"Organic development"

[malphono]

Robster7

Actually I don’t really disagree with your post, but at the same time I know what the objections are to keeping it in this thread. My suggestion? Give it a new name, and open a new thread. The topic is probably better suited to the Traditional Catholicism forum.

Anyway, it’s just a suggestion to help keep the peace, as it were.

 

[ASD]

ASD;4731222:

This is not very closely related to question about organic development, but quick observation…

My comments were related to the organic development issue.

Sure. My remarks about how I used to bring NO/OF attitudes to TLM/EF were a little off topic of organic development.

I am not an expert on liturgy, ok?

Yea. I’m not either.

I sometimes think that certain folks think that [the] way they have known things existed forever. So they start with the assumption that something is correct as is and spend a good deal of time justifying the status quo, rather than examining how it developed and why.

Perhaps. Defensiveness about liturgy or other traditional practices could arise for lots of reasons.

However, consider: Since the idea of “organic” development assumes that forms emerged “naturally” because they were suitable, I think there’s a presumption, as the lawyers say, that traditional practice is right or good. That is, I think the burden of proof will be on the people who think this or that change will bring improvement. And, given that many people are unhappy about changes in past generation or so, the burden of proof might be pretty high these days.

Text and rubrics, such as? Some examples, please.

So far we have the examples given as test cases here. I hope more are brought forward.

ASD​

Traditional Latin Mass: Translation and Grammar

 

[Robster7]

Regarding to the list mentioned here are a few comments.
Remember, I am not an expert on liturgy, but an ordinary Catholic. I offer my view from the pew. My personal “sense of the faithful.”

1. Procession of gifts. I see nothing wrong with it; seems to symbolize what the faithful offer to God at mass.
2. Dismissal of catechumens.Whatever it’s original intent, it does seem to symbolize that those planning on becoming Catholic
   should first learn about Liturgy of the Eucharist so they may more fully appreciate their full participation in it at the Easter Vigil
3. Altar facing the people. I see in the notes in my St. Andrew’s Daily Missal (Latin) the following on page 1687 for the Nov. 23. St. Clement, Pope and Martyr (pope AD 92-102). It however gives no date for the construction of Church of St. Clement in Rome.

“The title-church of St. Clement at Rome is of the greatest religious and archaeological interest; it shows perfectly the ancient arrangement of a Christian church: the atrium, the ambos, the chancel, the altar facing the people, the separate places for clergy, faithful, and catechumens.” At least, no one can claim it was an innovation from the 1960s.

 

[Spirithound]

A follow-up question, if y’all will

In these days of rubrical legislation which are not to be deviated from, is there any room for organic development in the Ordinary Form?

 

[malphono]

A follow-up question, if y’all will

In these days of rubrical legislation which are not to be deviated from, is there any room for organic development in the Ordinary Form?

It seems to me the answer is yes. One must keep in mind that “organic development” is not a euphemism for “improvisation” or “liturgical license” or anything of the sort.