On burning heretics

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Dakota_Roberts

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Is it morally permissible to burn heretics who refuse to repent and are willfully spreading heresy?
 
Dakota_Roberts said:
Is it morally permissible to burn heretics who refuse to repent and are willfully spreading heresy?
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I seem to remember two Apostles asking Jesus if he wanted them to call down fire on some people for rejecting Jesus in their town. He rebuked them for it.
 
Dakota_Roberts said:
Is it morally permissible to burn heretics who refuse to repent and are willfully spreading heresy?
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The state has the right, if such a thing is a civil law, but it seems that today it would do more harm than good if heresy were a civil law with such a penalty.

“The United States bishops, in their majority statement on capital punishment, conceded that “Catholic teaching has accepted the principle that the State has the right to take the life of a person guilty of an extremely serious crime.””

Something to read:
catholiceducation.org/articles/religion/re0461.html
 
No. It never was morally permissible. It was never funny. It still isn’t either permissible or funny. That the Church once thought it ok, and that some in the church still do, is scandalous, and a significant impediment to those who know some history seeing the Church as other than a human institution.
 
Hokomai said:
No. It never was morally permissible. It was never funny. It still isn’t either permissible or funny. That the Church once thought it ok, and that some in the church still do, is scandalous, and a significant impediment to those who know some history seeing the Church as other than a human institution.
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The Church didn’t burn heretics… the state did.
 
bmullins said:
I seem to remember two Apostles asking Jesus if he wanted them to call down fire on some people for rejecting Jesus in their town. He rebuked them for it.
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…And rightly so. If they wanted to make those rejecters of the gospel crispy, they were going to have to use their own fire. tehdumch
 
Hokomai said:
No. It never was morally permissible. It was never funny. It still isn’t either permissible or funny. That the Church once thought it ok, and that some in the church still do, is scandalous, and a significant impediment to those who know some history seeing the Church as other than a human institution.
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This simply shows a lack of understanding of what heresy is and **why **it was such a serious crime in the days when the State used capital measures against heretics.

Do you not believe the State should have the authority to execute criminals for treasonous acts?
 
Dakota_Roberts said:
Is it morally permissible to burn heretics who refuse to repent and are willfully spreading heresy?
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By the time you carried out the mandatory feasability studies, the environmental impact studies, gained the necessary EPA permits, drew up a health and occupational safety plan, gained permision to log the forests for timber, informed the authorities about how you’d dispose of the ash and cinders, the poor bastard would have recanted and converted anyway. :rolleyes:
 
Dakota_Roberts said:
Is it morally permissible to burn heretics who refuse to repent and are willfully spreading heresy?
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The Church can only apply ecclesiastical penalties, not civil or criminal ones. Therefore, such a penalty would be strictly a matter of civil law whether or not heresy was a capital crime or not.

In addition, the canonical penalty for heresy is latae sententiae excommunication, not ferendae sententiae, so without a formal declaration (which is rather rare), it would be very difficult to say with certitude that a person was a formal heretic in the eyes of the Church. Particularly with the revulsion that most modern bishops have expressed toward the death penalty (particularly if that penalty was to be exacted through flames), if such a penalty was to be imposed as a result of such a formal declaration, I would imagine that public declarations of the imposition of latae sententiae excommunications for heresy would become almost nonexistent in such a country (not that they’re at all commonplace now).

And then we need to remember that Vitandi excommunications have disappeared out of canon law. So, in theory, somebody who was excommunicated (by default, toleranti), could still appeal to the Church for sanctuary.

Of course, one must take into account the morality of the death penalty, as well, in general. But that is a different discussion that has been tossed back and forth on CAF for years.

😛
 
Dakota_Roberts said:
Is it morally permissible to burn heretics who refuse to repent and are willfully spreading heresy?
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I don’t believe so, no.

I do believe that a devoutly Catholic society would have a right to criminalize heresy, and the right to protect itself from criminals, up to and including the death penalty if there were no other way to do so.

But burning is simply grossly inhumane, gratuitous, and vile. If the goal is to protect society than the means should be commensurate – at worst a quick death by noose, firing squad, or lethal injection.
 
1ke said:
This simply shows a lack of understanding of what heresy is and **why **it was such a serious crime in the days when the State used capital measures against heretics.

Do you not believe the State should have the authority to execute criminals for treasonous acts?
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i do not believe this. Neither do the majority of people in democratic countries, the vast majority of which have outlawed execution.
 
sw85 said:
I don’t believe so, no.

I do believe that a devoutly Catholic society would have a right to criminalize heresy, and the right to protect itself from criminals, up to and including the death penalty if there were no other way to do so.

But burning is simply grossly inhumane, gratuitous, and vile. If the goal is to protect society than the means should be commensurate – at worst a quick death by noose, firing squad, or lethal injection.
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You are seriously saying it would be ok to legislate for the execution of Anglicans, Baptists, Mormons? I hope you raise this in RCIA.
 
Hokomai said:
You are seriously saying it would be ok to legislate for the execution of Anglicans, Baptists, Mormons? I hope you raise this in RCIA.
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That isn’t what he said. Just FYI, Christians born into a heretical religion are not heretics. They have not personally committed heresey, per se.
 
Killing people for what they believe is always and everywhere wrong.
 
ahs said:
That isn’t what he said. Just FYI, Christians born into a heretical religion are not heretics. They have not personally committed heresey, per se.
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That would explain the thriving communities of Albigensians in France.
 
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