Not Voting Promotes Abortion!

[mikeledes]

So, hypothetically speaking, if we were to vote for someone who claims to be pro-life but, without a shadow of a doubt, has adopted a reckless foreign policy that has led to thousands of deaths, then we should still vote for that person just based on the single issue of abortion? I prefer not to vote or to vote for some candidate I know will lose. If I there is a pro-life third party alternative, then I’ll vote for that person. I cannot, in good conscience, vote for someone who is corrupt or grossly incompetent. Neither can I, in good conscience, vote for a pro-choice candidate. I belive that the Pro-Life movement should not compromise its principles in order to fit a party’s policy. We should be an independent voice in the country, the conscience of our society. Unfortunately, too many pro-lifers are too busy defending certain highly questionable Republican policies instead of standing up to the Republican party when they do something wrong. I believe in being politically independent and not being a slave to any political party.

God Bless,
Mike

 

[BlindSheep]

We should be an independent voice in the country, the conscience of our society. Unfortunately, too many pro-lifers are too busy defending certain highly questionable Republican policies instead of standing up to the Republican party when they do something wrong. I believe in being politically independent and not being a slave to any political party.

God Bless,
Mike

 

[Saint_Michael]

I’m from NY I can’t vote without voting pro-abortion, almost all politicans here support abortion in one way or another, the only election I vote in is the Presidential, otherwise I am too worried that I will inadvertantly support abortion, whether it’s money to planned parenthood, outright support for an official who supports abortion but hides it well etc…

 

[LCMS_No_More]

I’m Catholic and would never vote for any candidate who endorses abortion and other positions which are anti-Catholic. Choosing the lesser of two evils must never be an option. If you choose the lesser of two evils you are still endorsing evil and that is sinful. In this case I would spoil my ballot paper with something like you suggest.

If you mean that you would write any stray marks on the ballot itself, then you may as well have not gone to the polling place because your entire ballot will be thrown out (all the other races you voted in will not be counted). There is usually a space on the ballot (or the little envelope you put the ballot in before you put it it the little box) specifically for this. NEVER, under any circumstances, make stray marks on your ballot. Fill it in correctly. If you leave a particular race blank because you can’t decide, then that’s okay. The other races will be counted and that’s what’s important.

 

[psteichen]

So, hypothetically speaking, if we were to vote for someone who claims to be pro-life but, without a shadow of a doubt, has adopted a reckless foreign policy that has led to thousands of deaths, then we should still vote for that person just based on the single issue of abortion? I prefer not to vote or to vote for some candidate I know will lose. If I there is a pro-life third party alternative, then I’ll vote for that person. I cannot, in good conscience, vote for someone who is corrupt or grossly incompetent. Neither can I, in good conscience, vote for a pro-choice candidate. I belive that the Pro-Life movement should not compromise its principles in order to fit a party’s policy. We should be an independent voice in the country, the conscience of our society. Unfortunately, too many pro-lifers are too busy defending certain highly questionable Republican policies instead of standing up to the Republican party when they do something wrong. I believe in being politically independent and not being a slave to any political party.

God Bless,
Mike

Mike:
Then you will have blood on your hands. I don’t have time to rehash all the arguments against your position from earlier in the thread. Here’s the short version. As you vote for the person that can’t be elected, or don’t vote at all, the Pro-Death voters will be voting for the worst candidate available and he/she will be more likely to win because of you. Perhaps thousands of other misinformed Catholics will do as you are planning to do as well. This worst case scenario will probably result in an expansion of abortion in this country. Maybe even embryonic stem cell research. That way instead of 4000 babies murdered each day, we may have 20,000.

I hope you feel good about standing up for your so called morals when this comes to pass. You could have prevented it by voting responsibly in accordance with Catholic teaching. May God forgive you for your ignorance.

 

[psteichen]

So, hypothetically speaking, if we were to vote for someone who claims to be pro-life but, without a shadow of a doubt, has adopted a reckless foreign policy that has led to thousands of deaths, then we should still vote for that person just based on the single issue of abortion?

Mike: One more point. Can you name for me one politician anywhere in the USA that has caused over 1.4 million deaths this year due to reckless foreign policy? Your point is pointless and careless and equates the deaths of 1.4 million children each year, to what? Did you know that the approximate death toll of the two atomic bombs dropped on Japan was just over .2 million. So what would it take to equal 1.4 million? Over a dozen atomic bombs each year. So again, which politician has such a foreign policy?

Of course basing your vote on the single issue of abortion is the right thing to do! Can you think of another issue that even comes close?

 

[psteichen]

Did some of you see the USA Today ad by Catholic Answers? I thought it was great. It covered most all of the topics in this thread. While it leaves open the possibility that it may occasionally be moral to not vote, this is only in situations when voting cannot limit evil. For example, when both candidates are equally pro-death with no differences on the issue. One could argue that even in this instance voting for the candidate that belongs to a more pro-life party would limit evil. Therefor not voting is rarely a moral choice.

To read the full text of the ad click here. What a great service to US Catholics. Thanks Catholic Answers!

 

[tequilamac]

Did some of you see the USA Today ad by Catholic Answers? I thought it was great. It covered most all of the topics in this thread. While it leaves open the possibility that it may occasionally be moral to not vote, this is only in situations when voting cannot limit evil. For example, when both candidates are equally pro-death with no differences on the issue. One could argue that even in this instance voting for the candidate that belongs to a more pro-life party would limit evil. Therefor not voting is rarely a moral choice.

To read the full text of the ad click here. What a great service to US Catholics. Thanks Catholic Answers!

This is the thing all right. I’m in California. Tuesday I get to choose between Phil Angelides who is endorsed by planned parenthood and Schwarzenegger who has long been known for his pro choice support. Looking at parties or candidates does not help. I am looking right now to see if either one has spoken out on prop 85 which requires notification of one parent for minor obtaining abortion.
Angelides has indicated his opposition to prop 85. Schwarzenegger has not publicly but in the past when faced with prop 73 he indicated privately he was for that type of legislation. That is a terribly weak endorsement and very often he is known to indicate support for something just to contradict his competition, only to do the opposite while in office. therefore with their history of pro choice support i have to assume they do not support the prop. This is impossible. No matter who I vote for, I will end up voting for the NARAL or planned parenthood candidate. While the article in CA is very nice, parties do not necessarily neatly divide down pro choice/pro life issues. I cannot vote simply because the candidate is republican saying the republicans are more pro life look at Bush. no. Because now we have republican gubernatorial candidates right here in Cal. who are a. more popular than Bush and may run for president in the future, b. are simply and absolutely without a doubt pro choice.

"Angelides is again opposed; he recently joined women’s groups and a pastor in urging Proposition 85’s defeat. And Schwarzenegger – who needs support from moderates and Democrats to win re-election – hasn’t spoken about the measure yet this year.
Schwarzenegger personally supports'' Proposition 85, spokeswoman Levinson said. His position has not changed from last year.’’
mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/15266893.htm

 

[tequilamac]

And while it looks like he might be a better candidate, Schwarzenegger offset his weak support of Prop 85 with a massive legislative effort this last summer to increase funding on all stem cell research, including embryonic, in response to Bush’s veto on federal funding. Schwarzenegger and Angelides both are strong advocates of any type of stem cell research, citing the critical diseases argument. this is a lose lose vote for me.
Angelides for instance had this to say about Bush’s veto and schwarzenegger:

“Today, with his veto pen, President Bush blocked crucial federal funding for stem cell research and dashed the hopes of countless Americans suffering from debilitating and life-threatening diseases and injuries such as Parkinson’s, diabetes, AIDS, Alzheimer’s, heart disease, spinal cord injuries and other devastating conditions. It’s clear that Republican Governor Schwarzenegger’s last-minute appeal yesterday to Bush was too little, too late”

angelides.com/news/pressreleases/2006_0719_stemcells.html

Now we can see that Schwarzenegger, while a republican, is every bit in the same camp as angelides who is a democrat. Arnold is also becoming more pro choice, more pro stem cell as he needs to appeal to a larger democratic population in order to win the election.
I do not see how voting for party in this case will be helpful. CA does not address the problem of two candidates from two parties with the same views. California’s Republican Party is simply not the same as Texas’ Republican Party and Schwarzenegger as a republican is simply not a pro life republican.

This is why I offered earlier int his thread the idea of boycott. If all California catholics simply went to the polls and voted for Prop 85 and refused to vote en masse for either candidate it would certainly get the attention of the political parties involved. And maybe the parties would send us next time a candidate who doesn;t make us want to spew.

 

[psteichen]

tequilamac: Wow, the way you describe it you really don’t have any good choices this year on the Governers race. If you do decide to abstain from voting on the Governers race, please at least go and vote on other parts of the ballot. I can’t imagine that all of the choices are quite as stark. And prop 85 sounds like it needs good Catholics to show up in order to pass. Perhaps more Catholics in CA need to get involved in politics prior to the election so that they can influence who gets to be on the ballot in the first place. We don’t need any “Nancy Pelosi” type Catholics though. They may as well stay home.

 

[tequilamac]

tequilamac: Wow, the way you describe it you really don’t have any good choices this year on the Governers race. If you do decide to abstain from voting on the Governers race, please at least go and vote on other parts of the ballot. I can’t imagine that all of the choices are quite as stark. And prop 85 sounds like it needs good Catholics to show up in order to pass. Perhaps more Catholics in CA need to get involved in politics prior to the election so that they can influence who gets to be on the ballot in the first place. We don’t need any “Nancy Pelosi” type Catholics though. They may as well stay home.

Well, we have already resolved to show at the polls to vote for Prop 85. But the gubernatorial candidates- if this was a restaurant we’d be served one item on the menu. I had a brainstorm to research where these two are on gay marriage and death penalty. Thought that might seperate them out a bit since they are so close on abortion and embryonic stem cell research. And they have both been endorsed by Feinstien at one time or another- anthother pro choicer. I’ll let you know.

 

[justme]

Voting Pro-Abort, even in a limited capicity, promotes abortion.

It is hard to understand how others here can not see that when the logic is so plan a child can understand it.

 

[psteichen]

Voting Pro-Abort, even in a limited capicity, promotes abortion.

It is hard to understand how others here can not see that when the logic is so plan a child can understand it.

justme: I know that’s what it seems at first glance, but let me break it down for you. Lets say you have two candidates, neither of whom are pro-life. But say also that one of them favors banning partial birth abortion and parental notification, while the other will stand for no limits on the death whatsoever. If you decide not to vote for either, you are removing your pro-life vote from the election. For every pro-lifer, there is a pro-death citizen out there. They are certainly not going to skip the election, and will most likely vote for the candidate that was opposed to any limits at all on abortion. So what you have done by failing to vote is increased the odds that the really bad guy or gal will win. What you should have done is cast your ballot for the least dangerous candidate. In this way you could have limited the evil outcome.

Please read the Catholic Answers publication “Voter’s Guide for Serious Catholics” for a better understanding, or go to the Priests for Life website.

Hope that helps clear things up for you.

 

[psteichen]

I hope you’ve all voted today if you live in the USA! For all of you who voted Pro-Life, God bless you. Those of you (able to vote) who stayed home or thought other issues more important, shame on you, you’ve allowed the culture of death to march on. Hopefully the souls of those babies you found unimportant will pray for your salvation.

If you haven’t voted there are a few hours left. Get in the car and go save some lives!!!

Thanks for everyone’s hard work this year to support the unborn!