Let me clarify for everyone. One can not receive in the hand at the TLM. Reception in the hand is not part of Traditional Catholic spirituality. Yet it is frequently a topic discussed here in the forum of Traditional spiritiuality.
Thus, when one questions why non-traditionalists post here, I like to look at the rules and scratch my head. This forum is defined by the topic, not the posters.Consecrated ‘Crumbs’ most certainly are the Body and Blood , Soul and Divinity of the Master - hence the Paten and the Pall - please check you facts on your comment and correct as needed. Aquinas is an excellent reference on this question. Further, Cyril is not the Magesterium… the previous writer has quoted the Highest Authority that we should receive " Food Indeed " on our tongues, kneeling, as being fed like children at the hands of ‘Persona Christi’: Communion on the tongue kneeling has been the tradition of the Roman church for centuries - and was never changed; but when the abuse crept in post Vatican 2 i.e. communion in the hand in Eurpoe first i recall, Rome Paulus VI] allowed it as an option for bishops conferences to approve. He left this reverential decision to the same folks who have given us bankruptcy, closed schools and churches homosexual assaults on our children and more recently Notre Dame!
Tradition vs. Novus Ordo and tradition itself/apologetics/ Magesterium …
If that’s true than isn’t celebrating the Extraordinary Form also still an indult? Benedict XVI never said Quattuor Abhinc Annos (the indult for the Tridentine Mass) was revoked or superseded when he promulgated Summorum Pontificum.
Yes, that’s why I specified para 160. I was not referring to 161. The U.S. Bishops did not ask for any adaptations for para 161.
Hi- I wonder if Pilate knew what you say prior to his washing his hands.- was his sin on his hands or in his heart- why did he go thru the motions? There is more to the washing of the hands during the TLM offertory prior to the Canon according to Fortesque THE ROMAN LITURGY], not the least being that in the primitive church among the offerings brought up and received touched] were fish and produce ; hence a need to wash hands Ah! the good old days!!! - but the symbolism of reciting psalm xxv 6-12 can’t be lost on you- in fact , in the TLM the priest spends a majortiy of his prayer time pleading with God to cleanse his heart and mind to somehow make him worthy a priest to offer this Magnificent oblation.
Summorum Pontificum, article 1: “It is, therefore, permissible to celebrate the Sacrifice of the Mass following the typical edition of the Roman Missal promulgated by Bl. John XXIII in 1962 and never abrogated, as an extraordinary form of the Liturgy of the Church. The conditions for the use of this Missal as laid down by earlier documents Quattuor abhinc annos and Ecclesia Dei, are substituted as follows.”
You cannot interpret GIRM 160 outside of GIRM 161, whether in the English or Latin.
Very well written observations and strikingly thought provoking for me- thank you sincerely -
Unless I’m missing something, it sounds like you’re challenging my post, which was merely an agreement with the previous post by Sir Alec. If that’s the case, you’re preaching to the choir. In that is not the case, I’m at a total loss.
If the issue is a lack of exposure and education, I can see speaking out* for* the advantages you see in communion on the tongue. However, I do not understand arguing against what other people prefer. I guess in light of how some people are passionate about which Star Trek is the best, this should not be surprising.
This has got to be the single best example of begging the question I have seen since “What would Jesus do?”
If personal preference becomes our rule then each parish will soon have their own version of the Mass.
But where the Church allows such preference, then personal preference is acceptable. Circular, to be sure.
You show great wisdom and insight.The Star Trek example is nonsense. Anyone with even a basic appreciation of science fiction or literary critique knows TNG was the best.
Well, that is where I do not agree. “Proper” implies a right or wrong of the matter. As other rites do not follow the Latin rite in this, I can not see this as an issue of proper or improper. In any case, the Church would make such a distinction. Since an indult is allowed, I can not believe propriety to be an issue. If something like this is not disciplinary, nothing is.
The bolded statement above is an outright falsehood. I replied to a similar statement of yours in another thread in which you claimed that the majority of Catholics did not believe in the Real Presence. In that reply, I posted a link to a CARA poll taken in 2008 that refuted this claim. My post was shot down by another poster who said that the poll was basically meaningless since most Catholics did not attend Mass on a regular basis. I did agree that the poll was taking into account mainly those Catholics who do attend Mass at least once in awhile and that the beliefs of those Catholics who are regular Sundays attendees does not reflect on all other Catholics.
cara.georgetown.edu/sacraments.html
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