F
ffg
Guest
I don’t know if there is one, but an ‘ask a baha’i’ might be a good thread.
I’d love to go back and forth, but don’t want to hijack the thread.
- Status
I’d love to go back and forth, but don’t want to hijack the thread.
P
PJM
Guest
=daler;10831855]
“And every one that calleth upon my name,** I have created him for my glory**, I have formed him, and made him & This people have I formed for myself, they shall shew forth my praise”
Isaiah 55: 6, 8 "Seek the LORD while he may be found, call upon him while he is near; let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts; let him return to the LORD, that he may have mercy on him, and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon. For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, says the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts. “
God did not have to create man. But he did it for the possibility of being Glorified by man, who alone can choose to do so.
There is only One God: “Good and Perfect”
One God can only hold One set of Faith beliefs on long defined issues
God has always [historically abd biblically provable] had for reasons He alone fully understands; One chosen people in the Old testament and Only One Church [todays CC] in the New Testament times.
So the truth you seek is:
One God
His One Faith
In His One church
ONLY the CC fully meets this criteria.
God Bless you,
Pat/PJM
A
Abbigaelann
Guest
Daler, first a quick aside, for a bizarre study thing. I looked across several languages, with words for Black Elk. Oddly, I took it to Hebrew, oh my, now to take it to what those hebrew letters were, then the sound of them as hebrew is phonetic…ah, into the Greek from the sound of it…So, if someone had been listening to it in hebrew, a greek might have mistaken it (or vice versa) to something close to “hand of God”.-Also hints of being from the tribe of Judah more specifically of Joshua (much like the Powhattan in their circular arrangements of things, and I believe, the Sioux). I am still researching much of this-as I am curious about a supposed 17th generation grandmother of mine, Amonute Powhattan-thinking they might be from Tuscany wayyyyyyyyyy back.
I believe that there were many who spoke of good things, taught good messages, working towards what most organized positive religions do. Do you believe in strength in ‘solidarity’, singlemindedness of purpose? The words of Abraham Lincoln, a house divided against itself cannot stand. This is in agreement with what you said that we must become united. Christ has God’s presence living so much in his spirit, that he does not understand his mother’s concern and not knowing where he was at age 12. He is working throughout his life to unite the tribes separated from overwork and oversemanticism of the law used to separate, for power and control. He further states that that alone should be God’s (in the Lord’'s prayer). We are all children of God in the sense that He is our creator. Out of love for this God, we see a responsibility to live good, fruitful, lives that help others. In Mark 3:25, is where Lincoln got his quote…yes, he was giving a sermon, but needn’t have cited his reference as it was common knowledge of his time as that was the school textbook known to most. So with this unity of spirit alone, why is it that you will not accept Christ solely, to give more strength to the unity to ‘commune’ with God and all believers in the positive? It is through Faith that we know these things, it is with Hope that we work for a united future, it is with Love, we can feel and know that a truth must exist to unite us, It is the Spirit that gives the breath of Life to that Love. The beauty of the poetry of B’hai is undeniable, moving…let that not separate us from a Truth that can unite us. How big of a leap of Faith, can you make?
May God bless you and keep you, may His countenance shine upon you.
I believe the tribes got separated at different points in the journey…for even through mythology, certain truths shine through, legends more truths shine through, but of ancient history, it is the ‘jewish’ record keeping that has kept the most factual accounts of the histories…but not of those as they got separated, for which we now look at bits and pieces of archaeology and anthropology.
I believe that there were many who spoke of good things, taught good messages, working towards what most organized positive religions do. Do you believe in strength in ‘solidarity’, singlemindedness of purpose? The words of Abraham Lincoln, a house divided against itself cannot stand. This is in agreement with what you said that we must become united. Christ has God’s presence living so much in his spirit, that he does not understand his mother’s concern and not knowing where he was at age 12. He is working throughout his life to unite the tribes separated from overwork and oversemanticism of the law used to separate, for power and control. He further states that that alone should be God’s (in the Lord’'s prayer). We are all children of God in the sense that He is our creator. Out of love for this God, we see a responsibility to live good, fruitful, lives that help others. In Mark 3:25, is where Lincoln got his quote…yes, he was giving a sermon, but needn’t have cited his reference as it was common knowledge of his time as that was the school textbook known to most. So with this unity of spirit alone, why is it that you will not accept Christ solely, to give more strength to the unity to ‘commune’ with God and all believers in the positive? It is through Faith that we know these things, it is with Hope that we work for a united future, it is with Love, we can feel and know that a truth must exist to unite us, It is the Spirit that gives the breath of Life to that Love. The beauty of the poetry of B’hai is undeniable, moving…let that not separate us from a Truth that can unite us. How big of a leap of Faith, can you make?
May God bless you and keep you, may His countenance shine upon you.
I believe the tribes got separated at different points in the journey…for even through mythology, certain truths shine through, legends more truths shine through, but of ancient history, it is the ‘jewish’ record keeping that has kept the most factual accounts of the histories…but not of those as they got separated, for which we now look at bits and pieces of archaeology and anthropology.
D
daler
Guest
D
daler
Guest
Dear Abbi,
I responded to your very thoughtful comments last night and was pretty sure that I sent it to you to address your very relevant thoughts. I’m pretty sure I hit the buttons right to send it, but might have been tired and hit a wrong key. Anyway, I just wanted to resend my reply and continue the conversation a little more with you if you were so inclined. If it does not post this time, then I have to wonder if for some reason the moderator “moderated” what I had to say for some reason, although I thought my words were relevant, sincere, and a proper response to a finely worded bunch of thoughts you kindly sent my way. So I’m going to resend this again to me, and will you kindly let me know if you have received it for me? I very much would also appreciate your continued thoughts on the subjects we discussed, as I get much out of these dialogues. Thank you, ever so much. Dale
So with this unity of spirit alone, why is it that you will not accept Christ solely, to give more strength to the unity to ‘commune’ with God and all believers in the positive? It is through Faith that we know these things, it is with Hope that we work for a united future, it is with Love, we can feel and know that a truth must exist to unite us, It is the Spirit that gives the breath of Life to that Love. The beauty of the poetry of B’hai is undeniable, moving…let that not separate us from a Truth that can unite us. How big of a leap of Faith, can you make?
May God bless you and keep you, may His countenance shine upon you.
I believe the tribes got separated at different points in the journey…for even through mythology, certain truths shine through, legends more truths shine through, but of ancient history, it is the ‘jewish’ record keeping that has kept the most factual accounts of the histories…but not of those as they got separated, for which we now look at bits and pieces of archaeology and anthropology.
Dear Abbi (Do you remember the column: “Dear Abbey”? ; -)
I want to thank you for your warm, concise, and thorough commentary. The words of Black Elk touch the soul, as do so many of the quotes of those Native leaders of not so long ago. That God, the Great Spirit, touched and inspired them, there can be no doubt. Interesting the connections you make from the Hebrew. Are you familiar with the Lakota saying:
Mitakuye Oyasin (All Are Related) is phrase in the Lakota Sioux language. It reflects the world view of Interconnectedness, and is inherent as a belief that we are all of one race, the human race, and that even all creatures are related. Modern science has finally caught up with this, for we all share much of the same DNA.
Absolutely we need that solidarity: “Nothing short of the unity of the entire human race will suffice to heal the ills which afflict mankind.” Baha’u’llah says. Also, “Be as the fingers of one hand.” and “Ye are all the fruits of one tree and the leaves of just one branch.”
So the question becomes “How? Kimosabe”…
(Please forgive my humor if it is inappropriate. Can’t always stop it, you know…)
The house of humanity has long been divided, competing too much, so many wars. If our fingers acted like that we wouldn’t have much use for our hand.
I do fully accept Christ, whether that is easily understood or not, but believe Him when He said, “Verily, before Abraham was, I am.” This, to me, says that He is an eternal, spiritual Being, whose Reality exceeds the temporary human embodiment in Jesus.
Baha’is use the term, “Manifestation” of God, as you might know. Meaning that God, Who is in His Essence unknowable, is made known to us through His Manifestations, Who are like Perfect Mirrors reflecting His knowledge, will, and attributes. “He who hath seen Me hath seen the Father.”
But that mortal “mirror” made of dust, is itself not God, can be crucified, scourged, etc., while that eternal Being cannot be killed. He always was, and will always be.
Also, “The Father is greater than I.” and “Very truly I tell you, the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does.” which works with the idea that He is an Instrument of God’s will, that the mortal side of HIm is not God, but the reflection of God is in Him.
All the world’s religions speak of a “Return” of “their” Prophet, or One to come Who will fulfill the ancient prophecies of their Holy Books, or traditions.
The Jews still await the coming of “the Lord of Hosts”
The Hindus await the return of “Krsna”
The Buddhists await “Maitreye”, the Buddha of Universal Brotherhood.
The Zoroastrians (the Magi were this) await Shah Bahram
The Christians the Return of Christ
The Muslims await the Qa’im, or Mihdi, and Jesus to return.
The Native Americans also await their Promised One.
Baha’is believe that Baha’u’llah is the Promised One of all the religions Who has fulfilled all of these prophetic expectations and is the One foretold by the Prophets, all of Them.
The Hidden Words begins:
HE IS THE GLORY OF GLORIES
This is that which hath descended from the realm of glory, uttered by the tongue of power and might, and revealed unto the Prophets of old. We have taken the inner essence thereof and clothed it in the garment of brevity, as a token of grace unto the righteous, that they may stand faithful unto the Covenant of God, may fulfill in their lives His trust, and in the realm of spirit obtain the gem of Divine virtue.
May God bless you in Christ’s Holy Name… Dale
I responded to your very thoughtful comments last night and was pretty sure that I sent it to you to address your very relevant thoughts. I’m pretty sure I hit the buttons right to send it, but might have been tired and hit a wrong key. Anyway, I just wanted to resend my reply and continue the conversation a little more with you if you were so inclined. If it does not post this time, then I have to wonder if for some reason the moderator “moderated” what I had to say for some reason, although I thought my words were relevant, sincere, and a proper response to a finely worded bunch of thoughts you kindly sent my way. So I’m going to resend this again to me, and will you kindly let me know if you have received it for me? I very much would also appreciate your continued thoughts on the subjects we discussed, as I get much out of these dialogues. Thank you, ever so much. Dale
So with this unity of spirit alone, why is it that you will not accept Christ solely, to give more strength to the unity to ‘commune’ with God and all believers in the positive? It is through Faith that we know these things, it is with Hope that we work for a united future, it is with Love, we can feel and know that a truth must exist to unite us, It is the Spirit that gives the breath of Life to that Love. The beauty of the poetry of B’hai is undeniable, moving…let that not separate us from a Truth that can unite us. How big of a leap of Faith, can you make?
May God bless you and keep you, may His countenance shine upon you.
I believe the tribes got separated at different points in the journey…for even through mythology, certain truths shine through, legends more truths shine through, but of ancient history, it is the ‘jewish’ record keeping that has kept the most factual accounts of the histories…but not of those as they got separated, for which we now look at bits and pieces of archaeology and anthropology.
Dear Abbi (Do you remember the column: “Dear Abbey”? ; -)
I want to thank you for your warm, concise, and thorough commentary. The words of Black Elk touch the soul, as do so many of the quotes of those Native leaders of not so long ago. That God, the Great Spirit, touched and inspired them, there can be no doubt. Interesting the connections you make from the Hebrew. Are you familiar with the Lakota saying:
Mitakuye Oyasin (All Are Related) is phrase in the Lakota Sioux language. It reflects the world view of Interconnectedness, and is inherent as a belief that we are all of one race, the human race, and that even all creatures are related. Modern science has finally caught up with this, for we all share much of the same DNA.
Absolutely we need that solidarity: “Nothing short of the unity of the entire human race will suffice to heal the ills which afflict mankind.” Baha’u’llah says. Also, “Be as the fingers of one hand.” and “Ye are all the fruits of one tree and the leaves of just one branch.”
So the question becomes “How? Kimosabe”…
(Please forgive my humor if it is inappropriate. Can’t always stop it, you know…)
The house of humanity has long been divided, competing too much, so many wars. If our fingers acted like that we wouldn’t have much use for our hand.
I do fully accept Christ, whether that is easily understood or not, but believe Him when He said, “Verily, before Abraham was, I am.” This, to me, says that He is an eternal, spiritual Being, whose Reality exceeds the temporary human embodiment in Jesus.
Baha’is use the term, “Manifestation” of God, as you might know. Meaning that God, Who is in His Essence unknowable, is made known to us through His Manifestations, Who are like Perfect Mirrors reflecting His knowledge, will, and attributes. “He who hath seen Me hath seen the Father.”
But that mortal “mirror” made of dust, is itself not God, can be crucified, scourged, etc., while that eternal Being cannot be killed. He always was, and will always be.
Also, “The Father is greater than I.” and “Very truly I tell you, the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does.” which works with the idea that He is an Instrument of God’s will, that the mortal side of HIm is not God, but the reflection of God is in Him.
All the world’s religions speak of a “Return” of “their” Prophet, or One to come Who will fulfill the ancient prophecies of their Holy Books, or traditions.
The Jews still await the coming of “the Lord of Hosts”
The Hindus await the return of “Krsna”
The Buddhists await “Maitreye”, the Buddha of Universal Brotherhood.
The Zoroastrians (the Magi were this) await Shah Bahram
The Christians the Return of Christ
The Muslims await the Qa’im, or Mihdi, and Jesus to return.
The Native Americans also await their Promised One.
Baha’is believe that Baha’u’llah is the Promised One of all the religions Who has fulfilled all of these prophetic expectations and is the One foretold by the Prophets, all of Them.
The Hidden Words begins:
HE IS THE GLORY OF GLORIES
This is that which hath descended from the realm of glory, uttered by the tongue of power and might, and revealed unto the Prophets of old. We have taken the inner essence thereof and clothed it in the garment of brevity, as a token of grace unto the righteous, that they may stand faithful unto the Covenant of God, may fulfill in their lives His trust, and in the realm of spirit obtain the gem of Divine virtue.
May God bless you in Christ’s Holy Name… Dale
S
steve_b
Guest
How far back in history do you want to go for your study of this? What proofs / truths in other religions do you expect to find?
W:
Medical advances today, have all but eliminated that risk to mother.
W:
We know who started Islam and when it started. They claim they descended from Abraham through Ishmael. That geneology concerning Abraham and Ishmael can be seen [Gen 17:20…]
However, God’s covenant is through Abraham → Issac and Jacob [Ex 2:24], [Lev 26:42…,] 2 Kings 13:23…] and multiple places in the NTrefer to this, NOT in the direction of Abraham → Ishmael.
W:
We are Christians because of Jesus, bad Christians aside.
W:
We believe what is true. Jesus is provable as is everything He did and said.
No other world religion even comes close.
R
rinnie
Guest
Ah this is a simple one.
Check out all faiths and you shall find truth. But what I have learned the RCC has the FULLNESS of the truth.
Why be Catholic. Because you want all of the truth. You will find the fullness of the faith in the Catholic Church.
Plus the added goodies. Confession for sins, the most Important the Living bread and body of Christ. Can’t get that outside of the Catholic Church.
The Sacraments are pretty much the added bonus.
B
benjohnson
Guest
Let me play the part of the curmudgeon: You have no obligation to be open to other religions at all.
There’s a particular depth in the Christian faith that defies anybody to explore it in a single lifetime, and given that our time here is short, let us dive into this good challenge and leave the shallow waters.
There’s a particular depth in the Christian faith that defies anybody to explore it in a single lifetime, and given that our time here is short, let us dive into this good challenge and leave the shallow waters.
D
daler
Guest
Thank you, my friend, and may God bless you ever with His ongoing guidance and love
R
RyanBlack
Guest
I realize this is tangential to the point of the thread itself, but that’s not true, even according to the teaching of the Catholic Church herself. The Eastern Orthodox Church, the Oriental Orthodox Church, and the Assyrian Church of the East all have the same seven sacraments the Catholic Church has.
A
Abbigaelann
Guest
What is rightness? What is correct? If someone simply loves God, with all their heart, you would make them feel inferior? inept? why??? You didn’t remember clause 1820 of the Catechism? what do you feel??? do you??? Love is an emotion…love is more than emotion…but we are humans, we cope and deal with this love not as Willie Wonka stating all the problems with prospective winners of the ‘golden ticket’!
D
daler
Guest
“There shall be One Fold, and One Shepherd.”
Are we ready for that? In all our colors, and cultures, and nationalities, and different beliefs, etc, etc, etc…
A
Abbigaelann
Guest
One ‘true’ faith.
Interesting when interpreted by man.
The old testament showed what happened to the 12 tribes of Israel-they split up and made more rules and laws separating man more from the spirit of the law, i.e. getting caught up in the letter of the law.
The new testament shows the apostles, 12, and what did they do? Started having interpretation arguments? Letter vs spirit.
So by demanding, by man’s interpretation, rather than feeling this love, living the love of the spirit, we are to follow the letter of ‘one true’ faith…when how many parishes, how many diocese, how many denominations, maximize their own positivities and minimize certain negativities rather than all law is equal? Due to culture of any community, it becomes more a matter of pick your poison. It is with love that we even overlook the overzealous scrupulous meticulous entities that threaten the love in our communities, as if so hard hearted and cold that they do not feel objective one : LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD…and God is LOVE. When they forget this, have they not lost sight of the objective and become lost to the meaning of any of it?
Interesting when interpreted by man.
The old testament showed what happened to the 12 tribes of Israel-they split up and made more rules and laws separating man more from the spirit of the law, i.e. getting caught up in the letter of the law.
The new testament shows the apostles, 12, and what did they do? Started having interpretation arguments? Letter vs spirit.
So by demanding, by man’s interpretation, rather than feeling this love, living the love of the spirit, we are to follow the letter of ‘one true’ faith…when how many parishes, how many diocese, how many denominations, maximize their own positivities and minimize certain negativities rather than all law is equal? Due to culture of any community, it becomes more a matter of pick your poison. It is with love that we even overlook the overzealous scrupulous meticulous entities that threaten the love in our communities, as if so hard hearted and cold that they do not feel objective one : LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD…and God is LOVE. When they forget this, have they not lost sight of the objective and become lost to the meaning of any of it?
A
Abbigaelann
Guest
The church is like the bride?
If you were married, your spouse could only go about one set standard for marriage and you would condemn that person, incapable of loving that person, because their view of marriage let alone meeting all the demands of spouse were not exactitude?
If you were married, your spouse could only go about one set standard for marriage and you would condemn that person, incapable of loving that person, because their view of marriage let alone meeting all the demands of spouse were not exactitude?
- Status