Not Roman Catholic, but catholic

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williamkar

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iam a catholic but not of the roman rite. we are almost the same but we don’t belive in the infallbility of the pope. the pncc is the only old catholic church in the u. s. that has valid scaraments that was given by pope paul VI because of true apostalic line
 
Well, I’m a little confused, I don’t know what any of that means.

In before the mudsling/lock. 😃

Eamon

EDIT:// I’m curious, you say you don’t believe in thie infallibility of the pope, yet you state that you are Catholic because the pope gave you permission. Is it possible that the pope was wrong about this (considering that not everything the pope says is infallible, but only certain statements)? How do you rectify these views? Or…am I misunderstanding you?

EDIT #2://Do you guys have a website? All I can find for PPNC is Planned Parenthood of Niagra County.
EDIT #2.5:// I just realized it’s PNCC, not PPNC 😛

EDIT #3:// Grammar works wonders!
 

Ppnc.org

www.ppnc.org www.ppnc.org
The Polish National Catholic Church is a CHRISTIAN DENOMINATION,
formed in 1897 in Scranton, Pennsylvania.
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Slightly lost here…are you Catholic, or a Christian denomination separate from Catholicism.

Question: What is old Catholicism? I suppose I just don’t understand this terminology.

I would also like to state that I hope you are not here simply to start a big fight.

Eamon
 
The Church is made up of baptized Christians who worship together, partake of the sacraments, hear and obey the Word of God.
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So, how is it permissible for non-Catholics to partake of Catholic sacraments (most particularly the Eucharist)?

Also, I have seen nothing on the website yet about your church’s belief in transubstantiation. What is it?

Eamon
 
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williamkar:
iam a catholic but not of the roman rite. we are almost the same but we don’t belive in the infallbility of the pope. the pncc is the only old catholic church in the u. s. that has valid scaraments that was given by pope paul VI because of true apostalic line
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Since you deny the First Vatican Council, which is the last council you accept? Do you believe in the Immaculate Conception or the Assumption?
 
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Genesis315:
Since you deny the First Vatican Council, which is the last council you accept? Do you believe in the Immaculate Conception or the Assumption?
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From what I’ve read (which at this point is almost the whole website), virgin birth is a go.

pncc.org/content/apostolic_succession.pdf

However, there are some serious points of divergence between this church and Catholicism.

I’m going to keep reading.

Eamon
 
OK, according to what I have read, papal infallibility is false, and rather, “infallibility belongs to the whole assembly of true members of the ‘Ecclesia’ or Church, which is represented by its Synod legally and canonically called together, whose decisions are confirmed by the concensus of the Church.” Found on the pdf I gave link to above.

Eamon
 
PNCC= Polish National Catholic Church,
part of the Old Catholic Union of Utretch. Only member church based outside of Western or Central Europe (based in north America) Founded in late 1800’s by Polsih Catholics iresentful of diocesan ownership of parish (anti-heirarchal)

Old Catholics reject Papal Infalibility, Immaculate COnception, and Original sin. Had unsucessful talks with orthodox Church in America, due to unwillingness to abandon western concepts on the trinity, and unsuccesful reunification talks with the Catholic Church over married priests.
 
OK, here’s another quote.

“With magnificent faith in its divine mission and with the great religious aspiration to win the soul and intellect of the Polish people, this movement spread to every section of the country, and the Polish National Catholic Church was established on the basis of democratic Catholicity.”

So, as far as I can tell, it is in no way sanctioned, doesn’t seem to follow Rome, and basically is open to modification by vote of the people in the church. I really don’t think this sounds like Catholicism.

OK, Pius, it sounds like you know what you are talking about. I’m curious to hear more.

Eamon
 
Pius X:
Old Catholics reject Papal Infalibility, Immaculate COnception, and Original sin.
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Hmmm, so they reject the Council of Trent too. I’m getting the feeling they reject any sort of infallibility whatsoever–it would be interesting to see exactly when they believe the Church went into error.
 
Interesting fact-Claimed membership is 150,000, but most observers say it is only 60,000.
 
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turboEDvo:
So, how is it permissible for non-Catholics to partake of Catholic sacraments (most particularly the Eucharist)?

Also, I have seen nothing on the website yet about your church’s belief in transubstantiation. What is it?

Eamon
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you’re right non-catholic shouldn’t partake in the scaraments.Butwe are catholic. Remember I said that the popesaid that we are part of the catholic faith because of apostalicseccession.You don’t have to be in prefect communion with Rome you just have to have seccession. Yes we believe that the eucharist is the real body and blood of christ. and rome says its avalid eucharist so it is transubstantiation. The pope is the head of the Rome Catholic church. He can say what the church will except. Just like our head is called the prime bishop and he makes the rules in our church. The infallible head of the church is Christ. We have infallabity in the synod when the bishops priests and church members are together . Not just one man. It might seem that I am putting down the Roman church. I was a Roman catholic all my life and I have great respect for both church. Next week there are diaolog between R C and the PNCC. We might resolve some of the differances we have witch aren’t alot so we may be one like christ wanted.
 
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williamkar:
you’re right non-catholic shouldn’t partake in the scaraments.Butwe are catholic. Remember I said that the popesaid that we are part of the catholic faith because of apostalicseccession.You don’t have to be in prefect communion with Rome you just have to have seccession. Yes we believe that the eucharist is the real body and blood of christ. and rome says its avalid eucharist so it is transubstantiation. The pope is the head of the Rome Catholic church. He can say what the church will except. Just like our head is called the prime bishop and he makes the rules in our church. The infallible head of the church is Christ. We have infallabity in the synod when the bishops priests and church members are together . Not just one man. It might seem that I am putting down the Roman church. I was a Roman catholic all my life and I have great respect for both church. Next week there are diaolog between R C and the PNCC. We might resolve some of the differances we have witch aren’t alot so we may be one like christ wanted.
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Just like the Orthodox, you guys have valid succession and a valid Eucharist–I understand that part.

When do you guys believe the RCC went into error? And why do you think councils like Trent and First Vatican were not infallible while your synods are?
 
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williamkar:
you’re right non-catholic shouldn’t partake in the scaraments.Butwe are catholic. Remember I said that the popesaid that we are part of the catholic faith because of apostalicseccession.You don’t have to be in prefect communion with Rome you just have to have seccession. Yes we believe that the eucharist is the real body and blood of christ. and rome says its avalid eucharist so it is transubstantiation. The pope is the head of the Rome Catholic church. He can say what the church will except. Just like our head is called the prime bishop and he makes the rules in our church. The infallible head of the church is Christ. We have infallabity in the synod when the bishops priests and church members are together . Not just one man. It might seem that I am putting down the Roman church. I was a Roman catholic all my life and I have great respect for both church. Next week there are diaolog between R C and the PNCC. We might resolve some of the differances we have witch aren’t alot so we may be one like christ wanted.
Click to expand...
So did the Protestant Reformation. They had valid sacraments as long as they had the original bishop, and priest ordained by the original bishops. When these bishops and priests died, they (The reformers) no longer had valid sacraments. It didn’t take very long for the “reformers” to loose the sacraments.

As long as you don’t recognize the Holy Father as the head of the Universal Church, (as Christ did, “You are Peter, and upon this Rock I will built My Church”) then you are in schism.
 
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williamkar:
iam a catholic but not of the roman rite. we are almost the same but we don’t belive in the infallbility of the pope. the pncc is the only old catholic church in the u. s. that has valid scaraments that was given by pope paul VI because of true apostalic line
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Is this Mel Gibson’s religion? I’ve read that he is a “Catholic” but not a Roman Catholic.
 
Not to be a jerk, but please use proper grammar, punctuation, and spelling. Reading posts without proper spacing, capitalization, etc., is very difficult. Thanks.

Eamon
 
No- mel Gibson rejects Vatican II. He is a “traditional Catholic”.
 
Pius X:
No- mel Gibson rejects Vatican II. He is a “traditional Catholic”.
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I seem to recall hearing that he was not Roman Catholic as well, though I can’t remember exactly what I heard he was. Who knows, maybe I’m wrong.

Eamon
 
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