Order of Melchisedek

[maryj]

Okay, you avoided the issue. Here is the question again for reference. Do you know what the main purpose for the formal earthly priesthood was? Please tell! Once you know the purpose of the priesthood,

oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Priesthood

The quote is not from me it is from Non, the link posted is from me. Non please figure out the quoting system, so when a reply is given your quote is seperated from others. Thanks:thumbsup:

 

[NonCatholic]

I just went to a Bible study class today and the Pastor of our Church said that Melchisedek was the son of Noah, he was also known as Shem. He lived for almost 900 years and that is why they refer to that saying “you shall reign forever as in the line of Melchisedek”. To be a high priest you had to be in the priesthood for 50 years and if Melchisedek lived almost a whole millenium! Back then sickness was rare. Hope this helps.

**Did you actually ask him what is his biblical reference for that? I would have called him to show me. **

 

[NonCatholic]

oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Priesthood

The quote is not from me it is from Non, the link posted is from me. Non please figure out the quoting system, so when a reply is given your quote is seperated from others. Thanks:thumbsup:
**
I’m sorry Maryj’ I’m not perfect like you and made a mistake. Perhaps you would like to take a stab at the reason for the priesthood in your own understanding and in context to the previous post…thanks.**

 

[mercygate]

We’ll still be here when you figure it out.

**Okay, you avoided the issue. Here is the question again for reference. Do you know what the main purpose for the formal earthly priesthood was? Please tell! Once you know the purpose of the priesthood,**I did not avoid the issue. Christ’s priesthood is not an earthly priesthood. The priests at the altar are under His priesthood in ministerial service.

Are you looking for this from Heb 5:1 – that priests act on behalf of men in relation to God, to offer gifts and sacrifices for sins."?

 

[ryanoneil]

**
The only earthy priesthood is the “royal priesthood” of individuals believers. Christ completed what the earthly priesthood couldn’t. Do you know what the main purpose for the formal earthly priesthood was? Please tell! Once you know the purpose of the priesthood, then you can conclude that the formal priesthood of the Catholic church is invalid from a biblical basis.

We have only spoken of one of several comparison of the Levitical priesthood in contrast to the Melchizedek priesthood. I don’t plan on taking those issues further because if no one can see the most obvious one of death versus eternal, then there is no room for further study.**

The Mosaic sacrificial rites that involved the blood of animals changed to sacramental rites such as Baptism and the Eucharist, whose efficacy derives from the blood of Christ.

On the one hand, a former commandment is annulled because of its weakness and uselessness, for the law brought nothing to perfection; on the other hand, a better hope is introduced, through which we draw near to God. (Heb 7:18-19)

Therefore, let us leave behind the basic teaching about Christ and advance to maturity, without laying the foundation all over again: repentance from dead works and faith in God, instruction about baptisms and laying on of hands, resurrection of the dead and eternal judgment. And we shall do this, if only God permits. For it is impossible in the case of those who have once been enlightened and tasted the heavenly gift and shared in the holy Spirit and tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come (Heb 6:1-5)

 

[maryj]

The quote is not from me it is from Non, the link posted is from me. Non please figure out the quoting system, so when a reply is given your quote is seperated from others. Thanks:thumbsup:

I’m sorry Maryj’ I’m not perfect like you and made a mistake. Perhaps you would like to take a stab at the reason for the priesthood in your own understanding and in context to the previous post…thanks.

Your rude responses are uncalled for, and unchristian. I for one now shake the dust from my feet. Mary

 

[NonCatholic]

I’m sorry Maryj’ I’m not perfect like you and made a mistake. Perhaps you would like to take a stab at the reason for the priesthood in your own understanding and in context to the previous post…thanks.

Your rude responses are uncalled for, and unchristian. I for one now shake the dust from my feet. Mary

Excuse me; you are the one who said “Non please figure out the quoting system” ; don’t ya think that was a little condescending; it came across that way.

I apologize to you; I was doing a tid for tad and I shouldn’t have.

If you would like to, up to you of course, take a stab at the question?

 

[NonCatholic]

The Mosaic sacrificial rites that involved the blood of animals changed to sacramental rites such as Baptism and the Eucharist, whose efficacy derives from the blood of Christ.

This is true the Catholic system, but not in Scripture. The accurate scriptural context would be the sacrifices pointed to Christ and then Christ made the one and final, never to be repeated or simulated in a theatrical way. Christ declared “It is finished” What was finished?

On the one hand, a former commandment is annulled because of its weakness and uselessness, for the law brought nothing to perfection; on the other hand, a better hope is introduced, through which we draw near to God. (Heb 7:18-19)

Tell me your own words. What was the purpose of the earthly priesthood? How does that answer related to the Catholic priesthood?

Therefore, let us leave behind the basic teaching about Christ and advance to maturity, without laying the foundation all over again: repentance from dead works and faith in God, instruction about baptisms and laying on of hands, resurrection of the dead and eternal judgment. And we shall do this, if only God permits. For it is impossible in the case of those who have once been enlightened and tasted the heavenly gift and shared in the holy Spirit and tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come (Heb 6:1-5)

 

[NonCatholic]

Okay, you avoided the issue. Here is the question again for reference. Do you know what the main purpose for the formal earthly priesthood was? Please tell! Once you know the purpose of the priesthood,

I did not avoid the issue. Christ’s priesthood is not an earthly priesthood. The priests at the altar are under His priesthood in ministerial service.

Are you looking for this from Heb 5:1 – that priests act on behalf of men in relation to God, to offer gifts and sacrifices for sins."?

I’m asking you to answer a question(s) in your understanding.
What is the purpose of the earthly priesthood? Based on that answer; how does that answer relate, if it does, to the Catholic priesthood?

 

[mercygate]

]
I did not avoid the issue. Christ’s priesthood is not an earthly priesthood. The priests at the altar are under His priesthood in ministerial service.

Are you looking for this from Heb 5:1 – that priests act on behalf of men in relation to God, to offer gifts and sacrifices for sins."?

I’m asking you to answer a question(s) in your understanding.
What is the purpose of the earthly priesthood? Based on that answer; how does that answer relate, if it does, to the Catholic priesthood?
I have said more than once that we have no “earthly” priesthood.

Priests of the Catholic Church preside at the re-presentation of Christ’s eternal redemptive offering of Himself to the Father. In the Mass, we are present to Calvary in that offering but in an unbloody way.

 

[NonCatholic]

I’m asking you to answer a question(s) in your understanding.
What is the purpose of the earthly priesthood? Based on that answer; how does that answer relate, if it does, to the Catholic priesthood?

I have said more than once that we have no “earthly” priesthood.

Priests of the Catholic Church preside at the re-presentation of Christ’s eternal redemptive offering of Himself to the Father. In the Mass, we are present to Calvary in that offering but in an unbloody way.

**
I’m sorry; I did not get specific enough; in your understanding, what was the purpose for the earthly levitical priesthood? Based on that answer; how does it relate, if at all, to the Catholic priesthood? Sorry about the confusion.**

 

[mercygate]

I have said more than once that we have no “earthly” priesthood.

I’m sorry; I did not get specific enough; in your understanding, what was the purpose for the earthly levitical priesthood? Based on that answer; how does it relate, if at all, to the Catholic priesthood? Sorry about the confusion.

That is a very different question. The author of Hebrews stated the big picture – making offering for sins. Christians take this as a foreshadowing of the fulfillment by Christ, the eternal High Priest.

The levitical priesthood offered bloody animal sacrifices. Christ, “once for all” offers Himself and His blood at Calvary.

Thenceforth, Christ, Who is eternal, offers Himself eternally - without suffering and without blood - to the Father in love. The offering in time was at Calvary. The priestly people enter the eternal offering at Mass. The veil of time and space are rent; the ministerial priesthood presides with human hands in time and space but Christ Himself offers the Sacrifice of the Mass.

So to answer your question: the Priesthood of the Church is the fulfillment, in Christ, our Great High Priest, of what was shadowed by the levitical priesthood.

Even the layout of Catholic churches reflects this. Traditionally, the Tabernacle, where the consecrated Sacrament is kept, is in the position occupied by the Ark of the Covenant in the Temple. What’s in the Ark? The tablets of the Commandments, Aaron’s rod that budded, confirming his priesthood, and the last of the manna. What’s in the tabernacle: Jesus Christ: The living Word, the great High Priest, and the Bread of Life.

 

[NonCatholic]

That is a very different question. The author of Hebrews stated the big picture – making offering for sins. Christians take this as a foreshadowing of the fulfillment by Christ, the eternal High Priest.

The levitical priesthood offered bloody animal sacrifices. Christ, “once for all” offers Himself and His blood at Calvary.

Thenceforth, Christ, Who is eternal, offers Himself eternally - without suffering and without blood - to the Father in love. The offering in time was at Calvary. The priestly people enter the eternal offering at Mass. The veil of time and space are rent; the ministerial priesthood presides with human hands in time and space but Christ Himself offers the Sacrifice of the Mass.

So to answer your question: the Priesthood of the Church is the fulfillment, in Christ, our Great High Priest, of what was shadowed by the levitical priesthood.

Even the layout of Catholic churches reflects this. Traditionally, the Tabernacle, where the consecrated Sacrament is kept, is in the position occupied by the Ark of the Covenant in the Temple. What’s in the Ark? The tablets of the Commandments, Aaron’s rod that budded, confirming his priesthood, and the last of the manna. What’s in the tabernacle: Jesus Christ: The living Word, the great High Priest, and the Bread of Life.

NonCatholic:

Originally Posted by NonCatholic View Post

I’m sorry; I did not get specific enough; in your understanding, what was the purpose for the earthly levitical priesthood? Based on that answer; how does it relate, if at all, to the Catholic priesthood? Sorry about the confusion.

The levictical priesthood was designed to bride the gap between man and God; in other words the access to God was through the God chosen Levitical priesthood. The priests did this through the offering of sacrifices and gifts for sins, as you referred earlier to in Hebrews 5. The main point is they are the access point between Israel and God. Do you agree or disagree?

 

[mercygate]

The levictical priesthood was designed to bride the gap between man and God; in other words the access to God was through the God chosen Levitical priesthood. The priests did this through the offering of sacrifices and gifts for sins, as you referred earlier to in Hebrews 5. The main point is they are the access point between Israel and God. Do you agree or disagree?

Yes. As Christ is our “access point.” through His priesthood but “according to the order of Melchizedek” via the offering of Himself as the Bread of Life…

 

[NonCatholic]

Yes. As Christ is our “access point.” through His priesthood but “according to the order of Melchizedek” via the offering of Himself as the Bread of Life…

Are you suggesting we cannot access Christ without the priest? or are you suggesting we need the access for forgiveness or something else?

 

[NonCatholic]

oh contrare’ Jesus Christ is in the Holy of Holies offering eternally His sacrifice. Check out Revelation you might find it pertinent to this conversation.

So Jesus is a place now?

 

[NonCatholic]

Yes. As Christ is our “access point.” through His priesthood but “according to the order of Melchizedek” via the offering of Himself as the Bread of Life…

**I was going to ask another question, but you have answered; no point on going further. I will make a general statement. The point of the levitical or earthly priesthood was to give Israel, the nation, some access to God, with direct access coming from the “high priest” via the Holy of Holies. When Christ died with the perfect sacrafice; He rent the temple and exposed the Holie of Hollies, to demonstrate that all true believers have direct access to God through one mediator and one High Priest; therefore eliminating the entire formal priesthood and replaced by a “royal priesthood”.

I Peter 2:5 5 you also, as living stones**, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, **to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.
Romans 12:1 tells us what this “acceptable spiritual sacrifice is”.
“Therefore I urge you, brethren, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies a living and holy sacrifice, acceptable to God, {which is} your spiritual service of worship.”

Below appears to be the claim you made for the service of the Catholic priest, but God says this is for believers.

1 Peter 2:9 “But you are A CHOSEN RACE (the elect), A royal PRIESTHOOD (priesthood of believers), A HOLY NATION (the true unity, which is spiritual), A PEOPLE FOR {God’s} OWN POSSESSION, so that you may proclaim (the reason) the excellencies of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvelous light;”

I find it a bit ironic, but not surprising that God used Peter to explain this to us.**

 

[mercygate]

Are you suggesting we cannot access Christ without the priest? or are you suggesting we need the access for forgiveness or something else?

Yes. Christ gave us His Church. It is an organic physical thing as well as a mystical entity. We access Christ “directly” but significantly through His Body and His priesthood. Even to access Christ “directly” it takes the Church. You have to have an idea of who Christ is before you can figure out you need “access.” Whose job is that? The Church Commiccsioned to make disciples and teach . . .

 

[NonCatholic]

Yes. Christ gave us His Church. It is an organic physical thing as well as a mystical entity. We access Christ “directly” but significantly through His Body and His priesthood. Even to access Christ “directly” it takes the Church. You have to have an idea of who Christ is before you can figure out you need “access.” Whose job is that? The Church Commiccsioned to make disciples and teach . . .

**
I’m saddened you believe to have “significant” access you need a priest; this is not what God has taught. You are correct; you need to know Him. It only takes faith in Jesus to gain access. I am not being condescending; so please do not look at it his way, but rather sincere.Thanks for responding to my questions**

 

[mercygate]

**I’m saddened you believe to have “significant” access you need a priest; **I meant the word “significant” in the sense of “sign.” The priesthood is a sign of Christ’s priesthood. I did not mean to suggest that my relationship with Christ is not meaningful and that the *only *meaningful access is through a priest.

this is not what God has taught. You are correct; you need to know Him. It only takes faith in Jesus to gain access. I am not being condescending; so please do not look at it his way, but rather sincere.Thanks for responding to my questions

For Catholics, life in Christ is lived in His Church and on His terms. You asked about whether we need priests for access. There are different forms of access. So, yes: we DO “go to” Christ directly in personal prayer, in our intimate moments with Him. But Christ promised Peter the Keys of the Kingdom of Heaven. For us that refers in part to the binding and loosing of sin in confession (cf. the Epistile of James re: confessing to one another). Moreover, Catholic theology and spirituality are not exclusively individual. Faith must be personal but it is not essentially or exclusively individual. We are IN the Body.

As Christ had a physical body when he walked as a man among men, so has the Church today. The incarnational aspect of Christ’s Church includes the ministry of human priests, who serve to the royal priesthood of His “nation.” The ministerial priesthood in no way diminishes the royal priesthood of the Church. Like Christ, it serves.