One God?

[cbeemer]

I was teaching a confirmation class tonight when a statement was made that we as Chistians worship the same God as other non-Christian based religions such as Muslim, Budism, Hinduism, ect. Instintually, I know this to be false, but had a difficult time explaining my position. Does any on line have any thoughts and/or recommendations?

 

[atsheeran]

It would not be correct to say that we worship the same God as Buddhists or Hindus because these are not monotheistic religions.

We do, however, worship the same God as Muslims. This is evidenced by Nostra Aetate from the Second Vatican Council:

1. The Church regards with esteem also the Moslems. They adore the one God, living and subsisting in Himself; merciful and all- powerful, the Creator of heaven and earth,(5) who has spoken to men; they take pains to submit wholeheartedly to even His inscrutable decrees, just as Abraham, with whom the faith of Islam takes pleasure in linking itself, submitted to God.

It is further evidenced from the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

841 The Church’s relationship with the Muslims. “The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.”

However, Islam has a limited understanding of the nature of God. Christianity’s understanding of God is far more complete.

 

[CreosMary]

Yes, this has always confused me also. How can a Muslim be worshipping the same God if they do not accept the Divinity of the second person of the Trinity aka Jesus Christ. The same for the Jews, they do not recognise a Trinity at all so who are they worshipping?
As for Buddhists and Hindu’s, the former have really no concept of a personal God, the latter have thousands of ‘gods’
I can accept that Buddhists and Hindus do not worship the same God but what about Muslims and Jews?
Can anyone help?..

 

[Scott_Waddell]

In Islam you can make a case. Buddhism and Hindu? No freakin’ way. There is no god in buddhist philosophy and there are 6.023x10 to the 23rd power gods in Hindu.

Scott

 

[jeffreedy789]

for an interesting discussion of the issue, i recommend reading ‘a new kind of christian’ by brian maclaren.

he’s an evangelical christian, but you’d never know it from his writings. he’s VERY ecumenical, and … well, you just have to read him to understand.

one of the things he says is that we should not assume that when we talk to someone about God, or about Jesus, that we are introducing them to Him for the first time - that God is active in most, if not ALL, people’s lives - beginning the redemption process LONG before we come along.

to presume otherwise is offensive, confusing, and usually wrong.

 

[antiaphrodite]

er, Muslims believe in one God. no trinity. (Jesus is not a god in islam.) buddhists don’t believe in a god per se. there’s just a great essence out there and enlightenment when a spirit reaches the void. hindus have three distinct gods (that i know of).

the Christian God is waaaaaay diffrent from the gods in other religions, monotheistic or otherwise. three persons, one God.

now this is just my abridged understanding. it may not even be entirely correct, and i apologize in advance. i’m sure others out there can provide more accurate answers!

 

[atsheeran]

CreosMary:

Yes, this has always confused me also. How can a Muslim be worshipping the same God if they do not accept the Divinity of the second person of the Trinity aka Jesus Christ. The same for the Jews, they do not recognise a Trinity at all so who are they worshipping?
As for Buddhists and Hindu’s, the former have really no concept of a personal God, the latter have thousands of ‘gods’
I can accept that Buddhists and Hindus do not worship the same God but what about Muslims and Jews?
Can anyone help?..

As for Jews, we can know that they worship the same God as Christians. God revealed Himself to the Jews and made them His people. This fact is part of the Catholic Faith. Read Lumen Gentium from Vatican II if you have any doubt about it. It is true that Jews do not believe in the Trinity but you must remember that God did not reveal Himself fully to the Jews. God did not reveal Himself as Trinity. This revelation came with Christ. So Jews have the same understanding of God that they have always had. They did not pick up a new god somewhere along the way.

 

[CreosMary]

Thank you ATSHEERAN,
But as the Jews did not accept the Christ who has always been God (Creator and Redeemer) where do they stand?
Our Lord says, “No one comes to the father except by me” so…?

 

[atsheeran]

antiaphrodite:

er, Muslims believe in one God. no trinity. (Jesus is not a god in islam.)

Very true. But as I have demonstrated the Church does teach that Muslims worship the same God as us. “[T]ogether with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day”

 

[jeffreedy789]

the catholic view of that verse (no man comes to the Father but by Me) is that Christ redeemed the world - therefore we can come to God through Christ.

how much we have to know about that redemption in order to receive it is debatable - as is shown by the parts of the catechism quoted above.

romans makes it clear that all of us humans have something inside of us that lets us know that God is there. that’s God God. not some god.

so God is at work in people’s lives, even those who aren’t fortunate enough to find themselves in the catholic church.

 

[rwoehmke]

The God of Islam, Judiaism, and Christianity is the God of Abraham. Christians believe and understand this God as having three persons in the one God. Jews and Muslims do not have this understanding but that hardly negates their belief in the same God we as Christians worship. The coming of Jesus did not change God except that now He had taken on human flesh and brought to us a deeper understanding of the God of Abraham. Hindus and Buddhists do not believe in the God of Abraham.

 

[rwoehmke]

CreosMary:

Thank you ATSHEERAN,
But as the Jews did not accept the Christ who has always been God (Creator and Redeemer) where do they stand?
Our Lord says, “No one comes to the father except by me” so…?

Jesus came to redeem all mankind. Only the Evangelical Christians and their congeners believe that one must have an explicit belief in Jesus Christ to be saved. To be redeemed through Jesus’s redemptive work whose merits flow through the Church does not require, according to the CCC and documents of Vatican II, this explicit belief. This does not negate the fact that all those who gain salvation are saved through Jesus Christ and His Church. This was emphasized by a document that issued from the Vatican in the past three years or so with the Latin name for Jesus in the title.

 

[StratusRose]

jeffreedy789:

for an interesting discussion of the issue, i recommend reading ‘a new kind of christian’ by brian maclaren.

A couple of friends of mine go to his church, and one of them is friends with his son. His church is about 20 minutes from my house. I’ve heard good things about him. He sure would make a great Catholic!

 

[Ahimsa]

Just a small correction:

Hindus actually do believe in “one God”. It’s just that they also believe that that one God can manifest in many different ways. So a Hindu would have no trouble accepting the idea that God manifested Himself to Abraham, but that wouldn’t mean that that Hindu would feel the obligation to follow the path Abraham followed.

 

[Ignatius]

cbeemer:

I was teaching a confirmation class tonight when a statement was made that we as Chistians worship the same God as other non-Christian based religions such as Muslim, Budism, Hinduism, ect. Instintually, I know this to be false, but had a difficult time explaining my position. Does any on line have any thoughts and/or recommendations?

Yes, we worship the God if Israel; the Almighty Creator of all things. This is not so of the others.

 

[turboEDvo]

Scott Waddell:

There is no god in buddhist philosophy and there are 6.023x10 to the 23rd power gods in Hindu.

Wow, that a “mol” lotta gods, hehe. Yep, Islam does worship the same God, with a limited understanding. I think it is kinda like knowing somebody, but, someone else knows them a lot better. Lovely, now that I have made my analogy for today…

Eamon

 

[Exporter]

SCOTT WADDEL,

Ha, Ha. You just said that the Hindus have ONE MOLE of Gods.

In one mole of any element or compound there are 6.02 times 10 to the 23rd particles, atoms, ions or molecules.

Are you a chemist?

 

[tradcatmel]

I see that quote of vatican II that we worship the same God as moslems an absolute heresy.

I know for certain that my God and Allah are two different entities.

I do not support modernism or liberalism - I’m what you say a traditionalist…

These new teachings of Vatican II is a personal teaching, in which the Pope has no right to teach, he must in his office confirm the traditions and the teachings of the church throughout the ages, he must not introduce new teachings and beliefs - as he has shown heresy many times.

I believe that the Pope is the Pope, I pray for him, but as far as his opinions about whether we worship the same God as the moslems and putting idols in front of the tabernacle and kissing the Koran - shows me that he is denying the divinity of Christ and has no respect for the Blessed Sacrament, that is what I cannot swallow and will not agree with his personal teachings.

 

[atsheeran]

tradcatmel:

I see that quote of vatican II that we worship the same God as moslems an absolute heresy.

I know for certain that my God and Allah are two different entities.

I do not support modernism or liberalism - I’m what you say a traditionalist…

These new teachings of Vatican II is a personal teaching, in which the Pope has no right to teach, he must in his office confirm the traditions and the teachings of the church throughout the ages, he must not introduce new teachings and beliefs - as he has shown heresy many times.

I believe that the Pope is the Pope, I pray for him, but as far as his opinions about whether we worship the same God as the moslems and putting idols in front of the tabernacle and kissing the Koran - shows me that he is denying the divinity of Christ and has no respect for the Blessed Sacrament, that is what I cannot swallow and will not agree with his personal teachings.

We are talking about a statement from an ecumenical council here. This is not a “personal teaching.” A council is by definition not “personal”! If you are honestly saying that an ecumenical council has taught heresy, then the gates of hell have prevailed against the Church and we may as all give up. Do you believe that to be the case?

Exactly how is it heresy to say that Muslims worship the same God as Catholics? The Church doesn’t say that Muslims worship God correctly. The Church doesn’t say that Muslims have a complete understanding of God. Muslims might believe some things about God that are downright false. That doesn’t mean that they have a different God! Muslims believe roughly the same things about the nature of God that Jews believe. Do you believe that Jews worship a different God as well?

 

[Sean_O_L]

I posted the following to Fr. Joe Horn, O.Praem’s 100% Catholic Forum back on Sept. 13, 2004. Unfortunately his site experienced a crash and it is not at the same URL. However he it from a hard copy:

ALLAH = GOD

Is Allah the one true God, or a false god? The jury is still out on that one.

I have just been looking at the Al-Bushra website.
al-bushra.org/
On this page it states:
Al-Bushra stands pro-Truth, pro-Justice and pro-Peace & prays God, Allah, HsShem, Adonai, the Most Holy for Mankind."

At al-bushra.org/bushra/albushra.htm
Al-Bushra is described as an Arab American Roman Catholic Community created by Rev. Labib from the Latin Patriarch of Jerusalem (The Roman Catholic Archdiocese of Jerusalem.)

On this web-page it says: “As we believe in ONE GOD, that GOD, ALLAH, ADONAI, HaShem, the MOst Holy is One for all of us.”

On one of the on-line files - “The Christian Arab Heritage”, by Dr. Fr. Labib Kobti, al-bushra/arbhrtg/arbxtn04.htm is the following:

“Recently Father Pecerillo, a famous Franciscam Archiologist, found more than twenty churches in Madaba at the south of Jordan. From the Forth Century we found houses in Syria, Lebanon, Iraq and Palestine with the inscription in Arabic: ‘Bism El-Lah al Rahman al Rahim’ that showed that Christians were the first to use this name so as to indicate their belief in the Holy Trinity, more than two hundred years before Islam.”

It seems to me that the inscription is the same as “In the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.” Also, it seems that “El-Lah” is very close to “Allah.”

In another source, “The First Christians” by Audrey Shabbas at mepc.org/public_asp/workshops/firstchris.asp - I think this is a Protestant site - it is stated that:

“Arab Christians pray to Allah. ‘Allah’ is the Arabic word for one God. If your language is Arabic, this is the word you use in worshipping the one God. Jesus, who spoke Aramaic, used the word ‘Allaha,’ and the word in Hebrew is ‘Ailohim’ – all three words derive from the same root.”

Hope this helps,
Sean O L

In another file, Fr. Brian Harrison, O.S. (who is no modernist) has
at catholic.com/thisrock/2003/0301fea4.asp

Muslims Worship the One True God
Only Their ‘Receiving Apparatus’ Is Defective

.