Dear sister Sunflower,
I don’t know if anyone has told you yet (I have not read through the entire thread), but you are misrepresenting the Catholic dogma on the IC here. The dogma does NOT teach that Mary “did NOT have the original sin.”
I have spent my whole life at Catholic schools, and yes, that’s what I was taught…that she was conceived without original sin and without the “stain” [whatever that means]. It may have been an error, not all nuns are theologians, so it doesn’t matter if something wasn’t quite accurate in the way it was presented. I was taught she was created a new Eve, just like Adam & Eve were created without original sin, but she used her Free Will to remain in that state, unlike the other two.
It simply teaches that Mary was preserved from the STAIN of original sin, the STAIN of original sin being defined as the SPIRITUAL CONSEQUENCES of original sin (i.e., loss of sanctifying grace, loss of original justice). The dogma does NOT teach in any way or form that Mary was preserved from PHYSICAL consequences of the original sin (i.e., death, illness, corruption). Here is an excellent explanation from the old Catholic Encyclopedia (1917):
The term conception does not mean the active or generative conception by her parents. Her body was formed in the womb of the mother, and the father had the usual share in its formation. The question does not concern the immaculateness of the generative activity of her parents. Neither does it concern the passive conception absolutely and simply (conceptio seminis carnis, inchoata), which, according to the order of nature, precedes the infusion of the rational soul. The person is truly conceived when the soul is created and infused into the body. Mary was preserved exempt from all stain of original sin at the first moment of her animation, and sanctifying grace was given to her before sin could have taken effect in her soul… But she was not made exempt from the temporal penalties of Adam – from sorrow, bodily infirmities, and death.
This clearly explains she wasn’t exempt from death. However, “sanctifying grace was given…before sin could take effect”… to me means that the original sin [which happens AT moment of conception] was NOT present, and the the grace was given before she was ABLE to sin on her own free will.
In effect, the Grace Mary received at her conception is exactly the same Grace we receive at Baptism. In the same way that the Grace of Baptism does not preserve us from physical death and suffering, neither did the Grace Mary received at her conception preserve her from death and suffering.
Never thought of it this way…interesting. A foreshadowing of a sacrament!
Further, the dogma of the IC does NOT teach that Mary was preserved from the stain of original sin at the moment of her conception for the purpose of bearing Christ. That is a notion that many Latins have simply assumed. It might logically flow from the dogma of the IC, but not necessarily so, and the dogma, nor its apostolic constitution, makes such an assertion or comment. Eastern and Oriental Christians rather believe, on the testimony of a few Fathers in the early Church, that the specific Grace to be able to bear the FULL and UNVEILED divinity of Christ (different from the Grace of Baptism she received at her conception) was given to her at the Annunciation. IMO, it is this new and different Grace that she received at the Annunciation by which Mary’s virginity was miraculously preserved despite giving birth to our Lord, as unanimously taught by the Fathers of the Church.
Well, again that was the purpose I was given as explanation for why Mary received this gift. It makes sense, so I never questioned it. And, I never heard of the other explanation, that she received that grace at the Annunciation, though it would make sense as well. In fact, it reminded me of our Confirmation, which we take later, as adults to use our free will to confirm our Baptism. Another foreshadowing of a Sacrament!
Blessings,
Marduk
) your point is valid…and I can see a whole host of other issues opening up from that passage…