Not sure how to respond to my protestant friend

[MacQ]

you have explain to your friend why its ok to eat human flesh and drink human blood by using scripture chapter and verse to prove your point of belief. show your friend in scripture where god has made exception to his strong prohibition against eating these things.

I think one of the mistakes one can make is getting down in the weeds too soon arguing about scripture (which has variable interpretations often).
It is often quite enough just to be happy and secure in your own beliefs, answer questions honestly but succinctly, if asked, and to be a good a loving person.

Life isn’t a debate class where you have to be right or prove a point to win.
Seems to me, that approach chases a lot of people away.

 

[Petersmate]

"See that you all follow the bishop, even as Jesus Christ does the Father, and the presbytery as you would the apostles; and reverence the deacons, as being the institution of God. Let no man do anything connected with the Church without the bishop. Let that be deemed a proper Eucharist, which is [administered] either by the bishop, or by one to whom he has entrusted it. Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude [of the people] also be; even as, wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church. It is not lawful without the bishop either to baptize or to celebrate a love-feast; but whatsoever he shall approve of, that is also pleasing to God, so that everything that is done may be secure and valid.

Moreover, it is in accordance with reason that we should return to soberness [of conduct], and, while yet we have opportunity, exercise repentance towards God. It is well to reverence both God and the bishop. He who honours the bishop has been honoured by God; he who does anything without the knowledge of the bishop, does [in reality] serve the devil."
(St. Ignatius of Antioch, Letter to the Smyrnaeans, Chapters 8, 9)

Does scripture cover this point.

I mean we cant celebrate the Eucharist without apostolic succession.

 

[Petersmate]

You may be right.
Whether the OP attends a service with her friend or not is one thing…my main point was that if she declines, she should do it politely and not disparage someone else’s faith by saying their communion isn’t “valid”.

Just so that you know , I’m a he.

 

[MacQ]

Just so that you know , I’m a he.

Sorry.

 

[robwar]

You may be right.
Whether the OP attends a service with her friend or not is one thing…my main point was that if she declines, she should do it politely and not disparage someone else’s faith by saying their communion isn’t “valid”.

Yes, turning down politely is key. Op could say, “thank-you for your invite, but at this time I am not interested, I appreciate your offer.” It can be simple as that and one doesn’t need to get into all the rest.

 

[Petersmate]

I would suggest being tactfully open and honest about it: “My church views the Eucharist as a sacrament, a mystical rite which can only be performed by a duly-ordained priest and which can only be received by someone in communion with our beliefs. This is a sacred ceremony. As a result, we do not engage in a symbolic version.” .

I’m not sure how she will respond to this but, here goes…

 

[Protestor]

Petersmate:

doing communion now

There are many different things you could do and it would depend on your personality and your friends personality and the nature of your relationship.

If it were me I would probably say no and explain why, or go and say that you won’t be participating in communion and again explain why. By going to her church service it might sending the wrong message. She may think that you are interested in switching churches or something like this. I have heard people talk about “converting catholics” , and though your friend might just be being friendly she may very well have ulterior motives. I know I would never invite somebody to church unless they did not have one or they were not happy at their church or ect…

I think inviting her to mass may not be the best idea. The first time I was invited to mass was the first time I did anything with a catholic group, and I got upset that I was denied the eucharist(I understand why please don’t comment on this sentence). I think the first time a person is invited to mass they should already know things about the her traditions. Probably inviting her to a bible study would be better.

You know this person better than I probably do so follow gut I am a blunt and sometimes honest to a fault so what I would say is most likely not what you would say. I hope your interactions go well and I hope this helps.

Also what does “doing communion now” mean? What denomination is she in?

 

[Petersmate]

There are many different things you could do and it would depend on your personality and your friends personality and the nature of your relationship.

If it were me I would probably say no and explain why, or go and say that you won’t be participating in communion and again explain why. By going to her church service it might sending the wrong message. She may think that you are interested in switching churches or something like this. I have heard people talk about “converting catholics” , and though your friend might just be being friendly she may very well have ulterior motives. I know I would never invite somebody to church unless they did not have one or they were not happy at their church or ect…

I think inviting her to mass may not be the best idea. The first time I was invited to mass was the first time I did anything with a catholic group, and I got upset that I was denied the eucharist(I understand why please don’t comment on this sentence). I think the first time a person is invited to mass they should already know things about the her traditions. Probably inviting her to a bible study would be better.

You know this person better than I probably do so follow gut I am a blunt and sometimes honest to a fault so what I would say is most likely not what you would say. I hope your interactions go well and I hope this helps.

Also what does “doing communion now” mean? What denomination is she in?

This friend is a Pentecostal. She regularly invites me to prayer and bible study meetings at her home. I happened to be visiting one day when she had a prayer/ bible meeting so she invited me to stay. So I stayed and prayed and even got to read a bible passage. Since I’ve had the conversation with her as I explained in the OP she has decided to start having communion at her prayer / bible study meeting at her home .

Does that clear it up for you.

And yes it does depend on our friendship and our personalities.

 

[Protestor]

Since I’ve had the conversation with her as I explained in the OP she has decided to start having communion at her prayer / bible study meeting at her home.

Well things are most likely different in her Pentecostal church, but normally having communion at a small group is frowned upon.
I hope that God blesses your friendship and that you both bless God with it.

 

[Mystophilus]

I’m not sure how she will respond to this but, here goes…

You both believe in Christ, and in loving your neighbour, and so, if you two cannot work this out in a peaceable fashion, what hope is there for the rest of the world?

 

[QNDNNDQDCE]

Does scripture cover this point.

I mean we cant celebrate the Eucharist without apostolic succession.

Yes, Scripture covers the existence of a priesthood in the New Testament, from which what you said is the logical conclusion. Another of Ignatius’s points, the necessity of unity, is also taught in many places.

 

[NotAllHere]

Even some protestant groups practice “closed communion”, do a little research to see how they build their case, there may be something in I Cor 11 related to this.

 

[MacQ]

Well things are most likely different in her Pentecostal church, but normally having communion at a small group is frowned upon.
I hope that God blesses your friendship and that you both bless God with it.

Communion in a small group is frowned upon?
Really?
Like the early Christians did it?
What’s the acceptable number to be not frowned upon?

 

[Petersmate]

Yes, Scripture covers the existence of a priesthood in the New Testament, from which what you said is the logical conclusion. Another of Ignatius’s points, the necessity of unity, is also taught in many places.

Are you able to quote the passages of scripture, it may be helpful when talking to my friend. If I mention St Ignatius that might not go down so well with my protestant friend who like most protestants have a problem with Mary and the Saints. Scripture is everything to a protestant and the best way to make a point with them is to quote scripture.

 

[Petersmate]

Even some protestant groups practice “closed communion”, do a little research to see how they build their case, there may be something in I Cor 11 related to this.

I might have to ask some questions before I start explaining the Catholic faith on this issue

 

[Erich]

I suppose you could ask her if she thinks sex outside of marriage is ok.

From this link: …In the Catholic Church, we believe the reception of Communion is the sign and symbol of union - union between Christ and those who receive Him, and union between all those who receive Christ in this sacrament.

In a marriage, the physical joining of husband and wife is the sign and the symbol of union between the two. If there is no union - no lifelong commitment - then the sign of union should not take place. Which means sex outside of marriage is a lie - you are saying with your bodies that a union exists, that a commitment has been made, when no such union actually exists.

Just so, it is a lie for someone who is not Catholic to receive Communion in the Catholic Church, when there is first no union with the Catholic Church. When you receive Communion in the Catholic Church, you are saying with your body that you are in union with the Church and that you believe as we believe. And not just in regard to the Real Presence, but also in regard to the Pope, to Mary, to the other Sacraments, to the Communion of Saints, the priesthood, salvation, and so on. If there is no union, there should be no Communion.

The same holds when you receive communion in a non-Catholic faith tradition. You are saying, with your body, that you believe as they believe. You are telling everyone present that there is essentially no difference between what they believe about communion and what you, as a Catholic, believe about Communion. You are telling a lie with your body. That is why Catholics should not receive communion, or the Lord’s Supper, outside the bounds of the Catholic Church.

 

[Petersmate]

I suppose you could ask her if she thinks sex outside of marriage is ok.

From this link: …In the Catholic Church, we believe the reception of Communion is the sign and symbol of union - union between Christ and those who receive Him, and union between all those who receive Christ in this sacrament.

In a marriage, the physical joining of husband and wife is the sign and the symbol of union between the two. If there is no union - no lifelong commitment - then the sign of union should not take place. Which means sex outside of marriage is a lie - you are saying with your bodies that a union exists, that a commitment has been made, when no such union actually exists.

Just so, it is a lie for someone who is not Catholic to receive Communion in the Catholic Church, when there is first no union with the Catholic Church. When you receive Communion in the Catholic Church, you are saying with your body that you are in union with the Church and that you believe as we believe. And not just in regard to the Real Presence, but also in regard to the Pope, to Mary, to the other Sacraments, to the Communion of Saints, the priesthood, salvation, and so on. If there is no union, there should be no Communion.

The same holds when you receive communion in a non-Catholic faith tradition. You are saying, with your body, that you believe as they believe. You are telling everyone present that there is essentially no difference between what they believe about communion and what you, as a Catholic, believe about Communion. You are telling a lie with your body. That is why Catholics should not receive communion, or the Lord’s Supper, outside the bounds of the Catholic Church.

Yes I agree with all that.

Our protestant friends see things differently and I think I have to be tactful in what I say to her.

 

[MacQ]

Yes I agree with all that.

Our protestant friends see things differently and I think I have to be tactful in what I say to her.

If you go to her service, you’d simply sit respectfully and not participate in communion there. Pray silently instead.
If asked why you didn’t partake, you could just say:
“Well, I understand that you offering me communion was an act of generosity on your part, and I deeply appreciate that kindness. It’s just that when a Catholic takes communion, he’s saying “I fully understand and agree with everything the Church teaches”. That’s why we don’t expect non-Catholics to partake…and why we don’t partake outside of our Church. We don’t want to deceive anyone.”

 

[Petersmate]

If you go to her service, you’d simply sit respectfully and not participate in communion there. Pray silently instead.
If asked why you didn’t partake, you could just say:
“Well, I understand that you offering me communion was an act of generosity on your part, and I deeply appreciate that kindness. It’s just that when a Catholic takes communion, he’s saying “I fully understand and agree with everything the Church teaches”. That’s why we don’t expect non-Catholics to partake…and why we don’t partake outside of our Church. We don’t want to deceive anyone.”

Yes very good I’ll do all that, all I need now is the scripture verses to back me up.

 

[MacQ]

Yes very good I’ll do all that, all I need now is the scripture verses to back me up.

Well maybe…but once you go there with some of these people, you start getting their versions of scripture and get into a whole dialog/debate.
My approach would be just polite but matter of fact…the response I suggested would be that (and pretty much also convey the message that you are committed to your own church, but not disrespectful of others’).
Personally, I’d leave it at that.
go luck, whatever you do.