On the origins of the various Eastern Catholic churches

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SyroMalankara said:
The sister Orthodox Church to the Ruthenian Byzantine Church is the ACROD (American Carpatho-Rusyn Orthodox Diocese) under the Ecumenical Patriarch and also historically the OCA, although OCA is more Russian-leaning in praxis today.
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Yes, but they are not precursors of the Ruthenian Catholic Church (the opposite is true, especially in the case of ACROD). The “mother Church” of the Ruthenians is the Eparchy of Mukachevo in the Zakarpatska Oblast of modern Ukraine. It traces its history back to the foundation of Christianity in the the Slavic lands by Sts. Cyril & Methodius, so it could be said that this Church was Orthodox from the beginning in that it would have been part of the Patriarchate of Constantinople. Being isolated from its hierarchical roots after the fall of Constantinople, it eventually reunited with Rome via the Union of Uzhhorod.
 
Hi Brandon Cal. I’ve only read most of this thread so far, but let me ask for your definition for Eastern Catholics.

From what you’ve said it seems clear that you mean both Greek Catholics and Oriental Catholics, but I want to make sure because Eastern Catholic is sometimes used to mean Greek Catholics only.
 
Peter_J said:
Hi Brandon Cal. I’ve only read most of this thread so far, but let me ask for your definition for Eastern Catholics.

From what you’ve said it seems clear that you mean both Greek Catholics and Oriental Catholics, but I want to make sure because Eastern Catholic is sometimes used to mean Greek Catholics only.
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I’m sorry for any confusion I may have caused. As I mentioned in the first post I have a whole slew of questions to ask about Eastern Catholics (i.e. non-Latin Catholics) in general but I wanted to start with a single question as a foundation before I asked the others. That first question just so happened to only involve the Byzantine Catholic churches. I realize I engaged in the same equivocation back to the “non-Latin” definition in post #12. Again, very sorry for any confusion.

I have a fairly decent working knowledge of the various terms involved so I don’t mind folks giving answers that are particular to the Byzantines, the Syriacs, or the Assyrians/Malankara.

Edit: I might add, my purpose for posting this thread and my other thread in Non-Catholic Religions about Orthodox Autocephaly is ultimately a historical one. I’m trying to slowly understand the long and arduous history of how the various communions of Christendom have shuffled around over the years. I’m focusing more on communion and geography than liturgy and ritual to be honest. For example, I’m more interested in how the Syro-Malabar Catholic Church arose out of a community in India that originally was non-Ephesian (is that a word?) and was in communion with the Assyrians than I am in how the same church is ritualistically more similar to the Syriac Orthodox or Catholics, who ultimately arose in the Levant from non-Chalcedonians. I hope this makes sense. 🙂
 
Brandon_Cal said:
I’m sorry for any confusion I may have caused. As I mentioned in the first post I have a whole slew of questions to ask about Eastern Catholics (i.e. non-Latin Catholics) in general but I wanted to start with a single question as a foundation before I asked the others. That first question just so happened to only involve the Byzantine Catholic churches. I realize I engaged in the same equivocation back to the “non-Latin” definition in post #12. Again, very sorry for any confusion.
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🙂 Oh don’t worry, I noticed the confusing stuff to.
 
Brandon_Cal said:
  1. Where do the uniquely named Eastern Catholic churches fit in the context of Eastern Orthodoxy? For example, the Ruthenian Catholic Church. I don’t know of any national church in Orthodoxy corresponding to the Ruthenians (and ethnically the church seems to span a number of countries including the Czech Republic, Slovakia, Ukraine, Hungary, parts of Croatia, etc. Would the Orthodox Church of the Czech Lands and Slovakia be the closest equivalent?
  2. In light of SyroMalankara’s answer to my question about redundancy, what is expected to happen to the Eastern Catholic churches if reunion were to occur? The general concensus I’ve seen on these boards is that the ECCs would just be absorbed into their mother Orthodox churches, but now I’m starting to doubt that given this redundancy in other sui juris churches. Given enough time I would imagine that the ECCs will (or maybe already have) organically developed away from their mother Orthodox churches (and vice versa) such that if any reunion were to occur the two churches would still be distinct. Is this understanding correct?
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According to canon law those first baptized Orthodox are ascribed on conversion as members of the eastern Catholic Church closest to their ritual Orthodox Church, even if received into the Catholic Church at a Latin Church by Latin clergy. (This is not a rigid assignment.)

Reference: Comparative Sacramental Discipline in the CCEO and CIC, Canon Law Society of America, p. 255

*Eastern: *
  • Orthodox Church of America → Byzantine or Ukrainian or Russian Catholic
  • American Carpatho-Rusyn Orthodox → Byzantine or Slovak Catholic
  • Serbian Orthodox → Krizevci Catholic
  • Macedonian Orthodox → Macedonian Catholic
  • Greek Speaking Eastern Orthodox → Hellenic Greek Catholic
  • Arabic Speaking Eastern Orthodox → Melkite Greek Catholic
  • Romanian Orthodox → Romanian Catholic
  • Russian Orthodox → Russian Catholic
  • Belarussian Orthodox → Belarussian Catholic
  • Ukrainian Orthodox → Ukrainian Catholic
  • Bulgarian Orthodox → Bulganian Catholic
  • Hungarian Orthodox → Hungarian Catholic
  • Albanian Orthodox → Albanian Catholic
Oriental:*
  • Armenian Orthodox–> Armenian Catholic
  • Coptic Orthodox → Coptic Catholic
  • Ethiopian Orthodox → Ethiopian Catholic
  • Syrian Orthodox → Syrian Catholic
  • Indian Orthodox → Syro-Malankara Catholic
  • Mar Thoma Syrian → Syro-Malankara Catholic
  • Orthodox Syrian (Jacobite) → Syro-Malankara Catholic
  • Malabar Independent Syrian Church (Thozhiyoor) → Syro-Malankara Catholic
  • Church of South India, St. Thomas → Syro-Malankara Catholic
Assyrian:
  • Assyrian Orthodox → Chaldean Catholic
  • Syrian Malabarese → Syro-Malabar Catholic
  • Syro-Chaldean → Syro-Malabar Catholic
Latin:
  • Church of South India, not St. Thomas → Latin Catholic
Related to the Moscow Patriarchate:

    • Russian Orthodox Church Moscow Patriarchate 1794-1925 (supressed) 1990 …
    • Russian Orthodox Church Outside Russia 1920 …
    • Russian Orthodox Greek Catholic Church 1910-1925, self: … 1970, Orthodox Church of America …
    Ecumenical Patriarchate:
      • Greek Orthodox Archeparchy EP 1922 …
      • American Carpatho-Russian Orthodox Diocese EP (from ROGCC) 1938 …
 
As far as the Eastern Orthodox of the Byzantine Rite are concerned, it is impossible to establish when the schism(s) actually occurred, but it was not in 1054 as commonly cited. For example, the Serbian King (who confessed Orthodoxy) had a papal coronation in the 14th Century, well after the “1054 schism.”

Unlike the Protestant schism, which can be clearly dated to the “Fathers of the Reformation,” there was several hundred years of schisms and reunions between Rome and the Constantinople which finally ended in the ultimate schism after the Turks conquered Constantinople and gained influence over the Patriarch. However, after the Ecumenical Patriarch lost his influence over the former Byzantine Empire, there continued to be local reunions and schisms. The two greatest examples in my opinion are the Church of Kiev, who reentered union with Rome at the Union of Brest in the 1500’s, and the Church of Antioch, who reentered union with Rome in the 1700’s (creating the Melkite Catholic Church). Both of these reunions with Rome of major Churches were followed by subsequent internal schisms and the establishment of parallel Orthodox Churches. (of course, all of Eastern Orthodoxy reentered union with Rome at the Council of Florence as well).
 
Brandon_Cal said:
SAVINGGRACE

Thanks for the reply, I hadn’t noticed it since I was in the process of writing my second one when you posted.** Unfortunately the site you quoted doesn’t quite help since they never mention a particular** Orthodox church. They just keep saying “Orthodox Church” with no qualifiers.

I’m now going to assume that the Romanian Greek Catholic Church broke away from the Romanian Orthodox Church (which existed, but was not autocephalous) to join the Catholics, but I’d still like to know which greater Orthodox Patriarchate the Romanian Orthodox Church was subject to when this reunion happened.

I’d also like to have the same questions answered for all the other Byzantine Catholic churches and their Orthodox counterparts in the cases where the Eastern Catholic particular church reunited with Rome prior to its mother Orthodox church being granted autocephaly.

I hope I’m making sense. 😊
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That would be Russian Orthodox Church as Romania was usurped by USSR.
 
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