

What would not be “persecution” ?

Being able to use religious terms in public places without being officially silenced. Being able to walk to the grocery or laundry place without being on guard against groups of hissing people blaming me for things their people are far more culpable for than mine anyway. Not having to pay taxes for use in paying salaries I can’t even dream of to “artists” who make images a four-year-old could make, which have just one message: war on me, war on my faith, war on God. Being able to talk to the press and expect equal or near-equal coverage when we are assaulted for religious reasons, instead of blacked out media. Not having to pay taxes to a school system with classes that exist for the sole purpose of teaching mistrust and scorn for Christian parents (the curricula were leaked a generation ago and are still in use, and I remember some of that “education”). Being able to buy groceries without being “entertained” by songs whose lyrics falsely accuse us and imply a call to action against us. Oh, and college. I’d like to live in a country where voicing a Christian or even Chrisrian-compatible viewpoint isn’t a huge drawback to passing grades and a bigger drawback to employment at a major public college or university. Where a Christian artist of talent and energy is rewarded at least equally to an anti-Christian artist who scrawls anti-Christian slogans on a board and signs it. Where the entertainment industry doesn’t show almost all clergy and religious as stupid, cruel, insane, hypocritical dangerous types and almost anti-Christian characters as desirable, smart, and successful.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

A persecution complex comes up when you believe your group is being unfairly treated. But it’s certainly not persecution to be called names or insulted. That’s just bad manners.

Yet there is so much talk of persecution that one could easily get the impression that half the Church in the USA had been sent to a prison camp. If Christians in the UK had the problems that bother folk in the US so much, we’d be laughing ​

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

Being able to use religious terms in public places without being officially silenced. Being able to walk to the grocery or laundry place without being on guard against groups of hissing people blaming me for things their people are far more culpable for than mine anyway. Not having to pay taxes for use in paying salaries I can’t even dream of to “artists” who make images a four-year-old could make, which have just one message: war on me, war on my faith, war on God. Being able to talk to the press and expect equal or near-equal coverage when we are assaulted for religious reasons, instead of blacked out media. Not having to pay taxes to a school system with classes that exist for the sole purpose of teaching mistrust and scorn for Christian parents (the curricula were leaked a generation ago and are still in use, and I remember some of that “education”). Being able to buy groceries without being “entertained” by songs whose lyrics falsely accuse us and imply a call to action against us. Oh, and college. I’d like to live in a country where voicing a Christian or even Chrisrian-compatible viewpoint isn’t a huge drawback to passing grades and a bigger drawback to employment at a major public college or university. Where a Christian artist of talent and energy is rewarded at least equally to an anti-Christian artist who scrawls anti-Christian slogans on a board and signs it. Where the entertainment industry doesn’t show almost all clergy and religious as stupid, cruel, insane, hypocritical dangerous types and almost anti-Christian characters as desirable, smart, and successful.

Thanks for that very helpful answer Can’t say I think that I agree very far with you as to what constitutes persecution - but it’s a good clear answer, just as asked for ISTM that the objectionable things are no more than one might expect in any country that is not a one-party state; one of the drawbacks with personal freedom is X is, within the limits of the law, free to do what Y finds objectionable. Thanks again.​

 

[Eucharisted]

Yet there is so much talk of persecution that one could easily get the impression that half the Church in the USA had been sent to a prison camp. If Christians in the UK had the problems that bother folk in the US so much, we’d be laughing ​

Yes, because such talk is the fruit of overexaggerated anxiety, which in turn is the fruit of self-love. Fear has no place in the Christian heart, for it has its hope and trust in the Lord. However, talk of persecution would be legit if persecution or signs of persecution were in place. For example, Christians being silenced when it comes to the political community, or Christians losing their jobs for following their conseciences, or politicans attempting to change Christianity. Such would be signs of a coming persecution.

 

[traillius]

Sometimes I just need to vent. If charged with being completely rational, I would be acquitted due to lack of evidence. I only can pray that If my christian catholicism were put on trial, that I would be found guilty of faith in the first degree.

 

[O.S.Luke]

Feel free to mock my beliefs.
Feel free to doubt my salvation.
Feel free to call the catholic church names.
Feel free to question my christianity.

I don’t feel free to do any of those things. Neither should any other Christian.

 

[traillius]

Well at least 2 christians I have known personally, in real life( not from CAF ), have told me that I was not “saved,” whatever that means. Alot of non catholic christian internet ’ chatter’ I have read is blatanly anti-catholic and condemns catholics, unless they are " saved." So please forgive me, for what may appear as generalizing, but is based on real experiences.` As far as whether or not I am saved, I will simply have faith and trust The Triune God, and leave the cliches, catch phrases, and buzzwords to other people.

 

[JonNC]

Well at least 2 christians I have known personally, in real life( not from CAF ), have told me that I was not “saved,” whatever that means. Alot of non catholic christian internet ’ chatter’ I have read is blatanly anti-catholic and condemns catholics, unless they are " saved." So please forgive me, for what may appear as generalizing, but is based on real experiences.` As far as whether or not I am saved, I will simply have faith and trust The Triune God, and leave the cliches, catch phrases, and buzzwords to other people.

That’s the ticket. I’m sure many here will join me in praying the Holy Spirit lift this burden from you.

Jon

 

[cyberwolf001]

Feel free to mock my beliefs.

Well the only ONE God thing is odd but not mock worthy…

Feel free to doubt my salvation.

Salvation from what? There is no eternal torment you need to be saved from Traillius.

Feel free to call the catholic church names.

Well She is inconsistent, contradicts her own dogmas (then says they weren’t dogmas to start with) and plays a mean semantic game. But if it helps you grow closer to the Divine that’s all that counts.

This is by the by why I left if someone could disprove it I’d gladly return.

Feel free to question my christianity.

None of my business.

This oughta sum it up:
" If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first. "
" blessed are you when they persecute you for my sake. "

Doing any of those things above is simply fulfilling the scriptures listed.
I will leave it to others to convince you that Catholics are the most complete christians.
Meanwhile I will praise God for any persecution that any non catholics throw my way. For my reward will be great in heaven… And when you get to purgatory, God and you can work out any score that is against you on account of any evil you spoke or did.

So basically your trolling for persecution?

Here’s an idea. Go to the Politics forum and post an bit praising the liberal things the Church supports. Trust me you’ll be persecuted faster than when Judas lead the Romans into gethsemane

Well at least 2 christians I have known personally, in real life( not from CAF ), have told me that I was not “saved,” whatever that means. Alot of non catholic christian internet ’ chatter’ I have read is blatanly anti-catholic and condemns catholics, unless they are " saved." So please forgive me, for what may appear as generalizing, but is based on real experiences.` As far as whether or not I am saved, I will simply have faith and trust The Triune God, and leave the cliches, catch phrases, and buzzwords to other people.

Ahhh makes sense I sometimes find myself defending the Church when this happens. [Gets out medication for those going into shock after reading this.]

 

[slyboots]

New on Youtube…June 24, 2009
youtube.com/watch?v=YUjPmj81FvU

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

New on Youtube…June 24, 2009
youtube.com/watch?v=YUjPmj81FvU

That was bizarre The speaker has very odd ideas about Catholicism (though no odder than some Catholic ideas about some Protestant beliefs); & spoke as though English was not his first language. Combined with the pictures in very light grey, it was all most strange.​

Thanks though

 

[Jon_Hus]

Well at least 2 christians I have known personally, in real life( not from CAF ), have told me that I was not “saved,” whatever that means. Alot of non catholic christian internet ’ chatter’ I have read is blatanly anti-catholic and condemns catholics, unless they are " saved." So please forgive me, for what may appear as generalizing, but is based on real experiences.` As far as whether or not I am saved, I will simply have faith and trust The Triune God, and leave the cliches, catch phrases, and buzzwords to other people.

traillius,

Even a casual reading of this sub-forum “Non-Catholic Religions” reveals a number of Catholics who tell non-Catholics (Protestants) that since they don’t belong to the Catholic Church they are not Christians, are not in the process of being saved. Do you spend any time pondering what that means to them? If a protestant says “I will simply have faith and trust The Triune God, and leave the clichés, catch phrases, and buzzwords to other people” do you accept that as legitimate and move on your life?

I’m grateful that I live in a time and place where I can worship God as I see fit, can own, read and study the Bible at will and can be publically critical of both church and state without fear of being tied to a stake and turned to ashes.