One God?

GaryZak · Mar 23, 2005

JN 4:24 God is Spirit, and those who worship him must worship in Spirit and truth."

What ONE must remember to the ASIAN religions and such, is that all OUR of ,”ANGELS and SAINTS, and the Company of Heaven,” seems like a bunch of ,”Gods,” to them… Yet their EXISTS but ONE TRUE and GOOD/HOLY SPIRIT…

God is Separate from what is EVIL.

MT 12:31 Therefore, I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.

MT 12:32 And whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven; but whoever speaks against the holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

LK 12:10 "Everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but the one who blasphemes against the holy Spirit will not be forgiven.

JN 3:6 What is born of flesh is flesh and what is born of spirit is spirit.

FightingFat · Mar 23, 2005

Hindus see God as more of a physical force (like nature) than an old man with a beard.
Likewise, Buddhists express divinity in their own fashion.
I think it is important to respect that others may have their own experience of the divine. Just because it’s different, doesn’t mean it is not valid.

Yusef Islam (Cat Stevens) was a Christian who converted to Islam. He found that Islam took what he already believed and someow went further with his beliefs, converting what he saw as lip service to a practical application of faith.

I think it’s wrong to belittle other peoples beliefs or condemn them as ‘wrong’. I think that they are all expressions of faith- people expressing their love of God in ways influenced by demography and other cultural factors.

We are one human family and God loves us all.

John_17_3 · Mar 26, 2005

Christians believe in the One True God of the Bible, the other religions mentioned do not!

Islam teaches that Allah has no son and that Jesus was just a prophet.
:yup:

mlchance · Mar 27, 2005

tradcatmel:

I see that quote of vatican II that we worship the same God as moslems an absolute heresy.

An ecumenical council cannot teach heresy. The Holy Spirit won’t permit it. Therefore, what you see isn’t what’s really there to see. Docility to Church teaching combined with prayer are the cures for such spiritual vision problems.

Yes, the Jews and Muslims worship the same God as Christians, but not completely. The Jews are closer since they first received revelation from God in both the OT and the NT. That some religious Jews rejected Christ doesn’t change the fact that God revealed himself to them.

Islam is a step more removed in that Muslims have received no direct revelation, but instead have adapted revelation received by others. They too worship the God of Abraham, but in an even more incomplete way.

By analogy, consider this:

There was a time when I was not married and did not have children. I had friends back then that I haven’t been in contact with since getting married and having children. Those friends know me, but their knowledge of me is incomplete.

In a similar way, the Jews know God, but they don’t know all of God since they’re missing out on the most recent developments in God’s revelation.

There might also be people who have only heard about me from those friends of mine mentioned above. They know me in a way, since they know my name, they’ve heard stories about me, et cetera, but their picture is even more incomplete.

In a similar way, the Muslims know God.

– Mark L. Chance.

John_17_3 · Apr 13, 2005

mlchance:

An ecumenical council cannot teach heresy. The Holy Spirit won’t permit it. Therefore, what you see isn’t what’s really there to see. Docility to Church teaching combined with prayer are the cures for such spiritual vision problems.

Yes, the Jews and Muslims worship the same God as Christians, but not completely. The Jews are closer since they first received revelation from God in both the OT and the NT. That some religious Jews rejected Christ doesn’t change the fact that God revealed himself to them.

Islam is a step more removed in that Muslims have received no direct revelation, but instead have adapted revelation received by others. They too worship the God of Abraham, but in an even more incomplete way.

By analogy, consider this:

There was a time when I was not married and did not have children. I had friends back then that I haven’t been in contact with since getting married and having children. Those friends know me, but their knowledge of me is incomplete.

In a similar way, the Jews know God, but they don’t know all of God since they’re missing out on the most recent developments in God’s revelation.

There might also be people who have only heard about me from those friends of mine mentioned above. They know me in a way, since they know my name, they’ve heard stories about me, et cetera, but their picture is even more incomplete.

In a similar way, the Muslims know God.

– Mark L. Chance.

Actually Muslims DO NOT worship the same God as Christians. Muslins deny that God is a Trinity and that Jesus is the Son of God! :nope:

Milliardo · Apr 13, 2005

John 17 3:

Actually Muslims DO NOT worship the same God as Christians. Muslins deny that God is a Trinity and that Jesus is the Son of God! :nope:

As People of the Book, Muslims do worship the same God as Jews and Christians do; what we differ in is how we view God. By your notion, Jews do not worship the same God as we do, since they deny the Trinity as well and don’t view Jesus the way we do–and yet our heritage comes from the Jews.

Milliardo · Apr 13, 2005

John 17 3:

Islam teaches that Allah has no son and that Jesus was just a prophet.
:yup:

Actually it’s a little more improvement over Jewish view of Jesus as nothing more than a sham. At least Muslims regard Him highly.

vern_humphrey · Apr 13, 2005

John 17 3:

Actually Muslims DO NOT worship the same God as Christians. Muslins deny that God is a Trinity and that Jesus is the Son of God! :nope:

The Catholic Church accepts that Muslims worship the same God we worship. From the Catechism:

**841 **The Church’s relationship with the Muslims. “The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.”

Now you say, “Muslims deny that God is a Trinity and that Jesus is the Son of God!”

Jews also deny that God is a Trinity and that Jesus is the Son of God.

Do the Jews worship the same God we worship?

John_17_3 · Apr 13, 2005

Milliardo said:
As People of the Book, Muslims do worship the same God as Jews and Christians do; what we differ in is how we view God. By your notion, Jews do not worship the same God as we do, since they deny the Trinity as well and don’t view Jesus the way we do–and yet our heritage comes from the Jews.

Which Book?

Milliardo · Apr 13, 2005

John 17 3:

Which Book?

The 3 great religions have one in common, and that is the Torah for the Jews and the Pentateuch for us Christians. These are the first 5 books of the Old Testament. All 3 regard these books very highly. Issah (Jesus for us Christians) is as well highly revered for Muslims. They also believe He will come again to avenge those of the true faith (Muslims have little grasp about Jesus’ role of Messiah though).

Milliardo · Apr 13, 2005

cbeemer:

I was teaching a confirmation class tonight when a statement was made that we as Chistians worship the same God as other non-Christian based religions such as Muslim, Budism, Hinduism, ect. Instintually, I know this to be false, but had a difficult time explaining my position. Does any on line have any thoughts and/or recommendations?

The only one I am aware of is that Christians, Muslims and Jews worship the same God. It would be a stretch to say that Buddhism and Hinduism, as well as others, worship the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

atsheeran · Apr 13, 2005

John 17 3:

Actually Muslims DO NOT worship the same God as Christians. Muslins deny that God is a Trinity and that Jesus is the Son of God! :nope:

Just because Muslims do not understand God correctly does not mean that they do not worship the same God.

Other analogies have been given in this thread but here is another one. I don’t know what color President Bush’s eyes are but for the sake of this example let’s say they’re brown. If someone says George Bush has blue eyes and red hair and he’s the President of the United States, would you automatically assume that they’re referring to a different George Bush, just because they don’t describe him accurately? Not likely. You would simply correct that person: “No, Bush’s eyes are brown and his hair is not red.” I doubt that you’d say, “oh, you must be referring to a different person who falsely claims to be the President and calls himself George Bush.” The speaker probably isn’t referring to a different person, they just either saw a bad picture of the President or the President was inaccurately described to them. This is how it is with Muslims and God.

FightingFat · Apr 14, 2005

atsheeran:

Just because Muslims do not understand God correctly does not mean that they do not worship the same God.

:clapping:

puzzleannie · Apr 14, 2005

cbeemer:

I was teaching a confirmation class tonight when a statement was made that we as Chistians worship the same God as other non-Christian based religions such as Muslim, Budism, Hinduism, ect. Instintually, I know this to be false, but had a difficult time explaining my position. Does any on line have any thoughts and/or recommendations?

it is not a question of whether Christians worship the same God as non-Christians, but of whether non-Christians worship the One True God who revealed Himself first the the Hebrew people and then completely in the person of the Jesus Christ, second Person of the Blessed Trinity. Moslems and Jews worship this God, although they may disagree with the Christian acceptance of the fullness of this revelation contained in our new Testament. Other religions do not acknowledge One, True God, and in fact may deny the concept altogether.

Franze · May 2, 2005

Hard Thread, jews have the same God than christians, and they refuse Jesus, the same goes for muslims.
I am not fan of interreligous dialogue with muslims, but I know that they pray the same God, they´re heretics, not pagans like buddhism or hinduism, is different.

edwinG · May 2, 2005

cbeemer:

I was teaching a confirmation class tonight when a statement was made that we as Chistians worship the same God as other non-Christian based religions such as Muslim, Budism, Hinduism, ect. Instintually, I know this to be false, but had a difficult time explaining my position. Does any on line have any thoughts and/or recommendations?

Hi cbeemer,
John 8:37 " I know that you are Abraham’s descendants, but you seek to kill Me, because My word has no place in you.
8:38 " I speak what I have seen with My Father, and you do what you have seen with your father"
8:39 They answered and said to Him, Abraham is our father." Jesus said to them "If you were Abraham’s children, you would do the works of Abraham.
8:40 “But now you seek to kill Me, a Man who has told you the truth which I heard from God. Abraham did not do this.”
8:41 You do the deeds of your father. Then they said to Him, We were not born of fornication, we have one Father- God.
8:42 Jesus said to them, "If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and came from God, not have I come of Myself, but He sent Me.
8:43 Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word.
8:44 You are of your father, the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it.

8:47 He who is of God hears God’s words. therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.

Well that is very plain. To think one who is born to a physical location or of any earthly devision is a worshipper of God is thinking in the flesh. A jew is not a jew by the flesh but of the spirit.
All who dont believe in Jesus have satan as their father. They worship satan even if they think they worship God.
You are of God if you believe Jesus’s words.
Only Christians worship God.
Every one else worships satan. They have been deceived. There is only God or satan.
Your council and pope are seriously wrong.
However, all are born to sin and we were too. It is just that we have been redeemed early. Eventually ALL will not only believe in Christ, but bow their knee. Then our judgment will be on works. And these works are those that are done by following the Holy Spirit.
We are told to love **everyone. **This does not include loving or kissing evil teachings (the Koran) which lead people away from Jesus. Love the people hate the sin.
walk in love
edwinG

Philthy · May 2, 2005

Scott Waddell:

In Islam you can make a case. Buddhism and Hindu? No freakin’ way. There is no god in buddhist philosophy and there are 6.023x10 to the 23rd power gods in Hindu.

Scott

Is Avagadro one of those Gods ?

Phil

Gottle_of_Geer · May 2, 2005

cbeemer:

I was teaching a confirmation class tonight when a statement was made that we as Chistians worship the same God as other non-Christian based religions such as Muslim, Budism, Hinduism, ect. Instintually, I know this to be false, but had a difficult time explaining my position. Does any on line have any thoughts and/or recommendations?

God is One and the same for all who worship Him, even though they do not know Whom they worship; even if they give different accounts of Him. For those accounts, do not affect God.

The gods of polytheistic religions may be:

Manifestations of the One God
Angels (to use the Christian term), mistaken for independent Divine beings
evil demons
A mixture of the above

Our knowledge of God, is far less important than that He knows us - Christ does have “other sheep, who are not of this fold”, after all.

FWIW, Egyptian religion had a monotheistic side - the religion of Israel had to compete with many local Baals. So even the religion of the OT has developed. ##

Gottle_of_Geer · May 2, 2005

jeffreedy789:

for an interesting discussion of the issue, i recommend reading ‘a new kind of christian’ by brian maclaren.

he’s an evangelical christian, but you’d never know it from his writings. he’s VERY ecumenical, and … well, you just have to read him to understand.

one of the things he says is that we should not assume that when we talk to someone about God, or about Jesus, that we are introducing them to Him for the first time - that God is active in most, if not ALL, people’s lives - beginning the redemption process LONG before we come along.

to presume otherwise is offensive, confusing, and usually wrong.

One God?

GaryZak

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FightingFat

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John_17_3

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mlchance

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Milliardo

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vern_humphrey

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John_17_3

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atsheeran

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God is One and the same for all who worship Him, even though they do not know Whom they worship; even if they give different accounts of Him. For those accounts, do not affect God.​

Gottle_of_Geer

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Well said ​

God is One and the same for all who worship Him, even though they do not know Whom they worship; even if they give different accounts of Him. For those accounts, do not affect God.

Well said