Origins of our Bible

[joeNJ]

Hi, JoeNJ,

It really isn’t a question of meeting ‘my standard’ as it is coming to a realization that God has set out a particular course - and your questions like, “Why couldn’t the accounts of Jesus’ life…” fall short of the mark when it comes to being realistic. None of us set this course - God did. As I said earlier, either we trust Him or we don’t. And, it is not like, “Well, I’ll trust this far but no farther!” Christ told us that we either accpet the Kingdom of God as a little child (total faith) or we aren’t getting in! Notice there is no grey area here - it is either you believe or you don’t - and you decide.

So, if you think that more than Faith is needed for the formation of the Bible - what are these things. What are your standards that apparently the entire Catholic Church is not meeting (after all, is the Catholic Church that gave the world the Canon of Sacred Scripture. This is the group that declared that every book and every word in every book of the Bible is the Inspired and Inerrant Word of God - and yes, JoeNJ, that would also include the Book of Revelations).

The ‘game playing’ I asked about really involves this back and forth belief/non-belief issue you have been demonstrating. Chirst did more then give us some wonderful sentences. Christ gave us His Own Church - and He promised He would not abandon it (us) and that it would not teach error. These are more than words, JoeNJ - this is a very significant deed. Christ gives us His Flesh and Blood in Holy Communion - this is more than words - this is a very significant deed - and these two elements are totally bound with one another: Christ’s Church and Christ giving us His Flesh through His Chruch. But, it looks like you want to pick and choose… and notice, Matthew 16 does not have Christ offering a ‘Cafeteria Plan’ for those who just can’t make up their minds.

All of this apparent indecision appears to hinge on ‘men’ getting together in about the 4th Century as a Church Council to develop the Canon of Scripture. Yes, it would have been a lot simpler if the Holy Spirit on Pentecost Sunday had delivered a Book in addition to the Gifts He gave those assembeled. But, it did not happen that way - and this is where we need to have Faith and believe that God really is in charge. If you are going to believe, then believe. If you are going to not believe that find an organization that conformst to your standards - but, there is no middle ground here. Really.

God bless

It seems to all come down to if you believe every facet of the process was inspired by God or not. This is my belief only, that Jesus lived his life among men, touched the men he had chosen and left his deeds, stories and life as a gift to us. Then men came in and did what men do, attempt to understand it in our terms. Which is the only thing we can do. But I recognize that. But I realize the Church is attempting to carry on Gods word in the best way it knows how, and there is nothing wrong with that until they say they are doing things exactly like God wants us to do. Does God want us to eat no meat on Fridays? I think honoring Gods word in your actions and deeds are much more important.

And your last comment is what turns many people off from the Church. It’s our way or the highway. Faith can mean many things. It can mean believing everything you hear or it can be believing the example of God and Jesus.

 

[joeNJ]

That is what the Church did. Precisely.

Are you kidding? The Church took those accounts by the apostles, added a few other other books and letters, claimed all the authors were inspired. Formed an organized body, said the leader was infallible, charged itself with being the sole interpreter of it etc. etc. Not that all of this is bad, it had to get organized etc.

The Church still teaches that message.

That is what the Church did. And that message is what the Church teaches. Yet you seem to be bothered.

I keep restating why it bothers me, you seem to miss the point.

Correct.

I use the Catholic definition of Church. But I don’t know why that makes a difference here since we are talking about the Bible.

Well it makes a huge difference. If Jesus used the word Church, the apostles understood it to mean the group of believers. You used it to mean the men that organized the whole thing into a form that was not anything like Jesus had at the time.

What makes you think they didn’t?

2 Peter 3:16
As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

In here, St. Peter is talking about the Epistles of St. Paul. Note how he equates them with Scripture.

Sincerely,

De Maria

 

[PJM]

=Gaber;9360445]That is all well and good, but the kind of self verification you use as “proof” or “substantiation” is self referent at best. That is not to deny the good that can be derived from the book, if one is already “good” or has an emotional or thought conversion to the degree of accepting the collection on the terms of the “authorities” pointed to by In_servitude. I mean we had such arguments going at the time of biblical “verification” as “There are four elements and four directions, etc, so there need to be four Gospels.” Hardly “divine inspiration” or guidance by my reckoning.

And as i stated elsewhere before, any message from the “other side,” or spirit world or whatever, no matter how pure, is nevertheless delivered through the filter of the mind attempting to translate it into verbology. In that regard, were we all speakers of Sanskrit and the Bible written in that august tongue, and the original all spoken in it, we might have some degree of accuracy. But pertinent to that, English is a fundamentally dualistic language, and there were certain assumptions made in translation, at least in the versions that we read, regarding a number of words and ideas.

Also, there are ways of “knowing” the Bible that are self referent, and others that are more phenomenological. What about that book that approaches the ideas of religion from the standpoint of the discipline of General Semantics. Or the Bible might be viewed through the analytic tool of integrative philosophy. Or a number of other ways, bringing to bear disciplines that the ordinary believer not only doesn’t use, but likely hasn’t heard of. Structural differential, anyone? Four quadrants? (yes, I know, there’s that four again!) Linguistics? Translation itself? levels of implied meaning? Collections and how they happen? the nature of witnessing? Literary forms and strictures The nature and parameters of worldviews in the cultuers of origins? Attribution of authorship, eg Paul and Peter? OTHDTHTHBRWWSWRTTNWTHTCPSRPNCTTNFRPGSNDPGS?

But folks can go ahead and take it on faith if they wish. It is just that there is way more to it than meets the blind eye of simple faith. I’m reminded of the story on here of the woman who didn’t learn a foreign language when it would have served her well to do so because “God writ the Bible in English, so that’s good enough for me!”

And lastly,. it is silliness to imply that even if the Bible is not the inspired Word of God in the sens you likely mean it, it would be without great value. That’s just wrong. it might be pious, but it’s wrong.

Hi Gaper,

Thanks for sharing YOUR views.

My meaning for the “bible being worthless IF Nor Inspired by God” refers to attainment of ones salvation. Look how many don’t follow it now! And It IS Inspired,

What many to their Spiritural detrement don’t grasp; is there ARE NO individualistic understandings of “thee bible.” NONE permitted by God.

Rom.10: 17 “So faith comes from what is heard, and what is heard comes by the preaching of Christ”… John 12: 48 “Jesus answered, and said to him: If any one love me, he will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him, and will make our abode with him. He that loveth me not, keepeth not my words.” …2nd. Peter 1: 16-21 “You will do well to pay attention to this as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts. First of all you must understand this, that no prophecy of scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation, because no prophecy ever came by the impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.” 2nd. Peter 3: 16-17 “There are some things in them hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, beware lest you be carried away with the error of lawless men and lose your own stability”

There is, always has been and always shall be ONLY ONE valid, full, and truthfull explaination and that is With, In, and Through the CC Alone

Mark.8: 38 “For whoever is ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation, of him will the Son of man also be ashamed, when he comes in the glory of his Father with the holy angels."

Eph. 3: 9-10 “And to make all men see what is the plan of the mystery hidden for ages in God who created all things; that through the church [singular]*** the manifold wisdom of God might now be made known to the principalities and powers in the heavenly places. This was according to the eternal purpose which he has realized in Christ Jesus our Lord, *** Amen!

Even logic OUGHT to affirm this.

God Bless you.

pat/PJM

 

[PJM]

=tqualey;9346399]Hi, PJM,

Actually, it is beyond critical in the sense that without Faith, we are simply in meltdown.

While JoeNJ’s original posts made sense - his response were totally devoid of meaningful dialogue - just put-downs on those who tried to give him the information he was asking about. Then he moved into blanket criticism of the Catholic Church - and that struck me as soooooooo off topic thread, it just cried out for someone playing games.

While I do not know what the answer is… moving to “4 pitch” probably isn’t it…

I really do think this is a good thread because, as Catholics, we gave the Bible (Canon of Sacred Scriputre) to the world. One of the things I have found very interesting was that none of those in Revolt in the 16th Century succeeded in dropping any of the books of the NT - even though Luther tried pretty hard with James. Does anyone know why Luther failed here - but was able to get books removed from the OT?

God bless
God bless

Our Good Friend Jon would know for sure

IMO, its because Luther gets [seemingly anyway] All of the Credit and Blame; but he actually worked through a committee system; and he was voted down on James. Perhaps because so many read or at least are filmiliar with the NT; and far less so with the OT?

IMO is was a credibility issue

God Bless,
pat/PJM

 

[Gaber]

Hi Gaper,

Thanks for sharing YOUR views.

And you yours. I’m perforce well acquainted with them.

Even logic OUGHT to affirm this.

Well, yes, perhaps, if you accept the premise. but how and why did you do that?

God Bless you.

pat/PJM

Thanks. Being “blessed” is a constant condition of existence. Some think that it is an occasional extraordinary thing, or a happenstance. Grace, as such, has no element of duration or occasion.

 

[in_servitude]

You seem to have many of the same thoughts that I do. But you seem to gloss over that “Presto, me just marked it as inspired”. I agree with that, but so many people believe that to have so much more meaning. Surely you must see that.

I’m not certain, of course, but it seems that I might have been in the past where you are today.
Me in the past:
Jesus came to Earth. Did some incredible things, said some important things, and then left. Later, men bungled around trying to make sense of it all. Some men seized on the opportunity and put themselves at the top of some “king of the hill” kind of game. Men wrote stuff, etc. etc. etc.

Me today:
Jesus came to Earth. Did some incredible thins, said some important things, and then established his visible church.

The difference between my yesterday and today is prayer. (My own prayer, but mostly a nun on my wife’s side of the family, I think.) Faith is a grace given by God. We don’t earn it. We don’t obtain it. And we certainly don’t give it to ourselves if we wish.

Also, I am not convicting the Church for a few peoples mistakes, I was questioning the validity of divine guidance in everything the Church does. Using some examples to prove it. Our views really are not so far apart it would appear.

Well, the question I have to ask you is, “What does the Church teach in regards to faith and morals that you would consider corrupt?” The Church teaches that the Holy Spirit does not allow for a misstep in this area. Therefore, if you wish to cast doubt on the Church, you’d need to point to those teachings that are in error. I think the CCC is where all of that is contained, but I’m not sure about that.

 

[tqualey]

Hi, JoeNJ,

I re-read your ogirinal post and thought maybe another approach would be helpful. While you have received some excellent information specific to the origin of the Bible - as I appreciate your post, it dealt more with coping skills rather then needing specific information. With that in mind, let’s try two things:

1.) Go to the following links, select one and then copy and paste it to a Word document so you can print it.

papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13provi.htm

papalencyclicals.net/Pius12/P12DIVIN.HTM

2.) Organize your day so you can build the guidance of Christ’s Church into your life by establishing a daily order or daily routine similar to this:

• Wake up 30 minutes earlier then you usually do (so, adjust the time you go to bed). You need to have a good night’s sleep and a set routine for your daily activities to begin to get your coping skills functioning at their best.

– When you wake up fix your mind on Christ and some aspect of His Life. The Rosary can be very helpful in beginning your day. Here is a link you may find helpful: comepraytherosary.org/

• During the Rosary, it would be appropriate to begin some meditations on the Mysteries you are praying about. When you complete the Rosary spend a few minutes on seeing how much God loves you and that your prayer for greater Faith - like that of St. Augustine will bring you closer to the Holy Spirit:

Breathe in me, O Holy Spirit, that my thoughts may all be holy. Act in me, O Holy Spirit, that my work, too, may be holy. Draw my heart, O Holy Spirit, that I love but what is holy. Strengthen me, O Holy Spirit, to defend all that is holy. Guard me, then, O Holy Spirit, that I always may be holy. Amen.

• Now work with the Papal Encyclical that you chose and read a paragraph and think about it. These two encyclicals deal with the Bible and how it is the Divinely Inspired Word of God.
• Eat a good breakfast in as peaceful an environment as you can create - then begin your day by praising God for the work he has given you to do today (it does not have to be work for an employer or for a pay-check, rather whatever tasks you need to do today is your work that you are dedicating to God)
• Sometime during your day (lunchtime?) think about what you have read in the Papal Encyclical. You may want to take notes, or make notes at this time. Whatever helps you to get a better understanding of what the Pope is telling you.
• When you return home from work, leave work alone and focus on achieving a calm atomosphere. This does not mean dis-engaging from your family or responsibilities - rather by engaging to be a support, a helper or whatever role is needed - you are working hard to bring about family unity and love.
• Avoid TV shows with violence (that includes the news) at least one hour before going to bed. The idea is that you will not be stressed or overly stimulated when you should be getting ready for sleep.
• Before going to sleep, re-read the section of the Encyclical that you read earlier that morning and see if you have any new ideas. Then just meditate on what it is you have read - this will help you to release the cares of the day and embrace the Word of God.

Everyone is different and this set of steps as a coping mechanism can be adjusted as you see fit. By spending time on how the Catholic Church approaches the Word of God, you will probably feel less stress about the items that were of concern to you in your post. Being stressed about Word of God is not the work of God - but, rather is the Devil attempting to have you abandon your Faith through doubt and despair.

I hope this was helpful.

God bless

Does the origins of how are Bible was formed disturb anyone? The fact that men gathered, generations after Jesus was crucified, and picked which documents were included and which were excluded really bothers me. It also bothers me why the Book of Revelations was included. Was the author, John, really John the Apostle? The choices these men made became words inspired by God, but many of the authors never even made that claim. I struggle with this every day, how do you cope with this?

 

[PJM]

Hi, JoeNJ,

I re-read your ogirinal post and thought maybe another approach would be helpful. While you have received some excellent information specific to the origin of the Bible - as I appreciate your post, it dealt more with coping skills rather then needing specific information. With that in mind, let’s try two things:

1.) Go to the following links, select one and then copy and paste it to a Word document so you can print it.

papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13provi.htm

papalencyclicals.net/Pius12/P12DIVIN.HTM

2.) Organize your day so you can build the guidance of Christ’s Church into your life by establishing a daily order or daily routine similar to this:

• Wake up 30 minutes earlier then you usually do (so, adjust the time you go to bed). You need to have a good night’s sleep and a set routine for your daily activities to begin to get your coping skills functioning at their best.

– When you wake up fix your mind on Christ and some aspect of His Life. The Rosary can be very helpful in beginning your day. Here is a link you may find helpful: comepraytherosary.org/

• During the Rosary, it would be appropriate to begin some meditations on the Mysteries you are praying about. When you complete the Rosary spend a few minutes on seeing how much God loves you and that your prayer for greater Faith - like that of St. Augustine will bring you closer to the Holy Spirit:

Breathe in me, O Holy Spirit, that my thoughts may all be holy. Act in me, O Holy Spirit, that my work, too, may be holy. Draw my heart, O Holy Spirit, that I love but what is holy. Strengthen me, O Holy Spirit, to defend all that is holy. Guard me, then, O Holy Spirit, that I always may be holy. Amen.

• Now work with the Papal Encyclical that you chose and read a paragraph and think about it. These two encyclicals deal with the Bible and how it is the Divinely Inspired Word of God.
• Eat a good breakfast in as peaceful an environment as you can create - then begin your day by praising God for the work he has given you to do today (it does not have to be work for an employer or for a pay-check, rather whatever tasks you need to do today is your work that you are dedicating to God)
• Sometime during your day (lunchtime?) think about what you have read in the Papal Encyclical. You may want to take notes, or make notes at this time. Whatever helps you to get a better understanding of what the Pope is telling you.
• When you return home from work, leave work alone and focus on achieving a calm atomosphere. This does not mean dis-engaging from your family or responsibilities - rather by engaging to be a support, a helper or whatever role is needed - you are working hard to bring about family unity and love.
• Avoid TV shows with violence (that includes the news) at least one hour before going to bed. The idea is that you will not be stressed or overly stimulated when you should be getting ready for sleep.
• Before going to sleep, re-read the section of the Encyclical that you read earlier that morning and see if you have any new ideas. Then just meditate on what it is you have read - this will help you to release the cares of the day and embrace the Word of God.

Everyone is different and this set of steps as a coping mechanism can be adjusted as you see fit. By spending time on how the Catholic Church approaches the Word of God, you will probably feel less stress about the items that were of concern to you in your post. Being stressed about Word of God is not the work of God - but, rather is the Devil attempting to have you abandon your Faith through doubt and despair.

I hope this was helpful.

God bless

VERY WELL DONE<
God Bless you and THANKS,
pat/PJM

 

[tqualey]

Hi, Pat,

Thank you.

God bless

VERY WELL DONE<
God Bless you and THANKS,
pat/PJM

 

[Gaber]

Hi, JoeNJ,

I re-read your ogirinal post and thought maybe another approach would be helpful. While you have received some excellent information specific to the origin of the Bible - as I appreciate your post, it dealt more with coping skills rather then needing specific information…

(big snip)

… Being stressed about Word of God is not the work of God - but, rather is the Devil attempting to have you abandon your Faith through doubt and despair.

I hope this was helpful.

God bless

The practice outlined by Tqualey is admirable and can be modified in some ways for what can be called “spiritual practice.” That is well and good. The one criticism I would apply to Tqualey’s suggestion is that it matches what in sales is called the “assumptive close.” It starts with the assumption that what you are questioning is already settled. And his reason for it is “Being stressed about Word of God is not the work of God - but, rather is the Devil attempting to have you abandon your Faith through doubt and despair.”

Well, that is very pious and may be useful if the only question is roughly in the form of “I feel my faith is weakening and I wish to maintain it without change.” Problem is, the cat’s already out of the bag and the above suggestion is about trying to stuff it back in. You are already on new ground by the very nature of the original question,.

It also assumes that what you are dealing with is only a faith question. There is such a thing as Bible scholarship. And that comes in two varieties. One is from the point of view of reading from within the context of the Bible already having accepted a certain paradigm about it. In this case, that seems to be Tqualey’s position. the other is to study the Bible as a phenomenon, as an artifact. And that is a matter of applying many disciplines to the understanding of what is the subject matter aside from faith. To be fair, Tqualey makes that sort of distinction and is fairly straightforward about that.

However, it is neither fair nor useful to restrict one’s motivations for questioning to an alleged attack by the devil. Neither is JoeNJ’s question necessarily springing from doubt and/or despair! One only needs to read the Bible even with one eye open and from the start in Genesis can very easily say “Hey–wait a minute!” A full, rich, and rewarding career could unfold from that one pause. Or a line of inquiry that is scholarly and not necessarily prompted by doubt, nor necessarily causing a lessening of faith.

It is said that “An unexamined life is not worth living.” Could that be applied to one’s faith as well? Of course it can, and and that can happen in both areas of study: one from an internal discovery of what one’s faith is and can be beyond simple rote acceptance, and appreciating faith as a function and phenomenon useful or not, religious or otherwise, in many areas of one’s life.

 

[tqualey]

Hi, Gaber,

Nice post!

I really see this as saying that there is another side to this coin … or, with a better analogy - maybe another facet to this diamond!

The concern, at least as I appreciated it, came from stress (distress) about the very nature of the Word of God we have in the Bible. People really do not do much scholarship while stressed. This is more of the ‘fight or flight’ response. My approach was to try - at least as best I could - to try and relieve the stress and have the OP move on in the direction he wanted to. Stress drains one’s energy and will lead to much more serious mental and physical problems unless it is handled. Now, there are many ways to handle stress - and in this case, I thought this would be a good start. It is open to all and there is no secret in applying any of these steps.

I submit that once the stress level is reduced, moving into scholarship or further biblical study is a great idea… But, first we need to get out of the burning building before we can walk across the street to the library.

I enjoyed reading your post.

God bless

The practice outlined by Tqualey is admirable and can be modified in some ways for what can be called “spiritual practice.” That is well and good. The one criticism I would apply to Tqualey’s suggestion is that it matches what in sales is called the “assumptive close.” It starts with the assumption that what you are questioning is already settled. And his reason for it is “Being stressed about Word of God is not the work of God - but, rather is the Devil attempting to have you abandon your Faith through doubt and despair.”

Well, that is very pious and may be useful if the only question is roughly in the form of “I feel my faith is weakening and I wish to maintain it without change.” Problem is, the cat’s already out of the bag and the above suggestion is about trying to stuff it back in. You are already on new ground by the very nature of the original question,.

It also assumes that what you are dealing with is only a faith question. There is such a thing as Bible scholarship. And that comes in two varieties. One is from the point of view of reading from within the context of the Bible already having accepted a certain paradigm about it. In this case, that seems to be Tqualey’s position. the other is to study the Bible as a phenomenon, as an artifact. And that is a matter of applying many disciplines to the understanding of what is the subject matter aside from faith. To be fair, Tqualey makes that sort of distinction and is fairly straightforward about that.

However, it is neither fair nor useful to restrict one’s motivations for questioning to an alleged attack by the devil. Neither is JoeNJ’s question necessarily springing from doubt and/or despair! One only needs to read the Bible even with one eye open and from the start in Genesis can very easily say “Hey–wait a minute!” A full, rich, and rewarding career could unfold from that one pause. Or a line of inquiry that is scholarly and not necessarily prompted by doubt, nor necessarily causing a lessening of faith.

It is said that “An unexamined life is not worth living.” Could that be applied to one’s faith as well? Of course it can, and and that can happen in both areas of study: one from an internal discovery of what one’s faith is and can be beyond simple rote acceptance, and appreciating faith as a function and phenomenon useful or not, religious or otherwise, in many areas of one’s life.

 

[Gaber]

Hi, Gaber,

Nice post!

I really see this as saying that there is another side to this coin … or, with a better analogy - maybe another facet to this diamond!

The concern, at least as I appreciated it, came from stress (distress) about the very nature of the Word of God we have in the Bible. People really do not do much scholarship while stressed. This is more of the ‘fight or flight’ response. My approach was to try - at least as best I could - to try and relieve the stress and have the OP move on in the direction he wanted to. Stress drains one’s energy and will lead to much more serious mental and physical problems unless it is handled. Now, there are many ways to handle stress - and in this case, I thought this would be a good start. It is open to all and there is no secret in applying any of these steps.

I submit that once the stress level is reduced, moving into scholarship or further biblical study is a great idea… But, first we need to get out of the burning building before we can walk across the street to the library.

I enjoyed reading your post.

God bless

Thanks for your response.

Perhaps some folks don’t do such work under stres, but the form of your comment about that is what’s called in GS an “allness” statement. It implies that what you say is the case always, whether you intend that or not. For instance my most diligent studies were exactly at the time of greatest stress, because I wanted to know. My case therefore, and perhaps others, even joeNJ’s, might not fit your model as stated. For my part, I say “vamos a ver.” (lets go see." ) I wouldn’t prescribe what is best or how it might play out for anyone. I find that the best way to make God laugh is to make plans.

Nice of you to offer an alternative, though.

 

[HelenRose]

Does the origins of how are Bible was formed disturb anyone? The fact that men gathered, generations after Jesus was crucified, and picked which documents were included and which were excluded really bothers me. It also bothers me why the Book of Revelations was included. Was the author, John, really John the Apostle? The choices these men made became words inspired by God, but many of the authors never even made that claim. I struggle with this every day, how do you cope with this?

I have come to realize that the books had been circulating, read and loved by the Church for centuries. The men who took it upon themselves to bring them together gave a great deal of thought and prayer to this task.

One reason why I am so drawn to these books it that no one ever claimed that the Holy Word simpy fell from the sky all written in gold letters. The Bible is a book replete with human stories of human weaknesses. There is no white washing. Nothing is hidden.

These are the letters and documents of the Church. To accept them is to accept the authority of Church. It is an act of faith.

 

[tqualey]

Hi, HelenRose,

Excellent post.

When it comes to meeting Word of God in the Word of God … the message of Christ - so often repeated - is “Peace!” He often tells the Apostles (and us) not to let our hearts be troubled. We are to pray for greater Faith - and this will bring us closer to Christ and closer to His Peace. I have a hunch this is an area where stress just melts away in the heat of His Love.

God bless

I have come to realize that the books had been circulating, read and loved by the Church for centuries. The men who took it upon themselves to bring them together gave a great deal of thought and prayer to this task.

One reason why I am so drawn to these books it that no one ever claimed that the Holy Word simpy fell from the sky all written in gold letters. The Bible is a book replete with human stories of human weaknesses. There is no white washing. Nothing is hidden.

These are the letters and documents of the Church. To accept them is to accept the authority of Church. It is an act of faith.

 

[edwest2]

The following may be helpful to the OP and others.

amazon.com/Why-Catholic-Bibles-are-Bigger/dp/1581880103

Peace,
Ed