Old (not quite ancient) Liturgical Resources

[JMJ_coder]

Hello,

I am looking for information on the Liturgy - both Mass and the Liturgy of the Hours - from the early 18th century. The year in particular I am looking for is 1707 and the Feast of Our Lady of Mount Carmel. I am not certain whether this Feast was celebrated in the Roman usage or Carmelite usage.

Things I am looking for are:

Antiphons, Order of Psalms and Psalms Used, Lessons - for both Vespers, any Propers for the Mass, etc.

Your aid is greatly appreciated.

 

[Caesar]

I do not have the time right this second, but later tonight I will type out the Mass from my Roman Missal for you.

 

[JMJ_coder]

Hello,

I do not have the time right this second, but later tonight I will type out the Mass from my Roman Missal for you.

I have a pre-Vatican II Missal - the new Baronius Motu Proprio edition. But, I am uncertain whether the propers were the same (same with Vespers). I had heard that some of those things changed - usually the Psalms to be used and their order - if I remember the conversation correctly.

I don’t have a pre-Vatican II Breviary, though - so if you have that, a type-up would be most appreciated.

 

[JMJ_coder]

Hello,

By the way - I am most interested in the Vespers- over and beyond the Mass text.

 

[Caesar]

Hello,

I have a pre-Vatican II Missal - the new Baronius Motu Proprio edition. But, I am uncertain whether the propers were the same (same with Vespers). I had heard that some of those things changed - usually the Psalms to be used and their order - if I remember the conversation correctly.

I don’t have a pre-Vatican II Breviary, though - so if you have that, a type-up would be most appreciated.

I’m afraid that I am currently hunting for a breviary myself.

 

[FrRJBoyd]

Hello,

I am looking for information on the Liturgy - both Mass and the Liturgy of the Hours - from the early 18th century. The year in particular I am looking for is 1707 and the Feast of Our Lady of Mount Carmel. I am not certain whether this Feast was celebrated in the Roman usage or Carmelite usage.

Things I am looking for are:

Antiphons, Order of Psalms and Psalms Used, Lessons - for both Vespers, any Propers for the Mass, etc.

Your aid is greatly appreciated.

I have the Masses from the Carmelite rite and the Discalced Carmelite proper… which are different. The O Carms used the Gospel about the woman crying our to the Lord, “Blessed is the womb that bore you” and have a proper sequence, Flos Carmeli. The O.C.D. Mass uses the Gospel from John, “Woman, behold your son” at the foot of the cross, and does not include the sequence. The Mass from the Missale Romanum is different still, and I don’t have any reason to think it would be different from the one included in the 1962 Missal… unless you know something I don’t. If you give me your e-mail address via a private message, I’ll send the texts I have to you.

God bless,

Fr. Boyd

 

[FrRJBoyd]

Hello,

By the way - I am most interested in the Vespers- over and beyond the Mass text.

Here’s a link to a breviary from 1828. I don’t think there were any major revisions of the breviary between the 18th and 19th centuries, just the addition of new feasts. Urban VIII had already “corrected” the hymns in the 17th century. You have to wait until the 20th century for more changes.

books.google.com/books?id=WiYBAAAAQAAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=breviarium&lr=&as_brr=1&ei=8zLSR6SVIpKqiwHWl-GrBQ#PPA410,M1

 

[JMJ_coder]

Hello,

Thank you Father - so much!!!

If you don’t mind, I have a couple of other questions.

1. The propers for the Feast of our Lady of Mount Carmel seem sparse - are most of them coming from the Common?
2. Would that feast (a double major) use the Psalter for Sunday Week 1 - or what was the organization of the Psalter back then and what was used on a double major feast?
3. In that year - 1707 - the Feast of Our Lady of Mount Carmel fell on a Saturday according to the Gregorian Calendar that was in use in Rome at that time (the Feast took place in Rome). Would that affect the Vespers - especially Second Vespers - at all?