Orthodox Saints

[w_stewart]

Does the Catholic Church teach that those declared by the Orthodox Church as saints worthy of veneration? Is the Orthodox declaration of sainthood regarded by the Catholic Church as infallible, in the first place?

 

[StMarina303ad]

Does the Catholic Church teach that those declared by the Orthodox Church as saints worthy of veneration? Is the Orthodox declaration of sainthood regarded by the Catholic Church as infallible, in the first place?

I’m sorry no Catholics have answered your post yet.

I do know that for approximately the first 1,000 of Christianity that the Catholic Church was still a part of the Orthodox Church, so all the Saints determined then would be considered Saints by the Catholic Church - like Sts.Cyril and Methodius, St. John Chyrsostom and St. Basil, St. Marina (my personal favorite), St. Mary of Egypt, St. Christina, St. Nicholas (aka Santa Clause), St. Julitta and her son, etc. - all Saints determined to be Saints by the Bishops/Patriarchs of the Churches in the East, not in Rome, prior to the split. The Roman Catholic Church and Eastern Catholic Churches would consider that they are Saints and worthy of veneration. Some of them are even listed on the Catholic (both Western and Eastern Catholic) Calendars

As for the Saints since the Rome left communion with the Orthodox Church like: St. Innocent of Alaska, St. John Maximovich of San Francisco and Shangi, St. Xenia, St. Peter the Eskimo, etc. I don’t know that the Roman Catholic Church has ever said anything about them officially; however, some of the Eastern Catholic Churches - for example - the Melkite Greek Catholic Church did not leave communion with the Orthodox Church to join the Catholic Church until the 1700’s which was about 700 years after the split of the Catholic Church from Orthodoxy, so they still recognize the Orthodox Saints/Martyrs of the East from 1,000 to 1,700 which have not been recognized by the Roman Rite of the Catholic Church - for example, the Melkite Greek Catholics continue to recognize St. Gregory Palmas as a Saint - but I think that the Roman Rite of the Catholic Church does not.

I am an Orthodox Christian, in my opinion you have plenty of Catholic Church recognized official Saints to venerate from before the Churches split that you probably don’t need our other Saints, but I certainly don’t think it would hurt for you to pray to the more modern day Orthodox Saints - the more friends-in-high-places you have in your corner the better, but you would want to get permission from your spiritual father before doing so, of course.

 

[ralphinal]

I am not sure that the Catholic Church as a position. Do not forget that many saints were not canonized under the current system, anyway.

An EO poster told me once on here that Saints may not even be known or celebrated from one group to another, but it is a more localized thing. Under this system, all would be both recognized and not recognized.

 

[bpbasilphx]

Certain saints of Kievan Rus’ are on the calendar of the Ruthenian and Ukrainian Catholic Churches, though they are post-schism.

Pope Pius IX allowed Russian Catholics to celebrate the memory of traditional Russian Saints.

St. Sergius of Radonezh (13-14 century) is in the new edition of the Roman Martyrology.

Pope John Paul II publicly referred to St. Seraphim of Sarov and St. John Maximovitch of San Francisco by their Orthodox honorifics.

Draw your own conclusions.

 

[w_stewart]

I’m sorry no Catholics have answered your post yet.

I do know that for approximately the first 1,000 of Christianity that the Catholic Church was still a part of the Orthodox Church, so all the Saints determined then would be considered Saints by the Catholic Church - like Sts.Cyril and Methodius, St. John Chyrsostom and St. Basil, St. Marina (my personal favorite), St. Mary of Egypt, St. Christina, St. Nicholas (aka Santa Clause), St. Julitta and her son, etc. - all Saints determined to be Saints by the Bishops/Patriarchs of the Churches in the East, not in Rome, prior to the split. The Roman Catholic Church and Eastern Catholic Churches would consider that they are Saints and worthy of veneration. Some of them are even listed on the Catholic (both Western and Eastern Catholic) Calendars

As for the Saints since the Rome left communion with the Orthodox Church like: St. Innocent of Alaska, St. John Maximovich of San Francisco and Shangi, St. Xenia, St. Peter the Eskimo, etc. I don’t know that the Roman Catholic Church has ever said anything about them officially; however, some of the Eastern Catholic Churches - for example - the Melkite Greek Catholic Church did not leave communion with the Orthodox Church to join the Catholic Church until the 1700’s which was about 700 years after the split of the Catholic Church from Orthodoxy, so they still recognize the Orthodox Saints/Martyrs of the East from 1,000 to 1,700 which have not been recognized by the Roman Rite of the Catholic Church - for example, the Melkite Greek Catholics continue to recognize St. Gregory Palmas as a Saint - but I think that the Roman Rite of the Catholic Church does not.

I am an Orthodox Christian, in my opinion you have plenty of Catholic Church recognized official Saints to venerate from before the Churches split that you probably don’t need our other Saints, but I certainly don’t think it would hurt for you to pray to the more modern day Orthodox Saints - the more friends-in-high-places you have in your corner the better, but you would want to get permission from your spiritual father before doing so, of course.

Do you venerate the saints canonized by the Catholic Church after the Schism, e.g. Saint Faustina?

 

[w_stewart]

Certain saints of Kievan Rus’ are on the calendar of the Ruthenian and Ukrainian Catholic Churches, though they are post-schism.

Pope Pius IX allowed Russian Catholics to celebrate the memory of traditional Russian Saints.

St. Sergius of Radonezh (13-14 century) is in the new edition of the Roman Martyrology.

Pope John Paul II publicly referred to St. Seraphim of Sarov and St. John Maximovitch of San Francisco by their Orthodox honorifics.

Draw your own conclusions.

I am looking for an official declaration of the Catholic Church. But it seems there is none.

Also, the Orthodox Church considers Constantine the Great as a saint. As a Catholic, is it safe to have a devotion with him if the Catholic Church has no official teaching regarding his sainthood?

 

[mardukm]

Do you venerate the saints canonized by the Catholic Church after the Schism, e.g. Saint Faustina?

I believe St. Francis of Assisi is revered by many Orthodox, though not officially. I even recall reading the Prayer of St. Francis being offered in Orthodox Churches as a valid prayer for people to say. In people’s minds, there are also many dates when “schism” occurred. Some say as early as 1054; some say, not until the sacking of Constantinople; some say, not until after Florence.

Blessings,
Marduk

 

[StMarina303ad]

Do you venerate the saints canonized by the Catholic Church after the Schism, e.g. Saint Faustina?

Me personally?..no.

Working at a Catholic bookstore (my 2nd of 3 jobs) I have regular exposure to post-split Catholic Saints, but no I don’t pray to them or ask them for anything.

My favorite Saints are those Holy Martyrs of the early Church from before Christianity was legalized by St. Constantine. Get your hands on: The Lives of the Holy Women Martyrs (it’s Vol.7) (after reading it, you’ll want to by the entire set) and you’ll never ask for another modern day Catholic Saint to intercede for you again - they are that powerful! holyapostlesconvent.org/HacWebStore/index.php

 

[StMarina303ad]

I believe St. Francis of Assisi is revered by many Orthodox, though not officially. I even recall reading the Prayer of St. Francis being offered in Orthodox Churches as a valid prayer for people to say. In people’s minds, there are also many dates when “schism” occurred. Some say as early as 1054; some say, not until the sacking of Constantinople; some say, not until after Florence.

Blessings,
Marduk

No St. Francis of Assisi is not revered by many Orthodox at all.

The Prayer of St. Francis is not read in Orthodox Churches.
Only Liturgies: Divine, Pre-Sanctified, Vespers, Marriages, Chrismations, Funerals, 40-Day, etc. are held in Orthodox Churches - and the Liturgies are sung or chanted, not read. In fact, the ONLY thing which is “read” in an Orthodox Church is the Creed (which sometimes is sung) and the Lord’s Prayer.

 

[w_stewart]

My favorite Saints are those Holy Martyrs of the early Church from before Christianity was legalized by St. Constantine.

Was Constantine baptized by the Orthodox Church? When was he declared a saint by the Orthodox Church?

 

[Formosus]

I am looking for an official declaration of the Catholic Church. But it seems there is none.

Also, the Orthodox Church considers Constantine the Great as a saint. As a Catholic, is it safe to have a devotion with him if the Catholic Church has no official teaching regarding his sainthood?

I am always surprised at how often I read this question. The Roman Church recognizes Sts. Constantine and Helen.

catholic.org/saints/saint.php?saint_id=2731

Orthodox saints after the schism were recognized as saints when reunions occured between the various Eastern churches and the Latin Church. Such as St. Gregory Palamas, but there are others (St. Isaac of Syria, St. Photius of Constantinople and many others!) There are so many canonized or officially recognized saints out there, I doubt even the Vatican could give you a list today of all the Saints recognized by the Catholic Church throughout history.

edit and as His Grace pointed out, even some saints after reunions are recognized, I imagine if a complete reunion between East and West ever occured, no side would be asked to give up their saints just as the UGCC was not asked to give up its when it came back into Union.

 

[w_stewart]

No doubt the mother of the Emperor is a revered saint by the Catholic Church. But it is doubtful in regard to Constantine.

I got this article from wikipedia:

Constantine I, Roman Emperor adopted Christianity following his victory in the Battle of Milvian Bridge 312. Under his rule, Christianity rose to become the dominant religion in the Roman Empire, and for his example of a “Christian monarch” Constantine is revered as a saint in the Eastern Orthodox Church. Not only the details of his adoption of Christianity make the religious beliefs of Constantine I interesting; theologians and historians alike have argued about the question to which form of Christianity Constantine ultimately converted, with regard to the legitimation of religious persecution.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constantine_I_and_Christianity

info also available here:

books.google.com.ph/books?id=V2d12iZkgOwC&pg=PA388&lpg=PA388&dq=was+constantine+revered+as+a+saint+by+the+Catholic+Church%3F&source=web&ots=MfaKuYNTJV&sig=_2qFeSRMzkiPw-3kbw7xmqb48tk&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=8&ct=result

 

[bpbasilphx]

**
Also, the Orthodox Church considers Constantine the Great as a saint. As a Catholic, is it safe to have a devotion with him if the Catholic Church has no official teaching regarding his sainthood?**

**So do the various Byzantine Catholic Churches.

His service is given on 21 May (Orthodox date) in the Greek Catholic ANTHOLOGION publised by Grottaferatta. **

 

[Formosus]

He is listed on a mainstream catholic website as a saint. That is pretty much as close to an authority on the issue you are going to get …

A saint doesn’t have to be in the liturgical calender to be considered a saint. If every saint that wasn’t liturgically commemorated by Rome were not true saints, then the list of saints would be quite slim indeed.

I can not read your second link, but the wikipedia source is irrelevant as it is very easy to sabatoge

Edit*

But if you do read the Wikipedia article

“The Roman Catholic Church in its Eastern rites also venerates Constantine, but is not venerated universally in the Latin rite.” -wikipedia

aka he is not on the latin calender but still considered a saint.

 

[w_stewart]

He is listed on a mainstream catholic website as a saint. That is pretty much as close to an authority on the issue you are going to get …

A saint doesn’t have to be in the liturgical calender to be considered a saint. If every saint that wasn’t liturgically commemorated by Rome were not true saints, then the list of saints would be quite slim indeed.

That’s not what I wanted to know but rather why the Catholic Church has no common stand on the issue. Alright, he is a revered saint among Eastern Catholics but not among Latin Catholics.

I can not read your second link, but the wikipedia source is irrelevant as it is very easy to sabatoge

Edit*

But if you do read the Wikipedia article

“The Roman Catholic Church in its Eastern rites also venerates Constantine, but is not venerated universally in the Latin rite.” -wikipedia

aka he is not on the latin calender but still considered a saint.

That’s it. Latin Catholics do not venerate him as a saint. It is not true that he is revered as a saint by the Roman Catholic Church.

 

[Formosus]

It doesn’t say that, it says that he is not UNIVERSALLY venerated. Meaning that he is not liturgically commemorated. Pretty much any saint recently canonized by Benedict or by JPII are not universally canonized so does that mean they are not saints in the Latin church?

Also, since he is commemorated in the eastern Catholic churches and these churches are in union with Rome, which is Latin, then how could they not be saints for Latins too since the Catholic Church is united in Faith. All the saints of each tradition are saints for everyone.

 

[w_stewart]

It doesn’t say that, it says that he is not UNIVERSALLY venerated. Meaning that he is not liturgically commemorated. Pretty much any saint recently canonized by Benedict or by JPII are not universally canonized so does that mean they are not saints in the Latin church?

We are quite sure that those canonized by the Popes are saints and worthy of veneration. That is not similar case with Constantine.

Also, since he is commemorated in the eastern Catholic churches and these churches are in union with Rome, which is Latin, then how could they not be saints for Latins too since the Catholic Church is united in Faith. All the saints of each tradition are saints for everyone.

But how come the Western Church does not revere or at least recognize him as a saint? I am not talking about liturgical commemoration here.

 

[ralphinal]

We are quite sure that those canonized by the Popes are saints and worthy of veneration. That is not similar case with Constantine.

But how come the Western Church does not revere or at least recognize him as a saint? I am not talking about liturgical commemoration here.

I am not sure that he meets the qualifications. He would be in heaven, assuming the story of his deathbed conversion is true, but that in and of itself does not mean that he lead a life of noteworthy Christian example.

 

[w_stewart]

While Constantine made great strides towards overcoming the barbarian threat along the northern frontier and would have tried his hand at Persia if he had lived, he is known not so much for his military prowess as for moving the capital of the Roman Empire to an exciting, viable, wealthy new location, and for his legitimizing Christianity. During his reign, he not only killed his brother-in-law, but his own wife and son. Despite his ruthlessness, Constantine was made into a saint. Historians labeled him Constantine the Great.

I got this from here

Perhaps, our Orthodox friends can comment on this article in regard to the emperor’s sainthood.

 

[Formosus]

Its irrelevant as to if he is or is not cannonized by the Pope because the Pope approves of the Liturgical calenders for Eastern christians that include him on them. If he is not a saint, then there is a serious problem allowing for Eastern Catholics to venerate a non-saint during their liturgies don’t you think? Especially since Rome publishes an official Greek translation of the Divine Liturgy of our father among the saints , St. John Chrysostom.