Out of Order Mass Issues

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jsor102060

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I went to a church for Mass this past Sunday, that I don’t usually go to. The first thing that struck me as off was the processional cross. It had no corpus, only colored stones, frankly, it looked like Marvel’s Infinity Gauntlet. The second issue I had was the priest. He began the Mass, THEN started asking if he had folks from out of town, where they were from, etc. I had thought that this is out of order, once the Mass is begun, the rubric must be followed. Am I too harsh in judgement here?
 
From the General Instruction of the Roman Missal, n. 117:

“Likewise, on the altar or close to it, there is to be a cross adorned with a figure of Christ crucified. The candles and the cross with the figure of Christ crucified may also be carried in the procession at the Entrance.”

From the 1983 Code of Canon Law, Canon 846: “The liturgical books, approved by the competent authority, are to be faithfully followed in the celebration of the sacraments.”

From the Oath of Fidelity: “I shall follow and foster the common discipline of the whole Church and shall observe all ecclesiastical laws, especially those which are contained in the Code of Canon Law. … So help me God, and God’s holy Gospels, on which I place my hand.”

[Excerpt from the English translation of The Roman Missal ©2010, International Commission on English in the Liturgy Corporation. All rights reserved.]
 
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Does the church in question have a permanent crucifix on or above the altar or to the side? If so, that may be why the “plain” one is used to process in.
 
Luke 18:2-5: "He said, “In a certain city there was a judge who neither feared God nor had respect for people. In that city there was a widow who kept coming to him and saying, ‘Grant me justice against my opponent.’ For a while he refused; but later he said to himself, ‘Though I have no fear of God and no respect for anyone, yet because this widow keeps bothering me, I will grant her justice, so that she may not wear me out by continually coming.’” (New Revised Standard Version)
 
Yes, imo, it is wrong to be asking if there are any visitors etc at the beginning of Mass. That’s not the time for it to be done. When the notices are given perhaps at the end of the homily and whilst the first collection is taken up, or at the end of Mass are two more appropriate places for this to occur.

Keep in mind, this may have occured simply due to its being Christmas. I was away one Easter and at the Mass I attended, at the beginning after the entrance procession, Father then asked the same ie any visitors (raise your hand), where are your from? (responses), then Father came down the isle with a basket of chocolates to give every out of towner. 😦 :cry:
 
Our priests come up the aisle before mass and ask about visitors, birthdays and anniversaries. Sometimes they will have us greet those around us, most times not. Then, he will return to the back of the church, the cantor will ask us to stand and join in singing the hymn, and the priest comes in with the altar servers, and lector. And mass begins.
 
It’s not wrong for the priest to ask if there are visitors or new people before he begins the Mass and for them to be welcomed in some way.

Note, just being on the altar doesn’t mean the priest began Mass.
 
Cor_ad_Cor said:
the rubrics don’t actually prohibit it as the priest is permitted words of welcome at this point.
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in your opinion. I respectfully don’t agree. There is the Introit which may be followed by a few very brief words introducing the Mass of the Day to the congregation.
The rubrics don’t actually permit the priest to add words of welcome at this point. (See below in the ETA section.)

Sacrosanctum concilium - under A) General norms #22. 3. “Therefore no other person, even if he be a priest, may add, remove, or change anything in the liturgy on his own authority.”

ETA
GENERAL INSTRUCTION OF THE ROMAN MISSAL INSTITUTIO GENERALIS MISSALIS ROMANI Including Adaptations for the Dioceses of the United States of America
The Entrance
  1. After the people have gathered, the Entrance chant begins as the priest enters with the deacon and ministers. The purpose of this chant is to open the celebration, foster the unity of those who have been gathered, introduce their thoughts to the mystery of the liturgical season or festivity,…"
Greeting of the Altar and of the People Gathered Together
  1. When they reach the sanctuary, the priest, the deacon, and the ministers reverence the altar with a profound bow.
As an expression of veneration, moreover, the priest and deacon then kiss the altar itself; as the occasion suggests, the priest also incenses the cross and the altar.
  1. When the Entrance chant is concluded, the priest stands at the chair and, together with the whole gathering, makes the Sign of the Cross. Then he signifies the presence of the Lord to the community gathered there by means of the Greeting. By this Greeting and the people’s response, the mystery of the Church gathered together is made manifest.
After the greeting of the people, the priest, the deacon, or a lay minister may very briefly introduce the faithful to the Mass of the day.

III. The Individual Parts of the Mass - scroll down to chapter III, and even though the wording is a little different to the above (which is from the Vatican Website), it’s in essence the same.

The Greeting after the Entrance Antiphon/chant/singing has "In the name of the Father, and of the Son + and of the Holy Spirit. Amen. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Spirit be with you all. OR Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. OR The Lord be with you. And with your spirit.
The celebrant may briefly introduce the Mass of the day.

Nowhere does it say the priest may now add his own personal greeting/enquiries etc at this point and within the Mass.
 
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To make things clear this was after he made the sign of the cross? If so that was wrong. It did not invalidate the mass though. As for the cross, there just needs to be one crucifix near the altar. It does not need to be the processional cross.
 
jsor102060 said:
I had thought that this is out of order, once the Mass is begun, the rubric must be followed. Am I too harsh in judgement here?
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Hopefully it was not so distracting that you missed the sacred opportunity to commune with God. Distractions are often things we need to look inwardly to resolve rather than look at the actions of others.
 
repentant2 said:
Yeah I went to mass in a hospital chapel today and it was the most boomer-ish experience of my life.
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When I feel that way, I think of my brothers and sisters around the world who are denied the opportunity to attend mass, either because of politics or lack of priest…it puts it all in perspective, and I don’t feel so sorry for myself any longer.
 
repentant2 said:
Lots of felt banners everywhere, ugly 70s style art, gather hymnal, terrible homily that barely mentioned the birth of Christ or the incarnation Instead he rambled about how God makes us feel cozy like we’re in a robe and slippers with hot chocolate, communion in the hand, no kneelers or any kneeling was done. 99% certain I heard one guy say you betcha instead of amen when he received the Eucharist. I’m really hoping I heard that one wrong, but I don’t believe I did.
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Well, another perspective would be to rejoice that in a hospital setting, Mass was available, and that people availed themselves of the opportunity to attend, instead of making excuses as to why they couldn’t. Perhaps this was also a multi-denominational space, explaining, for example, the lack of kneelers. Still, one could just choose to be critical and feel as if they hadn’t attended Mass at all.
 
I know who the boomers are.

I am asking what passed for boomer-ish.
 
In the Churches around Australia that I’ve attended it seems very common for the Priests to have an informal welcome between the Introductory Rite and the Penitentical Act. I’ve always thought that it was fitting and seamless.
 
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