"Obamacare" does NOT pay for abortions, and it could LOWER the abortion rate

  • Thread starter Thread starter Jerry_Miah
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Actually, if one believes that life begins at conception (which is the Catholic belief), then Obama care actually DOES pay for abortions. The drug Ella, and others like it, including some oral contraceptives, can stop the fertilized egg from implantation. This causes a termination of pregnancy (abortion). The reason why the fact-checkers don’t detect this is because, to them, abortion only happens AFTER implantation. Evidently this is the position of HHS and Obama.

That is why it is important for the President and HHS to realize the Catholic belief on when life begins (fertilization/conception), and respect the consciences of all who hold this position. Of course, it’s not just Catholics who believe that life begins at conception, it is a commonly held belief. It may not be abortion according to the administration’s definition of it, but it is according to ours. That is why we need conscience protection and an exemption from the mandate in this regard.

Also, it’s important to realize that the inclusion of oral contraceptives and Ella-type drugs in the healthcare act could just be a prelude to including abortion in the future. There is no real need to include contraceptives right now, they are widely available to women of all economic description, and are highly subsidized already by the government.
 
JimG said:
So far, some 30 lawsuits have been filed against the health care act.

In addition, numerous lawsuits have been filed specifically against the HHS mandate which limits religious liberty. That mandate was opposed in separate statements by every Catholic bishop in the United States and by many Protestant clergy. Lawsuits against the mandate have been filed by EWTN, Belmont College, Colorado Christian University, Ave Maria University, and some private employers have filed suit challenging the HHS mandate.

I suppose all these people have their facts wrong?

Or perhaps a great many people don’t like it when the Federal government attempts to overturn conscience protection and freedom to practice one’s religion.
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“All these people” – I could cite just as many organizations on the other side of the argument.

The idea that you are being stopped from practicing your religion is against common sense. Unless you think paying taxes is stopping you from practicing your religion.
 
This thread is devolving so I will leave it now. My points still stand: The health care reform does not pay for abortions, and it could lower the abortion rate. That’s the conclusion of every unbiased expert you can find. Those trying to argue against these obvious facts have cited “lifenews” or right wing fake-news sources because they don’t have any real, objective info to support them.

To end, I will say it again. If Catholics want to do the right, moral thing, they will help the president enact a national health care system, not obstruct it.
 
Jerry_Miah said:
“All these people” – I could cite just as many organizations on the other side of the argument.

The idea that you are being stopped from practicing your religion is against common sense. Unless you think paying taxes is stopping you from practicing your religion.
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It is not the payment of taxes that is interfering with the practice of religion, but the HHS mandate which forces religious employers to choose between rejecting their religion and following the mandate. Reject your religion in order to follow the law. That’s a clear violation of the free exercise of religion.
 
Jerry_Miah said:
This thread is devolving so I will leave it now. My points still stand: The health care reform does not pay for abortions, and it could lower the abortion rate. That’s the conclusion of every unbiased expert you can find. Those trying to argue against these obvious facts have cited “lifenews” or right wing fake-news sources because they don’t have any real, objective info to support them.

To end, I will say it again. If Catholics want to do the right, moral thing, they will help the president enact a national health care system, not obstruct it.
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No. Not this President, not this way. President Obama sees babies as “punishment” for having sex outside of marriage. He also voted against allowing a baby born alive during an abortion to receive even the most basic medical care, usually just allowing it to die less painfully.

It is YOUR OPINION only that this nation would benefit from a national health care system. But it is FACT that this President is extremely pro abortion and pro birth control, and wants to make Catholic institutions pay for contraception and abortions of their employees. That is NOT the “RIGHT, MORAL THING.”
 
Jerry_Miah said:
This thread is devolving so I will leave it now. My points still stand: The health care reform does not pay for abortions, and it could lower the abortion rate. That’s the conclusion of every unbiased expert you can find. Those trying to argue against these obvious facts have cited “lifenews” or right wing fake-news sources because they don’t have any real, objective info to support them.

To end, I will say it again. If Catholics want to do the right, moral thing, they will help the president enact a national health care system, not obstruct it.
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In other words, too many people are throwing facts at me, and I can’t stand admitting I am wrong, so I am going to take my dolly and my dishes and run home!

:rotfl::rotfl:
 
Jerry_Miah said:
…To end, I will say it again. If Catholics want to do the right, moral thing, they will help the president enact a national health care system, not obstruct it.
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Are your statements on faith and morals infallible? :rolleyes:
 
Jerry_Miah said:
This thread is devolving so I will leave it now. My points still stand: The health care reform does not pay for abortions, and it could lower the abortion rate. That’s the conclusion of every unbiased expert you can find. Those trying to argue against these obvious facts have cited “lifenews” or right wing fake-news sources because they don’t have any real, objective info to support them.

To end, I will say it again. If Catholics want to do the right, moral thing, they will help the president enact a national health care system, not obstruct it.
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With due respect, where do you get off presuming to lecture Catholics about how to organize their religion? Do you even know the first thing about Catholic moral theology? Are you even a Catholic yourself?

All rhetorical questions, I guess.
 
Jerry_Miah said:
This thread is devolving so I will leave it now. My points still stand: The health care reform does not pay for abortions, and it could lower the abortion rate. That’s the conclusion of every unbiased expert you can find. Those trying to argue against these obvious facts have cited “lifenews” or right wing fake-news sources because they don’t have any real, objective info to support them.

To end, I will say it again. If Catholics want to do the right, moral thing, they will help the president enact a national health care system, not obstruct it.
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Your sources are left wing sources.
 
sw85 said:
With due respect, who the Hell are you and where do you get off presuming to lecture Catholics about how to organize their religion? Do you even know the first thing about Catholic moral theology? Are you even a Catholic yourself?

All rhetorical questions, I guess.
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Trolls

This would be #6 on the menu, I think.

LOL
 
Jerry_Miah said:
To end, I will say it again. If Catholics want to do the right, moral thing, they will help the president enact a national health care system, not obstruct it.
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There is nothing inherently right or moral about **this particular **health care plan. It is good to seek a way to improve health care delivery. Whether we support this plan, is a matter of prudential judgement. In my judgement, it is a bad plan and a poor attempt. We can do better. If one believes that this plan is seriously flawed, it would be wrong to help the president enact it.
 
Art321 said:
Seriously?

I’m sorry but I failing to see how this lowers abortions. I think you bought into the lies the Obamacare has come up with. I think you should find a source that is REALLY telling you the truth.
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I imagine Jerry Miah is on Obama’s payroll, either directly or indirectly.
 
Lots of individuals out here like this though, who still hang on every word Obama states. And see nothing but the misinformation.
 
Jerry_Miah said:
… the right wing is trying to make an “alternative reality” system …
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“‘Where are your sox?’ To answer this question, the Western mind turns to reality to determine they are in your dresser drawer. The liberal/Leftist, by contrast says, ‘Wherever the party says they are.’” – Bishop Fulton Sheen

That is why the Left had to re-invent truth, or more specifically, claim that truth is relative [see polylogism]. The right sees the world as it is; it is the Left that sees it as it wants it to be. I suppose Bishop Sheen is not a credible source either.
 
Julian0404 said:
…The fact that a legitimate legal institution was founded by a person of faith, immediately disqualifies it based upon your prejudices …
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It is an ad hominem attack, which is an indication that he has lost the argument. :sad_yes:
 
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