Our Sunday Obligation

[mick321]

At one time, Catholics were required to abstain from consuming meat on Fridays throughout the liturgical year. Despite the clearly stated directive from the Church, some self-identified Catholics freely admitted to have consumed meat on Fridays without concern over the consequences. When it became evident that this practice was widespread, the Church responded by “encouraging” the faithful to abstain. Long story short, abstinence became “optional”.

For as long as I remember, Catholics have been required to observe the Lord’s Day by attending Holy Mass at a Catholic Church of their choice. Even to this day, it is clear that many folks take their Sunday obligation seriously. In fact, many masses are filled to capacity.

However, it is obvious that in many masses, at many parishes, there are folks who appear as though they would rather be someplace else. You’ve read the threads. You know the symptoms. You’ve seen them yourselves. You’ve heard their cellphones ring.

I proposed a civilized discussion.

"Resolved: The Catholic Church should officially “encourage” all lay faithful to attend Sunday Mass."

• What are the pros and cons of the Catholic Church making Sunday Mass attendance “optional” for lay Catholics?
• How would this policy-change affect your diocese, your parish, your family, your weekend plans?

 

[MarkThompson]

Wow, a very “modest proposal.”

 

[mick321]

Wow, a very “modest proposal.”

No proposal.

Two questions.

 

[Jason_Diebolt]

It is great to take the Sunday Obligation very seriously. I do that as well. I do not eat meat on Friday because it is a wonderful sacrifice to God. I like to think of God when I am doing that.

 

[ConstantineTG]

Our former parish pastor always says in his sermons that he’s surprised why many do not get a “spiritual heart attack” from missing Sunday Mass and not receiving the Eucharist. While we can’t even miss one meal but we’re fine with missing one Sunday Mass. Its a good analogy, we need food to survive physically and we need Liturgy to survive spiritually. I think we need to explain Sunday Obligation better because other people reidicule us and our faith that “God needs to check our weekly attendance to get accepted in heaven.” I believe that way to, I should not be obligated in the sense to come to church every Sunday. We should all understand the real reason why we need to be there so that we would not look at it as something we have to do but as something that we need to do.

 

[magdalina]

If attendance at Sunday Mass was made voluntary, I think many who now go to OF mass would find other ways to keep the Lord’s day holy.

Around here, EF mass attendance would likely remain unchanged.

 

[ConstantineTG]

If attendance at Sunday Mass was made voluntary, I think many who now go to OF mass would find other ways to keep the Lord’s day holy.

Around here, EF mass attendance would likely remain unchanged.

But attendance is voluntary. I know of a religion that has punch cards and attendance checkers. And they will come to your door and look for you if you miss several services without notice. If you attend another temple instead of the one you are registered in, you need to get a signed slip from that temple and bring it to yours.

 

[hoop0826]

I think that making the Sunday Obligation optional would greatly weaken the parish community. One of the bonds in the community is the fact that we are all bound to Sunday Obligations, under pain of mortal sin. God deserves public worship, and it is our duty to worship Him, so I think that it could be seen as an injustice to God to make the Sunday obligation optional.

 

[magdalina]

I think that making the Sunday Obligation optional would greatly weaken the parish community. One of the bonds in the community is the fact that we are all bound to Sunday Obligations, under pain of mortal sin. God deserves public worship, and it is our duty to worship Him, so I think that it could be seen as an injustice to God to make the Sunday obligation optional.

I agree that God deserves public worship and it is the duty of the entire human race to worship Him in a manner that is consistent with their beliefs. Those who wish to be associated with a Sunday parish community would be able to remain. Others will be free to create a life of prayer that works for them. The parish can then direct its scarce human resources where they will do the most good. Win-Win-Win.

The Church has a history of relaxing long standing norms and has proven time and again that Catholics can take this sort of thing in stride.

Maggie.

 

[thistle]

At one time, Catholics were required to abstain from consuming meat on Fridays throughout the liturgical year. Despite the clearly stated directive from the Church, some self-identified Catholics freely admitted to have consumed meat on Fridays without concern over the consequences. When it became evident that this practice was widespread, the Church responded by “encouraging” the faithful to abstain. Long story short, abstinence became “optional”.

For as long as I remember, Catholics have been required to observe the Lord’s Day by attending Holy Mass at a Catholic Church of their choice. Even to this day, it is clear that many folks take their Sunday obligation seriously. In fact, many masses are filled to capacity.

However, it is obvious that in many masses, at many parishes, there are folks who appear as though they would rather be someplace else. You’ve read the threads. You know the symptoms. You’ve seen them yourselves. You’ve heard their cellphones ring.

I proposed a civilized discussion.

• What are the pros and cons of the Catholic Church making Sunday Mass attendance “optional” for lay Catholics?
• How would this policy-change affect your diocese, your parish, your family, your weekend plans?

Not eating meat was a discipline and not a doctrine which means it can be changed.
The Sunday obligation is doctrine and cannot be changed. Therefore there is little point in discussing a proposal to make it optional. It can never become optional.

 

[mick321]

Not eating meat was a discipline and not a doctrine which means it can be changed.
The Sunday obligation is doctrine and cannot be changed. Therefore there is little point in discussing a proposal to make it optional. It can never become optional.

Good morning. Nice try. Here in the USA, the requirement to attend Mass on Sunday has already been changed. Catholics are currently allowed to attend Mass on Saturday to satisfy their Sunday obligation. It’s unrealistic to think that the Church could not further modify the requirement to accommodate the needs of the faithful.

Have you ever heard of the doctrine of papal infallibility? Catholic Answers has:
catholic.com/library/Papal_Infallibility.asp

The bishops read the studies. They well aware that a growing number of Catholics believe attending Sunday Mass is one of many ways to observe the Lords Day. The trend toward making the Church more user-friendly was established decades ago.

Feel free to move forward to the questions of the OP:

• What are the pros and cons of the Catholic Church making Sunday Mass attendance optional for lay Catholics?
• How would this policy-change affect your diocese, your parish, your family, your weekend plans?

 

[diggerdomer]

At one time, Catholics were required to abstain from consuming meat on Fridays throughout the liturgical year.

Yes, but this is not the current teaching of the Church (and has not been for 40+ or so years). So?

For as long as I remember, Catholics have been required to observe the Lord’s Day by attending Holy Mass at a Catholic Church of their choice. Even to this day, it is clear that many folks take their Sunday obligation seriously. In fact, many masses are filled to capacity.

Yes, this is the constant teaching of the Church.

However, it is obvious that in many masses, at many parishes, there are folks who appear as though they would rather be someplace else. You’ve read the threads. You know the symptoms. You’ve seen them yourselves. You’ve heard their cellphones ring.

Yes, but this is not what the Church teaches.

What are the pros and cons of the Catholic Church making Sunday Mass attendance “optional” for lay Catholics?

There are no “pros” imho, and the Catholic Church doesn’t teach or suggest such.

 

[mick321]

• Yes, but this is not the current teaching of the Church (and has not been for 40+ or so years). So?
• Yes, this is the constant teaching of the Church.
• Yes, but this is not what the Church teaches.
• There are no “pros” imho, and the Catholic Church doesn’t teach or suggest such.

Thanks for sharing.

Happy Holidays.

 

[thistle]

Good morning. Nice try. Here in the USA, the requirement to attend Mass on Sunday has already been changed. Catholics are currently allowed to attend Mass on Saturday to satisfy their Sunday obligation. It’s unrealistic to think that the Church could not further modify the requirement to accommodate the needs of the faithful.

Have you ever heard of the doctrine of papal infallibility? Catholic Answers has:
catholic.com/library/Papal_Infallibility.asp

The bishops read the studies. They well aware that a growing number of Catholics believe attending Sunday Mass is one of many ways to observe the Lords Day. The trend toward making the Church more user-friendly was established decades ago.

Feel free to move forward to the questions of the OP:

• What are the pros and cons of the Catholic Church making Sunday Mass attendance optional for lay Catholics?
• How would this policy-change affect your diocese, your parish, your family, your weekend plans?

Please read my post again. I did not say we must attend Church on a Sunday and that will never change.
I said the Sunday obligation (which you rightly pointed out is fulfilled by attending Saturday evening or on a Sunday).
The Sunday obligation will never be changed, i.e. it will never be fulfilled by Mass on a Saturday morning/early afternoon or on a weekday.

 

[At_Trent]

The Sunday obligation is what it is. It is the first precept of the Church, and the obligation pre-dated the Church herself. It is the 3rd Commandment.

That said, the Church can never drop the precept.

 

[thistle]

The Sunday obligation is what it is. It is the first precept of the Church, and the obligation pre-dated the Church herself. It is the 3rd Commandment.

That said, the Church can never drop the precept.

 

[mick321]

The Sunday obligation is what it is. It is the first precept of the Church, and the obligation pre-dated the Church herself. It is the 3rd Commandment.

That said, the Church can never drop the precept.

Yes, the Ten Commandments given to Moses pre-dated the establishment of the Church. The Third Commandment to which you refer established the Jewish Sabbath on the seventh day. As such, Christ and the Apostles observed the traditional Saturday Sabbath. At some point after Pentecost, the Sabbath observance was transferred to Sunday.

Were “Precepts of the Church” actually codified and promulgated before and made binding on all Christians before the

 

[mick321]

The Sunday obligation is what it is. It is the first precept of the Church, and the obligation pre-dated the Church herself. It is the 3rd Commandment.

That said, the Church can never drop the precept.

I did not begin this thread to debate the technical minutia of cannon law or the merits of revisionist theology. Not my thing. When the church has wanted something changed, it has managed to get it done, even before the concept of papal infallibility was the rule of the road.

If you really need a response, OK. You are partially correct. The 3rd Commandment pre-dated the Church herself. Indeed, the Sunday obligation is what it is.

The 3rd Commandment - given to Moses by God the Father - established the Sabbath, associated it with the creation of the earth, and ordered it to be observed on the Seventh Day. Jesus Christ gave credibility to the meaning and authority of the 3rd commandment by observing the traditional Saturday Sabbath.

First ecumenical Council of Nicaea revised and extended the meaning of the “Sabbath”, first by associating the word with the Resurrection of Christ, then by changing the day of observance from Saturday to Sunday. Wala, a precept is born, and the 3rd Commandment remains intact. The same Council also promulgated the original text of the Nicaean Creed. How does the original text square with the one you recited in Mass last Sabbath day? Isn’t it great how these things work?

I’m not advocating nor resisting a revision to the Sunday obligation. I am merely acknowledging that the Supreme Pontiff, on the advise of the Holy Spirit, while exercising the authority granted to the Chair of Peter by Christ Himself, can modify decrees made by previous Church Councils. Those unable to accept this premise certainly cannot proceed to the questions posed in the OP.

Thanks for sharing.

 

[Luvadoxi]

Ok–I’m a little confused; maybe someone can clarify. I had thought that, re thistle’s earlier post:

1. fasting and abstinence is a precept, but the particular fasting practice of no meat on every Friday is a discipline which can be, and in fact has been, changed. While it’s in force, it is an obligation, but it can be changed. (For example, in the U.S., another penitential practice can be substituted, or if you believe Jimmy Akin as I do, penance is recommended but not required except during Lent in the U.S.)
2. About Mass, I had thought that was changeable; that in the early Church there was no need for a precept because of the zeal of Christians (would that we had that today!), but as time went by it became necessary to require Mass attendance 3 times a month, or something like that. What I’m wondering is, is the phrasing of the precept “you must attend Mass on Sundays” a recent interpretation of the 3rd Commandment (now binding of course) or has it always been the case? I’m not saying God isn’t to be honored every Sunday–just wondering if the method of honoring Him has changed or not…

Also, are precept/doctrine the same, or is it more like discipline?

One more question! Is Byzantine/Eastern discipline different; in other words, do they have a Sunday Mass obligation?

 

[Matthew_Holford]

One more question! Is Byzantine/Eastern discipline different; in other words, do they have a Sunday Mass obligation?

• The 22 sui iuris Eastern Catholic Churches in communion with Rome: yes they have the same obligation.
• As for the other Eastern Churches: I don’t know.