Orthodox friend joining the Church

[TRH1292]

Greetings,

I have a friend who as an infant was Baptized and Confirmed in the Greek Orthodox Church. However, he had little to no contact with that religion growing up. He was drawn into the standard Protestant environment and attended protestant Church’s growing up. Now, he is joining the Catholic Church and is preparing to be received into the Church at his local Latin Rite Roman Catholic parish.

1. When he joins the Church at this local Latin Parish, is he then a member of the Latin rite, or is he automatically a member of the eastern rite, as some have claimed?
2. Sense he is already confirmed, does he just make a public profession of faith?

 

[RyanBlack]

Greetings,

I have a friend who as an infant was Baptized and Confirmed in the Greek Orthodox Church. However, he had little to no contact with that religion growing up. He was drawn into the standard Protestant environment and attended protestant Church’s growing up. Now, he is joining the Catholic Church and is preparing to be received into the Church at his local Latin Rite Roman Catholic parish.

1. When he joins the Church at this local Latin Parish, is he then a member of the Latin rite, or is he automatically a member of the eastern rite, as some have claimed?
2. Sense he is already confirmed, does he just make a public profession of faith?

He is automatically enrolled in the corresponding Eastern Catholic Church, even if he is received in a Roman Catholic parish. Since he has been baptized and chrismated, he will be received into full communion upon making a profession of faith. As to the extent of catechesis prior to being received, that is at the discretion of the parish pastor.

 

[TRH1292]

He is automatically enrolled in the corresponding Eastern Catholic Church, even if he is received in a Roman Catholic parish. Since he has been baptized and chrismated, he will be received into full communion upon making a profession of faith. As to the extent of catechesis prior to being received, that is at the discretion of the parish pastor.

What is the corresponding Eastern Catholic Church? The Greek Orthodox Church he was received into is apart of the American Greek Orthodox Church under the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople. So does he become a member of the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church or the Melkite Greek Catholic Church?

 

[Jeffgo]

He wouldn’t be in either the Ukrainian or Melkite Churches. The term “Greek Catholic” is used to refer to any Catholic of the Byzantine Rite (the same rite used by the Orthodox Church), even if the people in the Church are not ethnic Greeks (such as Ukrainians, or, in the case of the Melkites, Arabs). “Greek Catholic” and “Byzantine Catholic” are used synonymously.

Your friend would definitely be part of a Byzantine Rite Catholic Church, it’s just a matter of finding out which particular Byzantine Rite Church. A complete list of Eastern Catholic Churches can be found here: ewtn.com/expert/answers/catholic_rites_and_churches.htm In the section on Byzantine Rite Churches, it mentions a Byzantine Catholic Church from Greece, so I’d assume that that would be the one that your friend would be a part of once he becomes Catholic.

As mentioned in the article, this Byzantine Catholic Church from Greece is quite small, so it you probably wouldn’t be able to find a parish here in the U.S. That being said, a Catholic can practice his faith in any Catholic parish he chooses, so your friend is free to practice in another Byzantine Catholic parish, or he can attend the Latin Rite parish that’s receiving him into the Catholic Church if he prefers

 

[RyanBlack]

What is the corresponding Eastern Catholic Church? The Greek Orthodox Church he was received into is apart of the American Greek Orthodox Church under the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople. So does he become a member of the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church or the Melkite Greek Catholic Church?

Neither. The Ukrainian Catholic Church corresponds to the Ukrainian Orthodox Church, while the Melkite Catholic Church corresponds to the Antiochian Orthodox Church. I believe there is actually a Greek Catholic Church that corresponds to the Greek Orthodox Church, although it is numerically very small.

 

[thequietsinger]

Greetings,

I have a friend who as an infant was Baptized and Confirmed in the Greek Orthodox Church. However, he had little to no contact with that religion growing up. He was drawn into the standard Protestant environment and attended protestant Church’s growing up. Now, he is joining the Catholic Church and is preparing to be received into the Church at his local Latin Rite Roman Catholic parish.

1. When he joins the Church at this local Latin Parish, is he then a member of the Latin rite, or is he automatically a member of the eastern rite, as some have claimed?
2. Sense he is already confirmed, does he just make a public profession of faith?

I would like to point out, as a Priest on here and a Bishop told me that anyone who comes from the Orthodox faith can, in fact, become a Roman Catholic. Anyone who says your friend can’t doesn’t have the proper information. Yes, he should only need to make a Profession of Faith, and a Reconciliation, to be brought into the Church. If you’d like more information, please feel free to ask!

 

[TRH1292]

It seems unreasonable or somewhat strange that all those joining the Catholic Church in America from the Greek Orthodox Church would automatically be assigned to a rite (Greek Byzantine Catholic Church) which does not appear to even have a parish in the United States, or perhaps anywhere outside Greece or Turkey. It seems like it would make more sense for them to be in the rite of a Byzantine Church that at least has a presence, such as the Ruthenian Church. But of course, I don’t make the rules.

In any case, it seems like it may be complicated enough to advise him to write to our local Latin Archdiocese for clarification on what specific rite he is a member of.

 

[thequietsinger]

It seems unreasonable or somewhat strange that all those joining the Catholic Church in America from the Greek Orthodox Church would automatically be assigned to a rite (Greek Byzantine Catholic Church) which does not appear to even have a parish in the United States, or perhaps anywhere outside Greece or Turkey. It seems like it would make more sense for them to be in the rite of a Byzantine Church that at least has a presence, such as the Ruthenian Church. But of course, I don’t make the rules.

In any case, it seems like it may be complicated enough to advise him to write to our local Latin Archdiocese for clarification on what specific rite he is a member of.

I would definitely advise that. Also, it may be worth his while to contact the local RC Diocese, and make an appointment with the Bishop to discuss it with him. Yes, it may seem a little far stretched and a little confusing, but he will be able to tell you exactly what he will need to do, and will give honest answers.

 

[Aramis]

It seems unreasonable or somewhat strange that all those joining the Catholic Church in America from the Greek Orthodox Church would automatically be assigned to a rite (Greek Byzantine Catholic Church) which does not appear to even have a parish in the United States, or perhaps anywhere outside Greece or Turkey. It seems like it would make more sense for them to be in the rite of a Byzantine Church that at least has a presence, such as the Ruthenian Church. But of course, I don’t make the rules.

In any case, it seems like it may be complicated enough to advise him to write to our local Latin Archdiocese for clarification on what specific rite he is a member of.

His canonical “care” as it were will probably be Ruthenian, Ukrainian, or Melkite, depending upon a variety of specifics. But until he submits a request for transfer, he will be canonically a member of the Greek Greek Catholic Church sui iuris, tho he can attend and participate in the Roman.

The relevant canon translates to english as follows:

Canon 35

Baptized non-Catholics coming into full communion with the Catholic Church should retain and practice their own rite everywhere in the world and should observe it as much as humanly possible.
Thus, they are to be enrolled in the Church sui iuris of the same rite with due regard for the right of approaching the Apostolic See in special cases of persons, communities or regions.

intratext.com/IXT/ENG1199/_PZ.HTM

 

[Richca]

Greetings,

I have a friend who as an infant was Baptized and Confirmed in the Greek Orthodox Church. However, he had little to no contact with that religion growing up. He was drawn into the standard Protestant environment and attended protestant Church’s growing up. Now, he is joining the Catholic Church and is preparing to be received into the Church at his local Latin Rite Roman Catholic parish.

1. When he joins the Church at this local Latin Parish, is he then a member of the Latin rite, or is he automatically a member of the eastern rite, as some have claimed?
2. Sense he is already confirmed, does he just make a public profession of faith?

I think the main thing is that when your friend is received into full communion with the Catholic Church he becomes a member of the universal Catholic Church whether he professes or practices the Catholic faith in the latin rite or one of the eastern catholic rites.

 

[5Loaves]

The topic of ascription of a baptized member of an Eastern non-Catholic Church who enters in full communion with the Catholic Church was addressed on Your Word From the Wise a couple of years ago by Fr. George Gallaro.

"Fr. George Gallaro is a professor of canon law and ecumenism at the Byzantine Catholic Seminary of Ss. Cyril and Methodius, among many other distinguished positions he’s held in these fields over the almost four decades he’s been a priest, such as being a judicial vicar and a staff member for the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity. He holds a licentiate in ecumenical theology and a certificate in liturgical theology as well as a doctorate in Eastern canon law."

The competent ecclesiastical authority to receive one into full communion is specified in the CCEO in the canons 898-899.

The same Code in canon 35, following the Decree on the Eastern Churches (Orientalium ecclesiarum), declares that: “Baptized non-Catholics coming into full communion with the Catholic Church should retain and practice their own rite and should observe it everywhere in the world as much as humanly possible.” In the case of Orthodox, the new Church of ascription shall be one of the autonomous Eastern Catholic Churches, the closest in its ritual approach.

…The Eastern Orthodox who joins the equivalent Eastern Catholic Church finds the surroundings in keeping with his/her Christian history and identity. That does not mean that he/she cannot continue to attend the Latin Church, even though it is desirable that he/she should be helped to uphold his/her own Church tradition.

…Sometimes, a baptized member of an Eastern non-Catholic Church who enters in full communion with the Catholic Church wants to be ascribed into the Latin Church. If so, one must, with the prior approval of the local Latin bishop, seek an indult (i.e. permission) from the Holy See. The canonical reason for such a petition must be serious, e.g., the spiritual wellbeing of the petitioner or the unity of the family when the petitioner is married to a Latin spouse.

While canon 897 provides that: “A member of the Christian faithful of an Eastern non-Catholic Church is to be received into the Catholic Church with only the profession of the Catholic faith…", that profession would be delayed in order to secure first “approval of the local Latin bishop, seek an indult (i.e. permission) from the Holy See” if the Orthodox Christian seeks this exception, that is to be ascribed into the Latin Church rather than into the prescribed ECC.

 

[MonkMoses]

I am aware of a few instances where this same thing happened, ie. an Orthodox becoming Catholic.

In all of the cases the Orthodox were received thru a RC parish and notation was made in the Baptismal register, that they officially belonged to the Greek Catholic Church.

In the one case where Rome needed to be consulted we were told that because there was no “Greek” Greek Catholic Church in America they were free to choose which Greek Catholic Church to attend.

 

[Peter_J]

Greetings,

I have a friend who as an infant was Baptized and Confirmed in the Greek Orthodox Church. However, he had little to no contact with that religion growing up. He was drawn into the standard Protestant environment and attended protestant Church’s growing up. Now, he is joining the Catholic Church and is preparing to be received into the Church at his local Latin Rite Roman Catholic parish.

Hi TRH. I’m curious: did your friend first consider getting back in touch with his Orthodox roots?

 

[babochka]

I would like to point out, as a Priest on here and a Bishop told me that anyone who comes from the Orthodox faith can, in fact, become a Roman Catholic. Anyone who says your friend can’t doesn’t have the proper information. Yes, he should only need to make a Profession of Faith, and a Reconciliation, to be brought into the Church. If you’d like more information, please feel free to ask!

Many priests (and even bishops) don’t understand the canon law on this issue. I have a friend who recently concluded a months long quest to determine which church she is a member of. She was erroneously told that she could choose to be enrolled into the Latin Rite and thought she was Roman Catholic. She and her husband later began attending a Ruthenian Church and wanted to have their children Chrismated. Believing that she was canonically Roman, she began the process to transfer to the Ruthenian Church. The Roman bishop said that he did not have jurisdiction. The Ruthenians told her that she was Syriac. The Syriacs told her that she was not Syriac, but they didn’t know what she was. Turns out she was Melkite all along. This was the consensus of several canon lawyers who were involved in the process.

 

[thequietsinger]

Many priests (and even bishops) don’t understand the canon law on this issue. I have a friend who recently concluded a months long quest to determine which church she is a member of. She was erroneously told that she could choose to be enrolled into the Latin Rite and thought she was Roman Catholic. She and her husband later began attending a Ruthenian Church and wanted to have their children Chrismated. Believing that she was canonically Roman, she began the process to transfer to the Ruthenian Church. The Roman bishop said that he did not have jurisdiction. The Ruthenians told her that she was Syriac. The Syriacs told her that she was not Syriac, but they didn’t know what she was. Turns out she was Melkite all along. This was the consensus of several canon lawyers who were involved in the process.

If you don’t mind me asking, was your friend told she could never become a Roman Catholic? I don’t mean to sound rude, but I’m just curious. I was told by an Apologist Priest on CAF that I could, which is what spiked my curiosity.

 

[MorEphrem]

If you don’t mind me asking, was your friend told she could never become a Roman Catholic? I don’t mean to sound rude, but I’m just curious. I was told by an Apologist Priest on CAF that I could, which is what spiked my curiosity.

You can become a Latin from an Orthodox but if you’re an Eastern Catholic (which is what an Orthodox individual received into the Catholic Church automatically becomes) it requires a canonical transfer which requires your bishop’s assent. You need to know who your bishop is before you can obtain permission.

 

[thequietsinger]

You can become a Latin from an Orthodox but if you’re an Eastern Catholic (which is what an Orthodox individual received into the Catholic Church automatically becomes) it requires a canonical transfer which requires your bishop’s assent. You need to know who your bishop is before you can obtain permission.

Since I’m Greek Orthodox, will I need to contact a Greek Orthodox Bishop, or a Catholic Bishop? I will be converting in a different diocese from the one I’m in now (moving), and a Catholic Bishop I met over the summer who is in the diocese I will be converting in knows of my situation, which I why I’m asking for clarification.

 

[TRH1292]

Hi TRH. I’m curious: did your friend first consider getting back in touch with his Orthodox roots?

He has an interest in the Eastern Catholic Church’s, but has no interest in staying/returning to the Eastern Orthodox church.

 

[5Loaves]

Since I’m Greek Orthodox, will I need to contact a Greek Orthodox Bishop, or a Catholic Bishop? I will be converting in a different diocese from the one I’m in now (moving), and a Catholic Bishop I met over the summer who is in the diocese I will be converting in knows of my situation, which I why I’m asking for clarification.

In the article posted here earlier on this topic written by a canon lawyer with extensive experience dealing in these receptions into the Catholic Church:

The Code of Canons of the Eastern Churches (i.e. CCEO) in its canon 897 affirms that**: “A member of the Christian faithful of an Eastern non-Catholic Church is to be received into the Catholic Church with only the profession of the Catholic faith,** after a doctrinal and spiritual preparation that is suited to that person’s condition.” Since this constitutes a very delicate act, it is advisable to ascertain the weighty reasons why one asks for admission into the Catholic Church.

Orthodox (“an Eastern non-Catholic Church”) coming into full communion need not contact any bishops. They are received by a simple profession of faith, once they have sufficient “doctrinal and spiritual preparation”.

 

[Aramis]

Since I’m Greek Orthodox, will I need to contact a Greek Orthodox Bishop, or a Catholic Bishop? I will be converting in a different diocese from the one I’m in now (moving), and a Catholic Bishop I met over the summer who is in the diocese I will be converting in knows of my situation, which I why I’m asking for clarification.

once received, you contact the correct Eastern Catholic Bishop for permission to change your canonical ascription. Who might not in fact be of the Greek Greek Catholic Church, since there are no convenient bishops of that church nearby if you are in the US. It may, in fact, even be the local Roman bishop; I don’t have the tools nor training to be more specific, even if given more information.

I can say that it’s only particularly relevant if you have children, get married, or seek ordination, enrollment in a religious community, or an annulment. Being Orthdodox, you’re already validly baptized, confirmed, and communed. Essentially, Rome already considers you to be a Greek Greek Catholic, and is just waiting for you to acknowledge Rome.