Online survey reveals "favorite" liturgical music

  • Thread starter Thread starter frommi
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Dr. Bombay:
I thought we determined on this forum several months ago that “dreck” means dirt or mud in German. Not the “s” word.

Or did I sleep thru that discussion too? :yawn:
Click to expand...
Ah, yes, I think there was some discussion on that. But in Yiddish it means the ‘sh’ word. 😉
 
In Old English, Middle English, and Shakespearian English the word is “drecht” and it has the connotation of offal, putrid stinky stuff. I learned this word from my 12th grade high school English teacher. Chaucer used it. Shakespeare used it. Neither Chaucer or Shakespeare were Yiddish nor am I aware of any connection of theirs to medieval Yiddish culture.

And I most certainly do know drecht when I hear it, or God forbid, have to sing it.
 
40.png
spiritblows:
Ah, yes, I think there was some discussion on that. But in Yiddish it means the ‘sh’ word. 😉
Click to expand...
Yes, I seem to remember you bringing that up.

And since we’re walking down memory lane, would you like me to tell you what 10% of 1.2 billion is?

I’ll go with brotherhrolf. “Putrid” and “stinky” adequately describe much modern Catholic liturgical music.
 
40.png
spiritblows:
Dear Confiter,
I’m sure that some authors of songs of yesteryear also were gay, I bet my bottom dollar. Some of them might have been child abusers, alcoholics, womanizers. Mozart was a known hedonist, yet his Requim Mass is famous. Michealangelo was also a known practising homosexual.

In short, I judge the song or artwork on it’s own merits, period.
Click to expand...
As far as the merits, I don’t think Dan Schutte is in the same league as Mozart and Michelangelo…but suit yourself. In Thomas Day’s book, Why Catholics Can’t Sing --he points out the similarity between its tune and the Brady Bunch theme (which is pretty catchy). Personally, I’m a little troubled that our embrace of his music finances his lifestyle which conflicts with Church teaching:

cruxnews.com/ftm/ftm-24sept04.html
 
According to this article, the Yiddish version of ‘Dreck’ is indeed a deplorable vulgarity. But it states that now Dreck has assimilated into the English lanuage and is acceptable. 👍

Dreck gets Respect
 
40.png
SMHW:
Actually Matthew 13:43 says exactly that about the righteous.

The verses of “On Eagles Wings” are from Psalm 91. The refrain kind of picks and choses from various Bible verses including that line from Matthew. The part about the Eagles comes from Ezekial, I think. But I don’t know the verse offhand. I think it’s something about parent eagles catching the offspring when teaching them to fly.
Click to expand...
Actually the line about eagles catching the young eaglets is from Deuteronomy 32:11. “On Eagle’s Wings” is probably thinking of Isaiah 40:31 which speaks of those that hope in the Lord soaring on wings like eagles or of Exodus 19:4 where God bore the Israelites up on the wings of eagles.

I’m not sure where the breath of dawn phrase comes from but I do know that Isaiah 49:16 says that God writes Zion’s name on the palm of His hand.
 
40.png
Confiteor:
As far as the merits, I don’t think Dan Schutte is in the same league as Mozart and Michelangelo…but suit yourself. In Thomas Day’s book, Why Catholics Can’t Sing --he points out the similarity between its tune and the Brady Bunch theme (which is pretty catchy).
Click to expand...
I love Mr. Day’s book. I especially love his dissertation on the problems with “Be Not Afraid.” The last time my choir sang that one was the Sunday right after Pope John Paul II died, and then it was only because “be not afraid” was one of His Holiness’s mottos… and our pastor asked us to honor the late Pope with that song.

You can see from that little tale that I agree with Mr. Day’s conclusions about that particular song.

I disagree, however, with the comparison between “Here I am, Lord,” and the Brady Bunch theme… somehow I’m not hearing the similarity.
 
40.png
MusicMan:
I disagree, however, with the comparison between “Here I am, Lord,” and the Brady Bunch theme… somehow I’m not hearing the similarity.
Click to expand...
It works with the chorus only for “Here I am, Lord.”

*Here’s the stor-y
Of a man named Bra-dy
Who was bu-sy with three boys of his o-ooooo-oown.
They were four men,
living all together,
Yet they were all-llll a-lone.

Ok, maybe it is a stretch. But “Here I am, Lord” does reek of 70s kitsch, no?
*
 
If we’re going down that road, the words to Amazing Grace are a perfict fit for the theme from Gilligan’s Island.
 
40.png
Lapsed:
If we’re going down that road, the words to Amazing Grace are a perfict fit for the theme from Gilligan’s Island.
Click to expand...
Can we wedge “Gather Us In” into the Love Boat theme?
 
Dr. Bombay:
It works with the chorus only for “Here I am, Lord.”

*Here’s the stor-y
Of a man named Bra-dy
Who was bu-sy with three boys of his o-ooooo-oown.
They were four men,
living all together,
Yet they were all-llll a-lone.

Ok, maybe it is a stretch. But “Here I am, Lord” does reek of 70s kitsch, no?
*
Click to expand...
I think the problem I’m having is that sung to the chorus of “Here I am Lord” we’ve reduced the Brady Bunch theme to a half-time ballad. 70’s kitch? No, it sounds more like a “pop ballad” arrangement that the guy who arranges the halftime shows for the University of Wisconsin Marching Band would write as a finale. That’s more of a Broadway kitch.

I think I’ve just talked myself out of EVER hearing “Here I am Lord” and keeping a straight face again.
 
40.png
MusicMan:
3.) Are we singing hymns that make us the “Voice of God”?
Click to expand...
Why. I can tell you why not, specifcally we would have to quite using the psalms that do this same thing. So again, why?
 
40.png
brotherhrolf:
In Old English, Middle English, and Shakespearian English the word is “drecht” and it has the connotation of offal, putrid stinky stuff. I learned this word from my 12th grade high school English teacher. Chaucer used it. Shakespeare used it. Neither Chaucer or Shakespeare were Yiddish nor am I aware of any connection of theirs to medieval Yiddish culture.

And I most certainly do know drecht when I hear it, or God forbid, have to sing it.
Click to expand...
Yup – it’s like saying “poop” rather than “sh**.” If Yiddish is like German, they also have a word that starts with sh.

Drecht singen – oy gevalt.
 
The main problem with liturgical music is the key the song is in. The song leader is a very gifted singer, but she doesn’t seem to realize that not everybody, especially men, does not have a very high-soprano voice like she does. Nothing sounds worse that a bunch of people trying to hit a high not, and not quite making it. At least give us guys a chance to sing.
 
40.png
davy39:
The main problem with liturgical music is the key the song is in. The song leader is a very gifted singer, but she doesn’t seem to realize that not everybody, especially men, does not have a very high-soprano voice like she does. Nothing sounds worse that a bunch of people trying to hit a high not, and not quite making it. At least give us guys a chance to sing.
Click to expand...
👍

As a baritone with a rather limitted range, I agree. Very rarely are hymns performed in a key I can comfortably sing in. I can stretch down to bass a whole lot easier than I can stretch up to tenor. I find that most of the time I skip the highest couple notes in a song. Most of the time if the key was taken down a fifth I would have no trouble with it.
 
As a baritone with a rather limitted range, I agree. Very rarely are hymns performed in a key I can comfortably sing in.
[/quote]

You guys would love the way I do music. I transpose over half the stuff I do down, sometimes as much as three steps. I find it is an effective way to encourage participation.

(a couple of women think I carry it too far sometimes, though)
 
I am a fan of choosing hymns that are singable by the Congregation. I am a fan of choosing appropriate transpositions if the key in the hymnal is not in a singable range.

You must be careful, however, that when transposing, you don’t just take the upper notes into account, but the low ones as well. If your congregation can’t hit the fourth space E, and you take it down so that E becomes a C, then you need to check the lower notes too. If the lowest note in the song is a B below middle C, this transposition now asks the singers to hit the G below middle C, which is out of the tessatura for a lot of sopranos and (transposed an octave) tenors.

Composers often write in certain keys for specific reasons. The key of D Major has been historically referred to as the “Sun Key” because it has such a warm and bright sound. If the hymn is composed in a key because they wish to use the specific qualities of that key, I would think twice about moving it. If a hymn is in Eb, I probably wouldn’t transpose it down to D. The same with a hymn in F. I wouldn’t lower it to E. E is another bright key, where F can be more mellow sounding. I would lower F to Eb, and go the full Major Second in transposing it.

This is all made easier, of course, by using an electronic organ that has a transposer on it. Or by obtaining an older copy of the Organ Accompaniement Book from Oregon Catholic Press. While some may find their contemporary hymns to be tasteless, their removal of older language (thee and thou) annoying, and their gender equity reworking absurd, at least the older OAB came with a lower key option for most hymns.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top