O My Knight Shining Armour

[francisca]

I think this (read thread title) is a good way for a woman to find a good man. Some laoughed at me because of this, but I do think that it’s very wise of parents to tell stories of a prince saving a princes to their sons and daughters. It is very wise for a woman to be kind to herself and for a man to be gentle to his woman because women are the key to our future generation.

Recently I was in a thread titled “Rough Sex” which was deleted by the mods.

In this thread, Sryi (OP) asked whether Rough Sex is moral according to catholic view.
In my post I said that “Rough Sex is evil”.

Some men and women disagree because:

1. What husband and wife do in private is not anybody else’s business
2. Sex can be playful.

My view:

1. Sex has to be done in the context of love
2. Love is not rough. Love is patient, gentle and kind

So I placed a** hypothetical question for the men**:
“Would you agree if let’s say the morality say: on the ground that women are relatively weaker (muscle) and less aggressive compared to men, so only women is allowed to be rough with men, not the otherway round ?”

Up to the point the thread was erased, only one man responded: he stated his disagreement to the above morality. However, some female posters insisted that women are not weak and can manage rough play in bed.

I really hope that the moderators would be patient enough to continue this discussion because in my opinion this is an important issue to discuss (even for young people).

So, here is the new thread begin :

Based on the fact that no men agreed with the hypothetical morality that say “only women allowed to be rough on men, and not the other way round”, then

** I conclude that: **
Men would not allow women to be rough on them if they cannot be rough back to the woman.

So…

Now I would like to know the respond of women regarding my conclusion above:

Knowing that men are physically stronger then women, should women allow men to play rough in bed?

 

[JaneGrey]

May I ask why these details of the type of sex couples have are of concern to you? Your first sentence seemed to hint that you were going to talk about how women can attract gentle, protective men, then you lead into the topic of ‘rough sex’.

What are you getting at exactly?

 

[cviolette]

So…

Now I would like to know the respond of women regarding my conclusion above:

Knowing that men are physically stronger then women, should women allow men to play rough in bed?

Men are stronger than women physical. I can spend years in the gym training and a teenage boy can bypass my numbers in months.

It is about both agreeing upon guidelines and doing what they BOTH agree is enjoyable. So a man is not trying to beat up the woman. It is controlled. Even if the woman is the aggressor, she is not going postal on her man. It is controlled rough play. It is discussed before hand and if it is more on the riskier side than there can be a code word.

It is not for everyone and it is private between the couple. I don’t see a problem with it in a marriage as long as they do not bring in a third person.

I find a little pain intensifies sex.

It does not sound like it would be enjoyable for you. That’s okay. Everyone is different.

 

[francisca]

It is about both agreeing upon guidelines and doing what they BOTH agree is enjoyable.

This is the fact that I really want to check. The fact that no men agree to the morality I hypothetically placed, yet women assumes that it will always be based on agreement assuming men will not overpower and leave women with no choice when he got too exited with the game.

So a man is not trying to beat up the woman. It is controlled. Even if the woman is the aggressor, she is not going postal on her man. It is controlled rough play. It is discussed before hand and if it is more on the riskier side than there can be a code word.

This is what women loves to think: that her man will not hurt her. Many facts shows otherwise.

I find a little pain intensifies sex…

I also think that female is good with adaptation, where male will hunt for what he desire.

 

[francisca]

May I ask why these details of the type of sex couples have are of concern to you? Your first sentence seemed to hint that you were going to talk about how women can attract gentle, protective men, then you lead into the topic of ‘rough sex’.

What are you getting at exactly?

I am trying to discuss male and female sexuality, and whether should women ever allow rough game in bed.

 

[cviolette]

This is the fact that I really want to check. The fact that no men agree to the morality I hypothetically placed, yet women assumes that it will always be based on agreement assuming men will not overpower and leave women with no choice when he got too exited with the game.

There are unhealthy and healthy relationships. A woman in a safe, healthy marriage will not fear her husband. Then there are unhealthy relationships where part of the excitement is the danger and unknown.

This is what women loves to think: that her man will not hurt her. Many facts shows otherwise.

There are many woman that are in relationships where her man has not hurt her.

I also think that female is good with adaptation, where male will hunt for what he desire.

A female also hunts for what she wants. She is not always the helpless victim.

I just wanted to add that my husband is a gentle lover and is not into rough sex so I am not trying to defend my sex life.

 

[francisca]

Thankyou cviolette for your answers.

 

[Debora123]

I was in that thread, and what you have posted on your OP does not paint a picture of what was really being said in that thread in regards to what was being refered to as “rough sex.”

We weren’t talking about the type of rough sex that is abusive and involves whips and dominatrix. The OP of that thread was very clear on this as he used words like “playful,” “teasing,” “hair tugging,” …etc etc, to describe what he meant by “rough.” (I wouldn’t call that rough, but that’s what he meant by saying rough). It is not about abuse or violence or dominance, and this was explained to you multiple times, though it seems you never grasped the concept.

If a married couple has a MUTUAL liking for the type of sex described above, then no, there is nothing evil or unloving about it.

 

[JaneGrey]

I am trying to discuss male and female sexuality, and whether should women ever allow rough game in bed.

Like other posters said, and it depends on the couple in question. Both have to be equally comfortable with it. Also because it is such a private thing and people have can have different ideas as to what constitutes ‘rough’, it is not the easiest thing to discuss generally.

 

[francisca]

I was in that thread, and what you have posted on your OP does not paint a picture of what was really being said in that thread in regards to what was being refered to as “rough sex.”

We weren’t talking about the type of rough sex that is abusive and involves whips and dominatrix. The OP of that thread was very clear on this as he used words like “playful,” “teasing,” “hair tugging,” …etc etc, to describe what he meant by “rough.” (I wouldn’t call that rough, but that’s what he meant by saying rough). It is not about abuse or violence or dominance, and this was explained to you multiple times, though it seems you never grasped the concept.

If a married couple has a MUTUAL liking for the type of sex described above, then no, there is nothing evil or unloving about it.

Have I ever use other words than “rough” ? Have I ever mentioned that I am talking about whips? No. Roughness is what I am talking about.

In my hypothetical morality (which no man agree), I use the same word.

If you don’t believe me, then ask them yourself about what their intepretation of the word “roughness” is and why none of them agree to such morality.

 

[JaneGrey]

Have I ever use other words than “rough” ? Have I ever mentioned that I am talking about whips? No. Roughness is what I am talking about.

In my hypothetical morality (which no man agree), I use the same word.

If you don’t believe me, then ask them yourself about what their intepretation of the word “roughness” is and why none of them agree to such morality.

So what constitutes being ‘rough’ and ‘roughness’ to you?

 

[francisca]

So what constitutes being ‘rough’ and ‘roughness’ to you?

I would say even dirty (degrading) talk is rough.

But my opinion is not important. What’s important is why no man agree to the hypothetical morality I placed in the thread.

 

[Debora123]

Have I ever use other words than “rough” ? Have I ever mentioned that I am talking about whips? No. Roughness is what I am talking about.

In my hypothetical morality (which no man agree), I use the same word.

If you don’t believe me, then ask them yourself about what their intepretation of the word “roughness” is and why none of them agree to such morality.

No, you don’t use any word other than rough, but the way you talk about it would give someone the impression that the man is beating up his wife in bed or something.

 

[Debora123]

I would say even dirty (degrading) talk is rough.

See?

Right there. You use the word degrading. Talking “dirty” doesn’t necessarily mean degrading, and no one here is condoning degrading behavior towards your spouse.

 

[Debora123]

This is what women loves to think: that her man will not hurt her. Many facts shows otherwise.

I’m sorry, but if a lady can’t trust her own husband to not become physically abusive with her, then she shouldn’t be marrying that man at all.

 

[francisca]

See?

Right there. You use the word degrading. Talking “dirty” doesn’t necessarily mean degrading, and no one here is condoning degrading behavior towards your spouse.

Debora123,

My intepretation is not imporant anymore, neither is yours.

How ever the guys intepret the word “rough”-- this intepretation-- has prevented them from agreeing.

 

[smichhertz]

So I placed a** hypothetical question for the men**:
“Would you agree if let’s say the morality say: on the ground that women are relatively weaker (muscle) and less aggressive compared to men, so only women is allowed to be rough with men, not the otherway round ?”

Hey fancisca,

I don’t understand the logic behind this. You say that rough sex is evil. If it’s evil, why would it matter who does it to the other? Why would it be okay for a woman to commit an evil directed at her husband, when it wouldn’t be okay the other way around?

If something is evil, then, it’s evil. It’s never okay to commit evil. Hence I fail to see what you’re getting at.

I also agree with the other posters that we need a concise definition of rough sex. You keep defining it in ways different from how it was defined in the other thread.

Thanks!

 

[Debora123]

Debora123,

My intepretation is not imporant anymore, neither is yours.

How ever the guys intepret the word “rough”-- this intepretation-- has prevented them from agreeing.

So what you’re saying is that a man’s definition of rough is always going to be different (more violent) than a women’s definition of rough, and because of this, their consensual “rough sex” will inevitably lead to some sort of physical abuse done to the woman.

Is this some type of crazy written rule somewhere or have you just made it up?

Because it seems extremely far fetched to me.

The OP of the former “rough sex” thread was a man, and he interpreted rough as playful, hair tugging, teasing, light pinching… these were all words HE used to describe it. I am a woman, and I wouldn’t consider what he described as rough.

 

[francisca]

Why would it be okay for a woman to commit an evil directed at her husband, when it wouldn’t be okay the other way around?

This is exactly what I mean, and you are the one who has just said it. Not me.

 

[smichhertz]

This is exactly what I mean, and you are the one who has just said it. Not me.

You misunderstood me:

You say that rough sex is evil. If it’s evil, why would it matter who does it to the other? Why would it be okay for a woman to commit an evil directed at her husband, when it wouldn’t be okay the other way around?

I said IF it’s an evil, then it’s an evil both ways. So I don’t see how you or anyone else could agree with the moral guideline you suggested. It is in and of itself contradictory.

I’m also still waiting for you to define what you mean by rough sex.