On Pornography and Fantasy Worlds

[mytruepower2]

This may sound trivial, since I’m not currently involved in this sin, nor seeking to dispute any of the church’s teachings on the subject, but while reading the catechism, I came across the following on the subject of pornography…

“It immerses all who are involved in the illusion of a fantasy world. It is a grave offense.”

I assume they mean that pornography; not fantasy worlds are grave offenses, because to be honest, every kind and civil act I’ve done for others for at least two years has been motivated largely by the belief that Heaven was essentially a fantasy-lover’s paradise; an endless, supernatural adventure, not unlike the kind written about by Lewis or Tolkien. Furthermore, everything I’ve ever read by Thomas Aquinas seems to confirm that Heaven contains all possible good things, so… Is it really so important to meet the world on its own terms, as long as we’re trying our best to follow God’s law? Is it really so necessary to look at “real life” “realistically?”

I guess what I’m asking is; is it viable to be motivated by the desire to have our fantasies fulfilled, as long as it leads you to sacrifice and such? It’s really sort of part of a bigger question about what kinds of desires God considers acceptable, or whether he even has anything to say on the subject. I’m curious to see what people have to say about this.

 

[Semper_Zelare]

I’ve heard a lot of people say certain things they think Heaven will have.

On the other side, there are plenty of people who say Heaven is a literally unending praise sung to God. Like the 24 angels or whatever that are described in Revelation are in constant song.

I myself don’t really spend much time at all thinking about what Heaven’s like. And I’ve heard a lot of other Catholics on here say the same. Mainly because we’re too busy caring about the Church on Earth. But the bottom line is: no one that goes to Heaven is disappointed. There cannot be disappointment in Heaven.

So, that’s why I don’t think about what Heaven’s like really… it’s not going to be a let-down, it’s going to be the most awesome experience. And I could’ve put 20 adjectives right there like “exuberant”, “jubilant”, “ecstatic”, “awe-inspiring”, “powerful” etc.

 

[Arizona_Mike]

*Home—that’s what heaven is. It won’t appear strange and faraway and “supernatural”, but utterly natural. Heaven is what we were designed for. All our epics seek it: It is the “home” of Odysseus, of Aeneas, of Frodo, of E.T. Heaven is not escapist. Worldliness is escapist. Heaven is home.

People think heaven is escapist because they fear that thinking about heaven will distract us from living well here and now. It is exactly the opposite, and the lives of the saints and our Lord himself prove it. Those who truly love heaven will do the most for earth. It’s easy to see why. Those who love the homeland best work the hardest in the colonies to make them resemble the homeland. “Thy kingdom come. … on earth as it is in heaven.”

The pregnant woman who plans a live birth cares for her unborn baby; the woman who plans for an abortion does not. Highways that lead somewhere are well maintained; dead ends are not. So if we see life as a road to heaven, some of heaven’s own glory will reflect back onto that road, if only by anticipation: the world is charged with the grandeur of God and every event smells of eternity.*

• Professor Peter Kreeft

 

[Colton_McLane]

Mytruepower. The Catholic Church fails to define very broad words. Obviously porn is evil it is something mainly curious youngsters do. As for fantasies. I believe that the Church only means that sexual fantasies are screwed up. I guess fantasy could be involved with immoral sexual acts and what not. But it all does not make sense in the end anyhow. What I mean is… If we are just doing a test down here to get to heaven, then why the hell did God put us here in the first place??? Come’n, We are Gods masterpiece, we are the most beautiful thing he created. We are even above angels in a sense. So seriously why would he create each one of us knowing that some of us are going to burn in His hell for eternity. See man, religion will always go in circles, know matter how much you seek the truth you will never find it. All we have to believe in is something that some other human passed down. Just judge things by natural law. Is this moral? If somebody is messed up enough to think porn is then that’s their problem, they ain’t ever gonna get a real girl/boy friend.

 

[mytruepower2]

Thank you very much for your replies.

Semper Zelare;
I think I found your reply to be both the simplest and the most helpful; a reinforcement of what we already know can sometimes be the best medicine.

There’s no denying that all of us are very busy in this life, but that business is itself a drain on our spirits unless we have some hope; some motive to drive us on. I suppose I’ve simply absorbed too many bad cultural influences, seeking to paint Heaven as something other than what it is, to the point where I have a hard time taking its perfect ability to satisfy for granted.

Another thing that’s made the journey difficult for me is that no matter how much of my time I sacrifice to help others, or to pray, and no matter how often I fast, it never gets any easier to feel sympathetic towards them; or to -desire- to help them. I guess I just need to know that in the end, desires and feelings aren’t what counts.

Arizona Mike:
I’m afraid the quote that you provided only troubled me, because the very strangeness and absense of things normal is pretty much the only thing I really want for its own sake. Everything else; even charity, prayer and good deeds; I’ve always seen more as a means to that end.
I thank you for your good intentions, but I don’t want a home to live in. I want an adventure to be alive in.

Colton McLane:
I’m afraid you’ve missed the point. I already have my own reasons for never being able to be satisfied with the company of other human beings (which doesn’t mean I can’t love them; it only means it’s a constant sacrifice.)
You see, modern astrophysicists have virtually proven that the expansion of our physical universe will continue indefinitely, matter breaking apart from matter in increased entropy, until there’s nothing left of the universe but a nebulous gas so thin, that protons and electrons will be light years apart. Long before that, man, and everything that could ever have supported him will have ceased to exist. The universe simply won’t be able to accomidate life after that.
This is the only non-religious conception of the mankind that science has left us with; a random, insignificant species of creatures, floating on a speck of dust in a cosmic maelstrom of motion and matter, purposeless and self-destructive by nature, and indeed, doomed to perish, both as individuals, and as a species, in a fairly short time.
Under the circumstances, I think you can understand why I refuse to accept that understanding. The universe, such as it is, offers no opportunities for greatness; not even anything that transcends the petty, limited concerns of the mortals hanging on to its fabric for their tiny, limited lives.
I want nothing from mortal man.
However, that doesn’t mean that I don’t want anything at all. I want a lot of things, in fact; all very impressive and difficult to bring about, and I’ll sacrifice, pray, fast, do good things for others and so forth, if that’s what’s needed to get them. As for humility; the recognition of my own weaknesses, that comes just from being a realist. Of course I’m weak. I detest it, but it’s a fact of life, and it would just be further weakness to refuse to acknowledge that.
I know this is not usual. I’m well aware of that. I’m just concerned about two things.

1. Are these efforts enough for God?
2. Are God’s promises enough for me?
   As long as the answer to both of these questions is yes, I can afford to stop worrying and move on to other things.
   You’re probably right about the church’s standpoint on sex, however.

 

[Spyral]

I think what they mean is that pornography is fake. The people aren’t in love, aren’t pro-creating, aren’t being unitive. One might as well watch a car engine ticking over.

It might be arousing, sexually gratifying appealing to our more base desires but it’s not real in the same way a breath of fresh air is real or a loving relationship is real. To that end it is a ‘fantasy’.

I also don’t think the RCC has major issues with Tolkien or D&D or the like.

 

[mytruepower2]

I think what they mean is that pornography is fake. The people aren’t in love, aren’t pro-creating, aren’t being unitive. One might as well watch a car engine ticking over.

It might be arousing, sexually gratifying appealing to our more base desires but it’s not real in the same way a breath of fresh air is real or a loving relationship is real. To that end it is a ‘fantasy’.

I also don’t think the RCC has major issues with Tolkien or D&D or the like.

God bless you. That’s the piece of the puzzle I’ve been looking for. Perhaps “fantasy world” wasn’t the best phrase for them to use.

Pornography encourages fake relationships, which have no future and can never be fulfilling on a deeper level. This is clearly true. However, this is not the same thing as merely desiring that the world was different than it is.

Furthermore, this sort of reasoning could never apply to Heaven, since Heaven isn’t less real than this life, but -more- real. Thank you very much.

 

[Chochy]

Dear Ones,

I’ve benefited greatly, by succeeding in organizing and improving my private world. (Granted it is a work in progress.) My relationship with God, allows me to live in this world, but not of this world.

Blessings - Chochy

 

[Semper_Zelare]

Thank you very much for your replies.

Semper Zelare;
I think I found your reply to be both the simplest and the most helpful; a reinforcement of what we already know can sometimes be the best medicine.

There’s no denying that all of us are very busy in this life, but that business is itself a drain on our spirits unless we have some hope; some motive to drive us on. I suppose I’ve simply absorbed too many bad cultural influences, seeking to paint Heaven as something other than what it is, to the point where I have a hard time taking its perfect ability to satisfy for granted.

Another thing that’s made the journey difficult for me is that no matter how much of my time I sacrifice to help others, or to pray, and no matter how often I fast, it never gets any easier to feel sympathetic towards them; or to -desire- to help them. I guess I just need to know that in the end, desires and feelings aren’t what counts.

I’m glad you found my post helpful.

Idk, I’ve just heard so many different expectations of what kind of stuff is in Heaven… but at the end of the day everything we can imagine Heaven as isn’t going to be better than Heaven. No matter how long we daydream about Heaven, when we get there it’s still going to blow our wildest dreams.

As for helping and serving others you are right, we are called to love others as ourselves. Which is different than LIKING people. That’s how we can serve our enemies, we can serve our neighbors, but we don’t have to like them. We are human after all. So, we may be called to pray for people that wrong us, and forgive them in our hearts… but if they’re jerks we can still think of them as jerks lol

 

[mytruepower2]

I’m glad you found my post helpful.

Idk, I’ve just heard so many different expectations of what kind of stuff is in Heaven… but at the end of the day everything we can imagine Heaven as isn’t going to be better than Heaven. No matter how long we daydream about Heaven, when we get there it’s still going to blow our wildest dreams.

As for helping and serving others you are right, we are called to love others as ourselves. Which is different than LIKING people. That’s how we can serve our enemies, we can serve our neighbors, but we don’t have to like them. We are human after all. So, we may be called to pray for people that wrong us, and forgive them in our hearts… but if they’re jerks we can still think of them as jerks lol

Yup. That’s where all my hope for the future lies. If I had to like people, I’d be in trouble.