OSAS

[Jerry_Marino]

YOU ARE SINNING MY FRIEND in PREACHING OSAS.

Remaining OUTSIDE of Christ’s Church, the Catholic Church, and being disobedient to apostolic authority IS A SIN.

You MUST REPENT of SIN. SIN is NOT AUTOMATICALLY expiated by simply believing that one is saved. Further, sins committed after baptism MUST be forgiven. The ONLY way to assure that your grave sins are forgiven is to confess them to an apostolic priest. Yes, small, venial sins can be forgiven at anytime with simple prayer - but grave sins (e.g. presuming upon God’s Mercy [e.g. OSAS], spreading heresies, rejecting Christ’s appointed apostolic leaders, fornicating, lustful thoughts, adultery, slandering others, calumny, murder, aiding/supporting somone have an abortion, divorce, etc.) are all grave matter and lead to rejecting Christ and being damned for it unless one repents and confesses. Repentance is NOT a one time event. One MUST repent for EVERY grave sin each time one commits one. THEN - one MUST be forgiven of that sin - either sacramentally by the authority of an apostolic priest/bishop or by preforming a PERFECT act of contrition (which is IMPOSSIBLE without grace).

NO ONE is saved until God judges them saved my friend. To presume to think you can judge yourself saved in place of God is itself a sin of presumption and a sin of pride.

REPENT - and YOU TO MAY be saved if you choose to stay in God’s grace and obey ALL His commands and FINISH in His grace.

You are embracing a satanic lie to imagine you can not cast off your own salvation at any time and walk in your old way of life. There are 100’s of scripture verses that refute OSAS - you just choose to turn a blind eye to them.

2 Peter 2:12-22
But these [ed: false teachers], like unreasoning animals, born as creatures of instinct to be captured and killed, reviling where they have no knowledge, will in the destruction of those creatures also be destroyed, 13 suffering wrong as the wages of doing wrong. They count it a pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are stains and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, as they carouse with you, 14 having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children; 15 forsaking the right way, they have gone astray, having followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness; 16 but he received a rebuke for his own transgression, for a mute donkey, speaking with a voice of a man, restrained the madness of the prophet.
17 These are springs without water and mists driven by a storm, for whom the black darkness has been reserved. 18 For speaking out arrogant words of vanity they entice by fleshly desires, by sensuality, those who barely escape from the ones who live in error, 19 promising them freedom while they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by what a man is overcome, by this he is enslaved. 20 For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. 21 For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them. 22 It has happened to them according to the true proverb, “A DOG RETURNS TO ITS OWN VOMIT,” and, “A sow, after washing [ed: allusion to baptism], returns to wallowing in the mire.”

In other words - it is VERY possible to lose one’s salvation through false teachers and false doctrines. You can try to say “but these were not really saved” and evade it - but that is just a disingenuous word game because YOU CAN NEVER KNOW with 100% certainty that you are saved until you are judged saved. PERIOD.

James

wow, someone who finally states some truth to what the church teaches, salvation is of God not a church (denomination), the real Church is the body of Christ which is made up of believers.

james you say you can never know, o.k. explain to me then why people lie at funerals by stating the deceased is in heaven?

before you answer think about it cause within the catholic church this goes on a lot, where a deceased led a life of crime and the priest will state that he is in either heaven or purgatory leading the family under false hope. if the man or woman died without repentance and believing in Jesus, where is this individual?

as a family member, i can only hope before my kin took his or her last breath that they cried out to Jesus like the man on the cross but i will never know. i know it is a delicate matter to tell someone the truth but that is why it is important to tell them NOW.

the commandments of God to keep is believe and love.

God bless.

 

[rinnie]

wow, someone who finally states some truth to what the church teaches, salvation is of God not a church (denomination), the real Church is the body of Christ which is made up of believers.

james you say you can never know, o.k. explain to me then why people lie at funerals by stating the deceased is in heaven?

before you answer think about it cause within the catholic church this goes on a lot, where a deceased led a life of crime and the priest will state that he is in either heaven or purgatory leading the family under false hope. if the man or woman died without repentance and believing in Jesus, where is this individual?

as a family member, i can only hope before my kin took his or her last breath that they cried out to Jesus like the man on the cross but i will never know. i know it is a delicate matter to tell someone the truth but that is why it is important to tell them NOW.

the commandments of God to keep is believe and love.

God bless.

Because usually Jerry the person that died had Last rites. What that does is you are admitting your sin on this earth and asking the Lord for forgiveness and Mercy.

That is the purpose of the Priest, he was been given authority to forgive sin as Jesus did. Jesus gave him this right. Now as long as your confess your sin, and you are truely sorry you are forgiven. Unless your church has another way of understanding the bible.

The reason the Priest says the person is in purgatory or heaven is he does not know what God’s judgement was. IF God forgave this person and did not feel he needed the final cleansing then he went straight to heaven. IF not Purgatory it is. Where do you feel this is not the teaching of the bible, and how do you feel the Priest has misled anyone?

 

[CentralFLJames]

Exactly. The priest has in most cases given last rites. The actual liturgy of the funeral mass though does not to my recollection assume that the person is in heaven but rather “trusts into God’s Mercy and Kindness the repose of the soul of the departed”. The spoken parts of course are personalized and no doubt you will hear most priests give comforting words to the grieving family.

But this is the huge benefit of the Catholic Church since last rites does not require perfect contrition to be forgiven. As well, the anointing of extreme unction is a special chrism oil that will also permit the sins to be forgiven if the person is incapacitated and unable to speak due to coma or severe illness etc. since Jesus gave the apostolic authority to establish the conditions of forgivness of sins on earth and in cases of pending death the Church opens up its disciplines to permit the full extent of God’s mercy for those who can not speak on their own and lets the faithful prayers of their loved ones impress upon God the full weight of all their sincerity of faith to be added to the dieing person’s own faith - even if imperfect for the majority of their life. Since God is is timeless He hears all these prayers said in the holy mass as if spoken before the person actually died and takes them all into consideration in granting His final mercy. We believe there is nothing more efficacious to God than the sacrifice of the mass since it represents the same exact timeless sacrifice of Christ on the Cross to the Father at the moment the deceased needs His grace.

James

 

[paul_c]

We’ve had discussions of OSAS many times on this board. I’ve found that there are three basic descriptions of salvation:

The Free Grace view:

Jesus died for our sins and therefore anyone who believes this is saved by Grace through faith. In this theology, upon profession of faith, the believer is sealed forever as one of the Elect, and will not be lost, regardless of future action, In fact, the argument is that man’s actions have nothing to do with salvation, it is a gift to whoever God chooses. Some are born to be condemned, others to be saved.

The Lordship Theology view:
Under this view, people are saved through grace by faith because of Jesus’s sacrifice. Like the Free Grace view, those who are saved will be sealed forever as one of the elects. However, this view recognizes that the elect will do good works and that God would never declare someone as innocent, who is in fact a sinner. Therefore, if you don’t demonstrate your faith through actions, you will be viewed as having never really been saved.

The Catholic View:
People are saved through grace by faith when baptized. After baptism, the Catholic must stay in the state of Grace by loving God and his neighbor as himself. If the Catholic turns from God through sin, he can be reconciled through the sacrament of reconciliation. In this view, no man knows he is saved until the final judgement.

The weakness of the Free Grace theology is that it relies on God calling an unrepentent sinner innocent, which is of course a lie and not worthy of a perfect God. It also militates against the words of Jesus in Matthew 19:16-19 , where he says you must follow the commandments to gain eternal life:
16 Now someone approached him and said, “Teacher, what good must I do to gain eternal life?” 17 He answered him, “Why do you ask me about the good? There is only One who is good. If you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.” 18 He asked him, “Which ones?” And Jesus replied, " ‘You shall not kill; you shall not commit adultery; you shall not steal; you shall not bear false witness; 19 honor your father and your mother’; and ‘you shall love your neighbor as yourself.’"

The weakness of the Lordship theology is that there is an inconsistency between having to do good works to demonstrate your membership in the elect and in knowing beforehand that you are saved. Because if you have to do good works, you will not know if you have done them faithfully until your opportunities to be tested have ceased with death.

That leaves us with the Catholic position that you can not be assured of salvation until you have died in the state of Grace as the only feasible althernative.

 

[Philthy]

james you say you can never know, o.k. explain to me then why people lie at funerals by stating the deceased is in heaven? before you answer think about it cause within the catholic church this goes on a lot, where a deceased led a life of crime and the priest will state that he is in either heaven or purgatory leading the family under false hope.

 

[Jerry_Marino]

Unfortunately Jerry doesnt seem to be able differentiate being in a state of grace at this point in ones life (presently saved) and being judged to inherit the kindom of God at the end of ones life.

John 17:3 “This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.”

i’ve been justified my friend by His righteousness, His work on the Cross from where you quote the above Scripture from, how can we know God and Jesus Christ?

God bless

 

[Jerry_Marino]

The weakness of the Free Grace theology is that it relies on God calling an unrepentent sinner innocent, which is of course a lie and not worthy of a perfect God. It also militates against the words of Jesus in Matthew 19:16-19 , where he says you must follow the commandments to gain eternal life:
16 Now someone approached him and said, “Teacher, what good must I do to gain eternal life?” 17 He answered him, “Why do you ask me about the good? There is only One who is good. If you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.” 18 He asked him, “Which ones?” And Jesus replied, " ‘You shall not kill; you shall not commit adultery; you shall not steal; you shall not bear false witness; 19 honor your father and your mother’; and ‘you shall love your neighbor as yourself.’"

that is a misinterpretation of matthew 19, cause if Jesus was telling us we must follow the commandments for eternal life the disciples would not have followed up with the question, “Who then can be saved?”

it would have been clear to them what Jesus was stating but it was not so, as you state, but Jesus tells them what He means, 28 Jesus said to them, "Amen, I say to you that you who have followed me, in the new age, when the Son of Man is seated on his throne of glory, will yourselves sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. 29 And everyone who has given up houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or lands for the sake of my name will receive a hundred times more, and will inherit eternal life. 30 But many who are first will be last, and the last will be first.

Jesus tells over and over to follow Him:
Matthew 10:38 and whoever does not take up his cross and follow after me is not worthy of me.

what is the cost of following Christ? our cross.

there are many verses about following Christ and none of them say to keep the law or the commandments my friend.

Galatians 4:4 But when the fullness of time had come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, 5 to ransom those under the law, so that we might receive adoption. 6 As proof that you are children, God sent the spirit of his Son into our hearts, crying out, “Abba, Father!” 7 So you are no longer a slave but a child, and if a child then also an heir, through God. 8 At a time when you did not know God, you became slaves to things that by nature are not gods; 9 but now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how can you turn back again to the weak and destitute elemental powers? Do you want to be slaves to them all over again?

• On the basis of the arguments advanced from Gal 3:1 through Gal 4:7, Paul now launches his appeal to the Galatians with the question, how can you turn back to the slavery of the law (Gal 4:9)? The question is posed with reference to bondage to the elemental powers (see the note on Gal 4:3) because the Galatians had originally been converted to Christianity from paganism, not Judaism (Gal 4:8). The use of the direct question is like Gal 3, 3-5.* usccb.org/nab/bible/galatians/galatians4.htm

God bless you

 

[fhansen]

that is a misinterpretation of matthew 19, cause if Jesus was telling us we must follow the commandments for eternal life the disciples would not have followed up with the question, “Who then can be saved?”

it would have been clear to them what Jesus was stating but it was not so, as you state, but Jesus tells them what He means, 28 Jesus said to them, "Amen, I say to you that you who have followed me, in the new age, when the Son of Man is seated on his throne of glory, will yourselves sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. 29 And everyone who has given up houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or lands for the sake of my name will receive a hundred times more, and will inherit eternal life. 30 But many who are first will be last, and the last will be first.

Jesus tells over and over to follow Him:
Matthew 10:38 and whoever does not take up his cross and follow after me is not worthy of me.

what is the cost of following Christ? our cross.

there are many verses about following Christ and none of them say to keep the law or the commandments my friend.

Galatians 4:4 But when the fullness of time had come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, 5 to ransom those under the law, so that we might receive adoption. 6 As proof that you are children, God sent the spirit of his Son into our hearts, crying out, “Abba, Father!” 7 So you are no longer a slave but a child, and if a child then also an heir, through God. 8 At a time when you did not know God, you became slaves to things that by nature are not gods; 9 but now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how can you turn back again to the weak and destitute elemental powers? Do you want to be slaves to them all over again?

• On the basis of the arguments advanced from Gal 3:1 through Gal 4:7, Paul now launches his appeal to the Galatians with the question, how can you turn back to the slavery of the law (Gal 4:9)? The question is posed with reference to bondage to the elemental powers (see the note on Gal 4:3) because the Galatians had originally been converted to Christianity from paganism, not Judaism (Gal 4:8). The use of the direct question is like Gal 3, 3-5.* usccb.org/nab/bible/galatians/galatians4.htm

God bless you

**Wasn’t the Reformation great? A new gospel saying, “Don’t worry about breaking My commandments-I made a stupid mistake and created you incapable of obeying them anyway.”

That’s more than just watering things down-that’s a satanic. Who else said wants Gods’ will not to be done?**

 

[Jerry_Marino]

Romans 6:12 Therefore, sin must not reign over your mortal bodies so that you obey their desires. 13 And do not present the parts of your bodies to sin as weapons for wickedness, but present yourselves to God as raised from the dead to life and the parts of your bodies to God as weapons for righteousness. 14 For sin is not to have any power over you, since you are not under the law but under grace. 15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under the law but under grace? Of course not!

Christians have been released from the grip of sin, but sin endeavors to reclaim its victims. The antidote is constant remembrance that divine grace has claimed them and identifies them as people who are alive only for God’s interests.

the law does not save and you cannot keep the commandments if it were so then God would not have sent His son to die for us my friends. what saves you is the work of Christ on the cross when you come to full repentance and trusting HIm for your salvation.

God bless

 

[fhansen]

**So God created man so that man would fail- never able to live up to the standards set for him? When does man become man? Why would God set unattainable standards? Of course man can keep the commandments. While this isn’t possible for man by his own efforts, with God all things are possible. In fact this is the point of the gospel in simplest terms: man needs God. But man must recognize this fact and turn to Him-being drawn and yet responding/cooperating at the same time.

What saves us is the grace won by Jesus laying His life down for us-a grace which makes possible obedience to Gods commands, for those who respond to the call. Of course the law doesn’t save us-God does-by molding us into beings truly and completely in line with His will. Complete obedience to the law is one natural result of Gods’ finished work in us.**

 

[paul_c]

Jerry,
your personal interpretation of scripture is in error. Yes, Jesus sacrifice opened up the doors of heaven and it is by Grace that we are saved through baptism. Remember what Peter said to the 3000 at Pentacost when asked what they should do. He said, Be Baptized.

But Jesus NEVER said that you didn’t have personal responsibility for your own salvation. Quite the contrary. Throughout the Gospel, he taught that we must be personally holy, turn the other cheek, love our neighbor as ourselves. You deny a simple, direct statement from Jesus in Matthew 19 that you need to follow the commandments to gain eternal life. Your explanation is not convincing. Furthermore, in Matthew 25 31-46, he says that we will be judged on whether we showed mercy to our fellow man. If we do not, we will be condemned. So he saved us, but we need to follow up with that and live holy lives in order to stay in the state of Grace. And yes, we are imperfect creatures, that is why he allowed the forgiveness of sins through the sacrament of reconciliation. .

And by the way, do you think Satan could have had a better plan than to make all of Luther’s followers believe that all they had to do was say : I believe in Jesus and his mercy to be saved? Its so easy…unfortunately for those that bank on that simple way to salvation is that it is not true.

 

[rinnie]

Jerry what did Jesus say to us.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son so that everyone who believes in him MIGHT NOT PERISH but MIGHT have eternal life.

Why did Jesus say might? Where did he say that he gave his only son and all will not perish.

 

[Philthy]

Romans 6:12 Therefore, sin must not reign over your mortal bodies so that you obey their desires. 13 And do not present the parts of your bodies to sin as weapons for wickedness, but present yourselves to God as raised from the dead to life and the parts of your bodies to God as weapons for righteousness. 14 For sin is not to have any power over you, since you are not under the law but under grace. 15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under the law but under grace? Of course not!

Christians have been released from the grip of sin, but sin endeavors to reclaim its victims. The antidote is constant remembrance that divine grace has claimed them and identifies them as people who are alive only for God’s interests.

The “antidote” to what, Jerry? Sinning? Why would we need an antidote to sinning if sin is of no consequence to the Christian? This quote you provided contradicts your theology.

what saves you is the work of Christ on the cross when you come to full repentance and trusting Him for your salvation.

This the truth Jerry, but it is not the whole truth. It addresses how one becomes Christian, but it doesn’t even begin to address the life one needs live as a Christian. There is no point in Paul even discussing the issue of sin with Christians if sin is no longer an issue and of no consequence for Christians. In fact, if your theology were Paul’s theology, it would make no sense for Paul to answer his rhetorical question “Shall we sin that grace may abound?” with “Of course not!” Why would he say we shouldnt sin if it has no salvific consequence??? Sinning could very well be a way - the most dramatic way, in fact - of demonstrating faith, trust and confidence in Christ alone - and not our own behavior - for salvation. But that’s not what Paul says. Why not Jerry? Why does sin still matter for Christians? I wont hold my breath for your clear and concise answer! I’ll give you a hint, though: Why did Christ send the Holy Spirit?
The fact that Paul (and others) does discuss sin not only here, but in many places - and does so in the context of salvation and the inheritance of the kingdom of God - directly contradicts your theology and explains your failure to acknowledge those posts that I have repeatedly provided you.
But I still like you! I’m simply obligated to the truth…

God bless

 

[Jerry_Marino]

How to Walk with God

When I hear of Hollywood couples who get together and then divorce rather quickly, I have to wonder what people are looking for in marriage.

Do they understand that it’s a commitment? Do they understand that feelings will come and go, and that you must get on with the very real business of loving a person and all that it means?

The same can be said of a relationship with God. There are times when you feel great joy, passion, and excitement about being a Christian. And there are times when you don’t feel it. But that doesn’t mean you say, “Well, that’s it. I’m not going to follow Christ anymore.”

The Bible doesn’t say, “The just shall live by feelings.” Rather, it says, “The just shall live by faith” (Romans 1:17 NKJV).

Feelings change, but walking with God takes faith. It takes commitment. And it takes consistency.

The Bible tells us about a man who walked with God for many years. His name was Enoch, and I want to look at some secrets from his life that we can apply in our lives as well.

In the whole of the Bible, only five passages refer to Enoch, two of which are genealogies. Although we don’t find a lot written about Enoch, what we do have is significant.

Genesis tells us, “Enoch lived sixty-five years, and begot Methuselah. After he begot Methuselah, Enoch walked with God three hundred years, and had sons and daughters. So all the days of Enoch were three hundred and sixty-five years. And Enoch walked with God; and he was not, for God took him” (Genesis 5:21–24 NKJV).

Enoch lived during a unique time in human history, just before God’s judgment of the world by the flood. Against this very dark backdrop was a man who walked with God and was spared death. Enoch is a prototype of the last-days believer, showing us how to live as we await the Lord’s return.

So what set Enoch apart? How was he able to live a godly life in an ungodly world, in a time that was characterized by sexual perversion and uncontrolled violence? We find three important principles at work in Enoch’s life that we can apply in our own lives today.

Principle one: Enoch walked with God. The analogy of walking and the Christian life is used throughout Scripture. But what does it mean to walk with God? It is not merely living by rules and regulations or making daily resolutions that we quickly break. It is much more than that.

The prophet Amos revealed an important truth about what it means to walk with God when he asked, “Can two walk together, unless they are agreed?” (Amos 3:3 NKJV). The word he used for “together” gives the idea of two people moving in rhythm together, as in riding a tandem bicycle. But it is not about getting God into rhythm with us; it is getting ourselves into rhythm with Him. That is what it means to walk with God.

Principle two: Enoch was well-pleasing to God. Hebrews 11:5 says, “He had this testimony, that he pleased God” (NKJV). Sometimes we have the mistaken notion that God is very hard to please. Yet God knows our weaknesses and frailties better than anyone, and He is not as hard to please as we might think.

So how do we please God? God is pleased when, in spite of the fact that we are in the right, we patiently endure when misunderstood (see 1 Peter 2:19–20). When you do what is right and patiently endure suffering for it, that is called meekness, and it pleases God.

God is also pleased when children obey their parents (see Colossians 3:20); when we worship Him and help others (see Hebrews 13:15–16); and when we give financially to the work of the kingdom (see Philippians 4:17–18).

Principle three: Enoch was a witness for God. Enoch walked with God, he was well-pleasing to God, and lastly, he was a witness for God. As Enoch walked with God and pleased Him, he had a testimony and a witness.

Every Christian has a testimony. People are watching us. They are observing us. And we should give a lot of thought to that. Before we can effectively witness for God, we must first walk with Him.

Because Enoch walked with God, he saw this world for what it was. Do you?

Have Pastor Greg’s devotions blessed you? Write to let him know!
Greg@harvest.org

 

[paul_c]

How to Walk with God

When I hear of Hollywood couples who get together and then divorce rather quickly, I have to wonder what people are looking for in marriage.

Do they understand that it’s a commitment? Do they understand that feelings will come and go, and that you must get on with the very real business of loving a person and all that it means?

The same can be said of a relationship with God. There are times when you feel great joy, passion, and excitement about being a Christian. And there are times when you don’t feel it. But that doesn’t mean you say, “Well, that’s it. I’m not going to follow Christ anymore.”

The Bible doesn’t say, “The just shall live by feelings.” Rather, it says, “The just shall live by faith” (Romans 1:17 NKJV).

Feelings change, but walking with God takes faith. It takes commitment. And it takes consistency.

The Bible tells us about a man who walked with God for many years. His name was Enoch, and I want to look at some secrets from his life that we can apply in our lives as well.

In the whole of the Bible, only five passages refer to Enoch, two of which are genealogies. Although we don’t find a lot written about Enoch, what we do have is significant.

Genesis tells us, “Enoch lived sixty-five years, and begot Methuselah. After he begot Methuselah, Enoch walked with God three hundred years, and had sons and daughters. So all the days of Enoch were three hundred and sixty-five years. And Enoch walked with God; and he was not, for God took him” (Genesis 5:21–24 NKJV).

Enoch lived during a unique time in human history, just before God’s judgment of the world by the flood. Against this very dark backdrop was a man who walked with God and was spared death. Enoch is a prototype of the last-days believer, showing us how to live as we await the Lord’s return.

So what set Enoch apart? How was he able to live a godly life in an ungodly world, in a time that was characterized by sexual perversion and uncontrolled violence? We find three important principles at work in Enoch’s life that we can apply in our own lives today.

Principle one: Enoch walked with God. The analogy of walking and the Christian life is used throughout Scripture. But what does it mean to walk with God? It is not merely living by rules and regulations or making daily resolutions that we quickly break. It is much more than that.

The prophet Amos revealed an important truth about what it means to walk with God when he asked, “Can two walk together, unless they are agreed?” (Amos 3:3 NKJV). The word he used for “together” gives the idea of two people moving in rhythm together, as in riding a tandem bicycle. But it is not about getting God into rhythm with us; it is getting ourselves into rhythm with Him. That is what it means to walk with God.

Principle two: Enoch was well-pleasing to God. Hebrews 11:5 says, “He had this testimony, that he pleased God” (NKJV). Sometimes we have the mistaken notion that God is very hard to please. Yet God knows our weaknesses and frailties better than anyone, and He is not as hard to please as we might think.

So how do we please God? God is pleased when, in spite of the fact that we are in the right, we patiently endure when misunderstood (see 1 Peter 2:19–20). When you do what is right and patiently endure suffering for it, that is called meekness, and it pleases God.

God is also pleased when children obey their parents (see Colossians 3:20); when we worship Him and help others (see Hebrews 13:15–16); and when we give financially to the work of the kingdom (see Philippians 4:17–18).

Principle three: Enoch was a witness for God. Enoch walked with God, he was well-pleasing to God, and lastly, he was a witness for God. As Enoch walked with God and pleased Him, he had a testimony and a witness.

Every Christian has a testimony. People are watching us. They are observing us. And we should give a lot of thought to that. Before we can effectively witness for God, we must first walk with Him.

Because Enoch walked with God, he saw this world for what it was. Do you?

Have Pastor Greg’s devotions blessed you? Write to let him know!
Greg@harvest.org

What has this got to do with OSAS?

 

[fhansen]

How to Walk with God

When I hear of Hollywood couples who get together and then divorce rather quickly, I have to wonder what people are looking for in marriage.

Do they understand that it’s a commitment? Do they understand that feelings will come and go, and that you must get on with the very real business of loving a person and all that it means?

The same can be said of a relationship with God. There are times when you feel great joy, passion, and excitement about being a Christian. And there are times when you don’t feel it. But that doesn’t mean you say, “Well, that’s it. I’m not going to follow Christ anymore.”

The Bible doesn’t say, “The just shall live by feelings.” Rather, it says, “The just shall live by faith” (Romans 1:17 NKJV).

Feelings change, but walking with God takes faith. It takes commitment. And it takes consistency.

The Bible tells us about a man who walked with God for many years. His name was Enoch, and I want to look at some secrets from his life that we can apply in our lives as well.

In the whole of the Bible, only five passages refer to Enoch, two of which are genealogies. Although we don’t find a lot written about Enoch, what we do have is significant.

Genesis tells us, “Enoch lived sixty-five years, and begot Methuselah. After he begot Methuselah, Enoch walked with God three hundred years, and had sons and daughters. So all the days of Enoch were three hundred and sixty-five years. And Enoch walked with God; and he was not, for God took him” (Genesis 5:21–24 NKJV).

Enoch lived during a unique time in human history, just before God’s judgment of the world by the flood. Against this very dark backdrop was a man who walked with God and was spared death. Enoch is a prototype of the last-days believer, showing us how to live as we await the Lord’s return.

So what set Enoch apart? How was he able to live a godly life in an ungodly world, in a time that was characterized by sexual perversion and uncontrolled violence? We find three important principles at work in Enoch’s life that we can apply in our own lives today.

Principle one: Enoch walked with God. The analogy of walking and the Christian life is used throughout Scripture. But what does it mean to walk with God? It is not merely living by rules and regulations or making daily resolutions that we quickly break. It is much more than that.

The prophet Amos revealed an important truth about what it means to walk with God when he asked, “Can two walk together, unless they are agreed?” (Amos 3:3 NKJV). The word he used for “together” gives the idea of two people moving in rhythm together, as in riding a tandem bicycle. But it is not about getting God into rhythm with us; it is getting ourselves into rhythm with Him. That is what it means to walk with God.

Principle two: Enoch was well-pleasing to God. Hebrews 11:5 says, “He had this testimony, that he pleased God” (NKJV). Sometimes we have the mistaken notion that God is very hard to please. Yet God knows our weaknesses and frailties better than anyone, and He is not as hard to please as we might think.

So how do we please God? God is pleased when, in spite of the fact that we are in the right, we patiently endure when misunderstood (see 1 Peter 2:19–20). When you do what is right and patiently endure suffering for it, that is called meekness, and it pleases God.

God is also pleased when children obey their parents (see Colossians 3:20); when we worship Him and help others (see Hebrews 13:15–16); and when we give financially to the work of the kingdom (see Philippians 4:17–18).

Principle three: Enoch was a witness for God. Enoch walked with God, he was well-pleasing to God, and lastly, he was a witness for God. As Enoch walked with God and pleased Him, he had a testimony and a witness.

Every Christian has a testimony. People are watching us. They are observing us. And we should give a lot of thought to that. Before we can effectively witness for God, we must first walk with Him.

Because Enoch walked with God, he saw this world for what it was. Do you?

Have Pastor Greg’s devotions blessed you? Write to let him know!
Greg@harvest.org

Sounds like Catholic theology to me.

 

[Jerry_Marino]

well whether it sounds like it or not we’ve reached the end, i am not convinced by you all nor you convinced by me.

so instead of hating, why not teach me what you have learned in the catholic church in receiving salvation. how can one reach heaven?

God bless.

 

[paul_c]

well whether it sounds like it or not we’ve reached the end, i am not convinced by you all nor you convinced by me.

so instead of hating, why not teach me what you have learned in the catholic church in receiving salvation. how can one reach heaven?

God bless.

Fair enough.

The Catholic Church teaches that you gain sufficient grace to be saved through the sacrament of Baptism. This is done, upon belief, in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Parents can request Baptism for their children through their own Faith.
Through Baptism, you are forgiven all previous sins and become a member of Christ’s church. Baptism is completely scriptural. Remember, the Gospels start out with the ministry of John the Baptist and even Jesus himself is Baptized. When the first converts come to beleive at Pentacost and ask what they should do, Peter tells them to be baptized.

But the path to salvation doesn’t end at Baptism. Once cleansed of your sins and a member of the church, you must act out your faith. This is done by doing God’s will, which Jesus summarizes for us in the Great Commandment: Love God with all your heart, all your soul and all your mind, and love your neighbor as your self. If you do this unfailingly, you will be saved.

God knows, however, that we are imperfect creatures and at times will turn from him through sin. Through his mercy, God provides a way back into his graces through the sacrament of reconciliation. The essence of what is required in this sacrament are described in the act of Contrition:
O my God, I am sorry for my sins with all my heart.
In choosing to do wrong and failing to do good, I have sinned against You, Whom I should love above all things. I firmly intend, with Your help, to do penance, to sin no more, and to avoid whatever leads me to sin. Our Savior Jesus Christ suffered and died for us. In his name, my God, have mercy.

The way I like to think about it is that we have choices in our lives. We can do God’s will and go to heaven or refuse to do God’s will and be condemned. Every choice we make is either sanctifying (making us more holy) or desanctifying (making us less holy). All the sacraments of the church are sanctifying. Doing acts of kindness , mercy and love are sanctifying. Following the commandments and the beatitudes are sanctifying Acts of jealousy, greed, lust, hate are of course desanctifying. Through training, attention and prayer, it becomes easier and more habitual to do sanctifying things and to avoid those that are desanctifying. We are all called to holiness.

We believe that if you die in the state of Grace, you will go to heaven, even if you haven’t acheived perfect holiness. Remember, you reenter the state of grace after you go to confession if you are sincere in your repentence and do the required penance. You will stay that way until you commit mortal sin. A mortal sin has three components to it:

1. it has to be of a serious nature (departure from the 10 commandments)
2. you need to do it willingly (accidents are not mortal sins)
3. you need to commit it even though you know it will send you to hell

Therefore, these sins are consciously turning from God. If you do this, you can still turn back again through the sacrament of reconciliation and start over.

If you end your life in the state of Grace but have not reached the required state of holiness, you will go to Purgatory where you will become holy prior to coming face to face with God in heaven. All those that go to Purgatory will eventually enter Heaven.

Life is clearly a test. If you end your life where you are opposed to God and have left the state of grace, you will be condemned. If you have done the will of God and stay in the state of Grace, you will be rewarded with eternal life in heaven. This is described in Matthew 25: 31-46…

I hope this helps you understand our views on salvation

 

[fhansen]

well whether it sounds like it or not we’ve reached the end, i am not convinced by you all nor you convinced by me.

so instead of hating, why not teach me what you have learned in the catholic church in receiving salvation. how can one reach heaven?

God bless.

To generalize a bit on this: One major difference between Protestant and Catholic theology on salvation is that in Protestantism ongoing sanctification is usually considered to be an important sign of ones “saved status” while for a Catholic sanctification is imperative -Gods will will be done in our lives, He molding us and working this out to His satisfaction. IOW sin, that which separates us from God, was never meant to subjugate man. We aren’t to accept imperfection as the norm because God doesn’t make anything, be it a dog or a rock or a human, to be anything less than what it’s intended to be. But in man’s case his own will is involved; perfection lies in his choosing what is right and good-ultimately in choosing God as the highest right and good as man comes to see for himself the value of Gods’ will-the value of God-and comes to love Him with his whole heart soul, mind, and strength. This is a process, beginning with faith for an adult, God patiently allowing us time and experience to arrive at the right disposition; Jesus died for us and saves us while we’re yet in our sins and transgressions. So He wants us truly changed, truly justified, unattached to anything other than Him first- unattached to sin, IOW. And the Church, with her teachings and sacraments, is here to help us on the journey to this perfection.

The parable of the faithful servant in Luke 12:35-48 is relevant here with the last verse further helping us understand the nature of Gods’ will in relation to our own and of our obligation relative to the gifts and options we may have been given in this life:

From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked.

 

[jpy15026]

** Once Saved **

2 Tim 4:7-8: "I have competed well; I have finished the race; I have kept the faith. From now on the crown of righteousness awaits me…

How can it be a race if at the beginning you have been awarded the final victory? Notice how he says he has finished the race and he has kept the faith so from then on he is assured. Remember that Catholics don’t say no assurance whatsoever. But only after his life of faith and obedience he can say these things. If he was absolutely assured the moment of his conversion on the road to Damascus, this verse makes no sense.
St. Paul spoke of saved in the past tense (Rom 8:24 …in hope we* were* saved; Eph 2:5,8 …by grace you have been saved through faith; 2 Tim 1:9 …he saved us, called us, according to his grace; and Tit 3:5 …he saved us…).
St Paul spoke of being saved in present tense (Phil 2:12…work out your salvation with fear and trembling). St Peter did too (1 Pet 1:9 as you attain the goal of your faith, salvation)
Yet Jesus spoke in the future tense. Look at Matthew 10:22 he who endures to the end will be saved and Matthew 24:13 he who perseveres to the end will be saved. Mark 8:35 whoever loses his life for my sake will save it. You can see it in Acts 15:11 (we shall be saved), Romans 5:9-10 (we shall be saved), 13:11 (salvation is nearer now then first believed), 1Cor 3:15 (he will be saved, but only through as fire), 1 Cor 5:5 (deliver man to Satan so his spirit may be saved), and Heb 9:28 (Jesus will appear a second time, to bring salvation).

Ok, Have you *been *saved, are you *being *saved, or will you be saved? Pick a verse and see? Not all. Jesus died to save us all, but it is not a done deal. God respects our free will too much. Because of that, even though Jesus died to save us all, we can still mess it up with one simple act of sin. I have been saved, I am still working out my salvation, and I hope to one day be saved. Ah, you say, what about eternal assurance of salvation? Matthew 7:21 not everyone saying Lord Lord will be saved.

Rom 2:5-8
5 By your stubbornness and impenitent heart, you are storing up wrath for yourself for the day of wrath and revelation of the just judgment of God, 6 who will repay everyone according to his works: 7 eternal life to those who seek glory, honor, and immortality through perseverance in good works, 8 but wrath and fury to those who selfishly disobey the truth and obey wickedness.

2Cor 5:10
10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive recompense, according to what he did in the body, whether good or evil.

2 Cor 11:15
15 So it is not strange that his ministers also masquerade as ministers of righteousness. Their end will correspond to their deeds.

1 Peter 1:17
17 Now if you invoke as Father him who judges impartially according to each one’s works, conduct yourselves with reverence during the time of your sojourning,

Ezekiel 18:21-25
21 But if the wicked man turns away from all the sins he committed, if he keeps all my statutes and does what is right and just, he shall surely live, he shall not die. 22 None of the crimes he committed shall be remembered against him; he shall live because of the virtue he has practiced. 24 And if the virtuous man turns from the path of virtue to do evil, the same kind of abominable things that the wicked man does, can he do this and still live? None of his virtuous deeds shall be remembered, because he has broken faith and committed sin; because of this, he shall die. 25 You say, “The LORD’S way is not fair!” Hear now, house of Israel: Is it my way that is unfair, or rather, are not your ways unfair?

Rev 20:12-13
12 I saw the dead, the great and the lowly, standing before the throne, and scrolls were opened. Then another scroll was opened, the book of life. The dead were judged according to their deeds, by what was written in the scrolls. 13 The sea gave up its dead; then Death and Hades gave up their dead. All the dead were judged according to their deeds.

Col 3:24-25
24 knowing that you will receive from the Lord the due payment of the inheritance; be slaves of the Lord Christ.25 For the wrongdoer will receive recompense for the wrong he committed, and there is no partiality.

Mt 7:21
21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven.

John 15:5-6) “I am the vine, you are the branches. Whoever remains in me and I in him will bear much fruit, because without me you can do nothing. Anyone who does not remain in me will be thrown out like a branch and wither; people will gather them and throw them into a fire and they will be burned.”

It’s important to remember that the “once saved” theology started in the 16th century with Calvinism. Did the Holy Spirit forget the devout followers of Christ for the first 1,600 years? Did the gates of hell prevail against the Church as Christ said it would not? Have you read any of the Early Church Fathers? They are the ones who sat at the feet of the Apostles and were taught by them. Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Clement of Rome, Polycarp, Ignatius, just to name a few. Do we really think that the Holy Spirit did not inspire any of these men? Jesus commanded his Apostles to “Go and teach all nations”; shouldn’t we be interested in what those first Christians, taught by Jesus’ Apostles, had to say?
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