Not everyone Called to be Catholic?

[WildCatholic]

I had a good friend who is a seminarian tell me this one time when I was talking about another friend of mine who was a very devout Catholic, but left the church for an E-Free Church or something like that. Anyway, he said “Not everyone’s called to be catholic”. Now I could understand if my female friend wasn’t very well formed as a Catholic (and she might not have been. Just going to mass doesnt make one fully formed) but as I said she attended Mass and was pretty involved, but bam she decided to leave the church (or as she put it “Grow in faith” since she only calls herself Christian). To me that seems like rejecting the faith which sadly puts a soul in jeopardy.

This disturbs me because my seminarian friend is otherwise very orthodox and logical and loves the faith, but saying this bugs me. You can’t just leave the Catholic faith and expect the road to heaven to be easy. I know it sounds harsh, but i guess i’d just like an explenation on whether some people are not meant to be Catholic

 

[Della]

He may have been trying to allay your fears for her, but still, it wasn’t really the best comment to make, IHMO. God wants us to be one in faith not divided, and he wants to have the fullness of the truth and the sacraments and the graces they impart. So, your friend has cut herself off from the very things that could ensure her salvation. Definitely not a good thing.

This doesn’t mean, however, that she is doomed. She may have to “wander in the wilderness” for a time to appreciate what she left behind. I would not say it was God’s will she leave the Church–that would be ridiculous, but I would say that her doing so may make her see what she is missing. Like the Father in the story of the prodigal son, he had to let him go in the hopes he would see how wrong he was and return. Perhaps that’s what your seminarian friend meant to convey.

 

[jmjconder]

I had a good friend who is a seminarian tell me this one time when I was talking about another friend of mine who was a very devout Catholic, but left the church for an E-Free Church or something like that. Anyway, he said “Not everyone’s called to be catholic”. Now I could understand if my female friend wasn’t very well formed as a Catholic (and she might not have been. Just going to mass doesnt make one fully formed) but as I said she attended Mass and was pretty involved, but bam she decided to leave the church (or as she put it “Grow in faith” since she only calls herself Christian). To me that seems like rejecting the faith which sadly puts a soul in jeopardy.

This disturbs me because my seminarian friend is otherwise very orthodox and logical and loves the faith, but saying this bugs me. You can’t just leave the Catholic faith and expect the road to heaven to be easy. I know it sounds harsh, but i guess i’d just like an explenation on whether some people are not meant to be Catholic

**I would say that everyone is called to be Catholic…since it is the only way to have unity among all Christians.

Seminarians are still being formed and taught - I have heard some inaccurate statements come out of their mouths.**

 

[signit]

Sometimes I wonder about this one.

Not “cradle Catholics” who left their faith, but those who never were Catholic.

I’m thinking of a friend of my father who attended his Protestant church and was as righteous and God-fearing as anyone, and was a devout member of his church and never smoked or drank.

Maybe God didn’t “call” him to be Catholic? God sure could have used someone like that.

 

[Della]

Sometimes I wonder about this one.

Not “cradle Catholics” who left their faith, but those who never were Catholic.

I’m thinking of a friend of my father who attended his Protestant church and was as righteous and God-fearing as anyone, and was a devout member of his church and never smoked or drank.

Maybe God didn’t “call” him to be Catholic? God sure could have used someone like that.

Most often people stay in the ecclesial communion in which they were brought up. Your father’s friend probably never gave his affiliation a second thought, nor ever asked God if he should be anything else. It probably never occurred to him that he needed to go anywhere else. By reason of his baptism he would have been in imperfect union with the Church, but he never received all the benefits of his baptism by being in a body outside of it. He was no doubt of use to God, as much as he could be. Indeed, he sounds like he did a better job of using the graces God gave him than many a Catholic who doesn’t bother to take advantage of all they could have had and done. According to the Church God will judge non-Catholics by how they used the graces God gave them when they had no real opportunity–through ignorance and other barriers to becoming fully reconciled with Christ’s Church.

 

[lizaanne]

So let’s break this down a bit…

All human beings were created by God - right? = Yes
God wants ALL souls to be in heaven - right? = Yes
We live in a fallen world due to original sin - right? = Yes
We have free will to choose right/wrong - right? = Yes

So…

Because we live in a fallen world, there are those who will be led astray by false teaching, live in circumstances where they will never have the opportunity to learn about the Church, and those who will - of their own free will - chose not to be Catholic, even after they have been told about the Good News.

But — God wants all souls to be in heaven. It is our circumstance of a fallen world and free will that leads us away from Him.

Every single human being is called to be Catholic, because that is where the fullness of truth, and the sure chance at heaven resides.

There is no other response to your seminary friend but to say that he is quite wrong in stating otherwise. God wants EVERY soul, He calls EVERY soul to Him. WE are the ones who reject that call — not the other way around.

~Liza

 

[billcu1]

I would say that not all are called no. Jesus said in prayer in praying for us to the father. “For as many as you have choosen to give to me.” God has other plans too.

 

[lizaanne]

I would say that not all are called no. Jesus said in prayer in praying for us to the father. “For as many as you have choosen to give to me.” God has other plans too.

This makes zero sense.

Are you telling me that God created souls that He does not want with Him in heaven?

~Liza

 

[billcu1]

This makes zero sense.

Are you telling me that God created souls that He does not want with Him in heaven?

~Liza

No but but heaven is not eternal. Heaven and earth will pass away. We will all become united with the trinity eventually. What God wants for us more than anything is for us to be exactly like him.

 

[lizaanne]

No but but heaven is not eternal. Heaven and earth will pass away. We will all become united with the trinity eventually. What God wants for us more than anything is for us to be exactly like him.

We cannot be exactly like God, we cannot be mini-gods. There is only one triune God.

So - when Heaven and Earth pass away, are you suggesting that those souls that have not gone to heaven (or purgatory) have the possibility of still making it to the New Heaven and the New Earth?

~Liza

 

[billcu1]

We cannot be exactly like God, we cannot be mini-gods. There is only one triune God.

So - when Heaven and Earth pass away, are you suggesting that those souls that have not gone to heaven (or purgatory) have the possibility of still making it to the New Heaven and the New Earth?

~Liza

Read THeologia Germanica. The whole point of all this is for us to become the first mover and move of all else. There is only one essence and ours becomes it. Corin says when the imperfect is put off and the perfect is come or something like that.​

St. Paul saith, “When that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done
away.”6 Now mark what is “that which is perfect,” and “that which is in part.”
“That which is perfect” is a Being, who hath comprehended and included all things in
Himself and His own Substance, and without whom, and beside whom, there is no true
Substance, and in whom all things have their Substance. For He is the Substance of all things,
and is in Himself unchangeable and immoveable, and changeth and moveth all things else.
But “that which is in part,” or the Imperfect, is that which hath its source in, or springeth
from the Perfect; just as a brightness or a visible appearance floweth out from the sun or a
candle, and appeareth to be somewhat, this or that. And it is called a creature; and of all
these “things which are in part,” none is the Perfect. So also the Perfect is none of the things
which are in part. The things which are in part can be apprehended, known, and expressed;
but the Perfect cannot be apprehended, known, or expressed by any creature as creature.
Therefore we do not give a name to the Perfect, for it is none of these. The creature as
creature cannot know nor apprehend it, name nor conceive it.

 

[glombo]

I had a good friend who is a seminarian tell me this one time when I was talking about another friend of mine who was a very devout Catholic, but left the church for an E-Free Church or something like that. Anyway, he said “Not everyone’s called to be catholic”. Now I could understand if my female friend wasn’t very well formed as a Catholic (and she might not have been. Just going to mass doesnt make one fully formed) but as I said she attended Mass and was pretty involved, but bam she decided to leave the church (or as she put it “Grow in faith” since she only calls herself Christian). To me that seems like rejecting the faith which sadly puts a soul in jeopardy.

This disturbs me because my seminarian friend is otherwise very orthodox and logical and loves the faith, but saying this bugs me. You can’t just leave the Catholic faith and expect the road to heaven to be easy. I know it sounds harsh, but i guess i’d just like an explenation on whether some people are not meant to be Catholic

heool-- God the Holy Spirit – had me go to a few places to receive the Full Baptism of the Holy Spirit – so that i can function in all the 9 gifts of the Holy Spirit–

if you do not know how to pray and hear the voice of God – regarding his will, than you will only be guessing-- what his will is for other people

 

[lizaanne]

Read THeologia Germanica. The whole point of all this is for us to become the first mover and move of all else. There is only one essence and ours becomes it. Corin says when the imperfect is put off and the perfect is come or something like that.

I’m not dealing with someone who is going to quote garbage from documents prohibited by the Catholic Church.

I’m done here.

~Liza

 

[WildCatholic]

So,it seems like theres some debate on this, though it seems most agree that God wants everyone to be Catholic. Here is another example where my seminarian friend said this. I was talking about a friend of mine who is a lutheran who doesn’t practice much (at least in the sense he doesn’t go to church, he lives a very good life) anyway I mentioned how my lutheran friend talked about liking a Catholic service he attended and i asked if maybe it was a sign God wanted him to. Once again he said "He has to want to, God might not be calling him to be Catholic). Of course maybe my sem friend doesn’t quite know how to put this, or it might be something where he’s right, but doesn’t know how to explain it without sounding heterodox

 

[WildCatholic]

Sometimes I wonder about this one.

Not “cradle Catholics” who left their faith, but those who never were Catholic.

I’m thinking of a friend of my father who attended his Protestant church and was as righteous and God-fearing as anyone, and was a devout member of his church and never smoked or drank.

Maybe God didn’t “call” him to be Catholic? God sure could have used someone like that.

I think the same thing, though I include Catholics who weren’t formed well, or may have had bad experiences (unkind priests or nuns or parishioners, and a whole host of other issues) I mean you’d think God would be more forgiving if say a person left the Catholic church due to say an abusive priest, or relative that happened to be a devout catholic.