Panicking again and under pressure... should I settle in marriage?

[CaliLobo]

I’m writing because I am being pressured again left and right.

My coworkers, and now my parents, are telling me that they agree with my friend, who said that the only thing that matters in a woman is that she has a good attitude and she is a good mother to her children.

Most people I share that advice with, agree with it.

“All flowers wilt as they get old,” says my dad. “Average looks is all you need,” says my mom. “You can get married if you aren’t so picky,” says my boss.

Today I texted my uncle Merry Christmas, and he writes back saying that he hopes all my New Year’s wishes come true, and that he hopes I get married next year. Who says that on Christmas? A few weeks ago, when I spoke to my grandma on the phone, she also said she hopes I get married next year.

The pressure is everywhere.

Today I got a Christmas gift… a setup date tomorrow. I looked on Facebook, and as I predicted, she is average looking to me. She has a career and likely has all the other good qualities, like emotional and economic stability. Her appearance is acceptable, but it doesn’t stand out.

My fear is that if I keep rejecting perfectly decent women, there’s no guarantee that better women will be available to me later.

Plus, life isn’t always all about me, and I want my family to be happy and see me married.

My question is, is it wise advice that the only thing that matters is that she has a good attitude and is a good mother?

Are those two things (besides shared faith) all that matter in dating, and therefore should I settle and not seek most of what I want in a woman?

I feel happier for moving back to California, but good women are still rare to find. I am still intimidated by the beautiful women (who are often already in relationships anyway), but 14 of the last 15 women I’ve asked out have rejected me after 0-3 dates.

 

[Gordon_Sims]

I’m sorry but your post sounds a bit shallow and misogynistic. You’re rejecting women because their looks don’t live up to your ideal. “She’s acceptable but doesn’t stand out.” What exactly are you waiting for? And how do you know that if you started seeing one of these nearly despicable sub-par women that you won’t find that every other thing about her is exactly what you’re looking for? Is finding a perfect match personality-wise who only has better than average looks such a horrible fate? Who are you most worried about disappointing if you don’t have a piece of eye candy to flash around town? And if you do find that perfect ten (looks-wise, who cares about personality?), what are you going to do in a few years when she gets that first wrinkle or gray hair? Trade her in on a newer model?

Years ago I went out with a girl who, based on her looks, wasn’t someone I ever would have asked out under normal circumstances, or even most extraordinary circumstances. Without dwelling on those circumstances, she was a friend and her mother asked me to ask her out. We went out with friends a few times then on a couple actual dates. Except for her looks, I found that we were a near perfect match in every other way. The despicable, abusive piece of garbage who brought about the circumstances that led to me asking her out came back into the picture and we quit seeing each other. Had that not happened, there’s a good possibility we’d have stayed together and been quite happy. Thankfully, I found my wife and my friend left that jerk and found someone almost two-thirds as good as me so she’s has a good life. The point is, get over yourself and quit worrying about the sizzle; it’s the steak that matters.

 

[Ms_Manners]

I don’t think you should settle in marriage as long as looks are the most important factor you want in a woman.
Honestly, that is shallow and immature and not a good foundation for a happy and longlasting marriage.

 

[Xantippe]

I’m writing because I am being pressured again left and right.

My coworkers, and now my parents, are telling me that they agree with my friend, who said that the only thing that matters in a woman is that she has a good attitude and she is a good mother to her children.

Most people I share that advice with, agree with it.

Well, it’s not the only thing that you need in a wife, but it is the only thing that your parents need in a daughter-in-law.

“All flowers wilt as they get old,” says my dad. “Average looks is all you need,” says my mom. “You can get married if you aren’t so picky,” says my boss.

**Average is pretty good.

Also, I suspect that 4 times out of 5, your pretty girls are actually the average ones plus nicer clothes and more time spent on hair and makeup. I suspect that as a long-time single guy, you aren’t that familiar with the backstage effort that goes into effecting that transformation.
**

Today I texted my uncle Merry Christmas, and he writes back saying that he hopes all my New Year’s wishes come true, and that he hopes I get married next year. Who says that on Christmas? A few weeks ago, when I spoke to my grandma on the phone, she also said she hopes I get married next year.

The pressure is everywhere.

Sorry about that. I bet they think they’re being "helpful."

Today I got a Christmas gift… a setup date tomorrow. I looked on Facebook, and as I predicted, she is average looking to me. She has a career and likely has all the other good qualities, like emotional and economic stability. Her appearance is acceptable, but it doesn’t stand out.

**A lot of people are much more attractive than their photos (or less attractive) in person. You may find yourself much more attracted to her in real life.

So, definitely go and keep an open mind. **

My fear is that if I keep rejecting perfectly decent women, there’s no guarantee that better women will be available to me later.

Plus, life isn’t always all about me, and I want my family to be happy and see me married.

But, you do owe it to a prospective spouse to think that she’s way better than average and the right person for you.

My question is, is it wise advice that the only thing that matters is that she has a good attitude and is a good mother?

Are those two things (besides shared faith) all that matter in dating, and therefore should I settle and not seek most of what I want in a woman?

**I think you should spend more time getting to know women. As you get to know them better, lots of other important personality traits will emerge that are of at least equal importance.

As I recall, you’ve recently had trouble getting past two dates with the same person. Maybe just get to know people, have fun, develop your interests, and don’t be immediately marriage minded? You can start thinking about marriage once you have an exclusive relationship, but I think you’re being premature and should let things develop more organically.
**
I feel happier for moving back to California, but good women are still rare to find. I am still intimidated by the beautiful women (who are often already in relationships anyway), but 14 of the last 15 women I’ve asked out have rejected me after 0-3 dates.

Great! You’ve gotten to 3 dates. That’s 50% improvement over your last report. That suggests that your initial presentation is pretty good–presumably, either there’s some basic incompatibility or you are unconsciously doing or saying something repellent.

I would suggest finding somebody to coach you on your personal presentation, as well as looking at more general dating advice. Not PUA stuff–I would suggest looking at women’s dating horror stories and see if you might be accidentally committing some no-nos. I’m not sure if a therapist would be the right person for this, but I suspect you probably need some coaching on being relaxed and fun on dates (rather than super intense and focused) and practicing good social skills and not giving off a “you are the last breeding human female on earth” desperation vibes. A standard therapist or psychologist would be able to coach you on relaxation techniques.

Best wishes!

 

[MJJean]

Never settle. Ever. You just end up with a boatload of resentment and hurt feelings on both sides when you settle.

When I was thinking of my perfect match I wanted a man with intelligence, a sense of humor, who was physically attractive to me (Which isn’t just looks…its chemistry, too. Some “hot” men leave me cold and some not hot men can be amazingly attractive) who shared my values and who had enough in common we’d get along, but also had enough not in common so we could grow and learn from each other.

Keep looking until you find the right match for you, but remember that the right match (including physical chemistry) may come in a different package than you expected.

 

[Xantippe]

Never settle. Ever. You just end up with a boatload of resentment and hurt feelings on both sides when you settle.

When I was thinking of my perfect match I wanted a man with intelligence, a sense of humor, was physically attractive to me (Which isn’t just looks…its chemistry, too. Some “hot” men leave me cold and some not hot men can be amazingly attractive) who shared my values and who had enough in common we’d get along, but also had enough not in common so we could grow and learn from each other.

Keep looking until you find the right match for you, but remember that the right match (including physical chemistry) may come in a different package than you expected.

Yes!

 

[MJJean]

.
Keep looking until you find the right match for you, but remember that the right match (including physical chemistry) may come in a different package than you expected.

I kind of feel weird quoting myself, but I wanted to add some personal experience.

I adore my DH. It’s been 15 years since we became a couple and 12 since we married. We’ve had our ups and some serious downs, but I can honestly say I love him as totally and passionately now as I did then.

That said, he is not what I imagined when I thought about “The One”. He’s chubbier than I thought he would be. He’s socially awkward. He’s not a “manly man”. He’s kind of a nerd, actually. He has zero fashion sense. And there are some common sense things that he just doesn’t get. He’s also completely helpless around the house and when he tries to help I end up having to go back over what he’s done and do it “right”.

Everyone in my family disapproved. My dad being the loudest. Over the years friends and family I hadn’t seen in a while always said something along the lines of “He’s not the kind of guy I thought you’d end up with…” when they met DH. Yeah, me either!

And yet we have a great relationship. We click. Our individual crazy meshes very well, rofl. He’s been a wonderful husband and father. Heck, when he’s at work I miss him and I still do silly things like smell his shirts when I’m doing laundry. I can’t imagine a life without him.

But, yeah, when I was imagining my mate I certainly never imagined a man like DH. And I met him in an unlikely place, too. So meet women (even if their online pics aren’t that exciting). Take them out. Be open. You, too, might find your match in an unlikely place or an unlikely body.

 

[Magdalen2013]

OP – as long as your attitude is “it’s all about that face” you are never going to find a wife.

It’s the content of her character – is she kind to others, does she share your values – not how well she fills out a bikini that matters.

And that line about “settling” – honey, just how much of a prince are you? What have you done to make yourself the kind of fellow a woman would be happy to be with – it’s a two way street, but you sound like you’re hogging the center lane.

Ignore your family’s pressure – listening them and letting them push you into a marriage, any marriage is a one way street headed for divorce court.

Instead of hunting in the on-line matrimony market, how about getting active with some of your parishes activities? The lady you’re looking for may be there.

 

[Xantippe]

The Supremes and Phil Collins advise, “You can’t hurry love”:

youtube.com/watch?v=7ltKNE5j50M

 

[CaliLobo]

OP – as long as your attitude is “it’s all about that face” you are never going to find a wife.

It’s the content of her character – is she kind to others, does she share your values – not how well she fills out a bikini that matters.

And that line about “settling” – honey, just how much of a prince are you? What have you done to make yourself the kind of fellow a woman would be happy to be with – it’s a two way street, but you sound like you’re hogging the center lane.

Ignore your family’s pressure – listening them and letting them push you into a marriage, any marriage is a one way street headed for divorce court.

Instead of hunting in the on-line matrimony market, how about getting active with some of your parishes activities? The lady you’re looking for may be there.

I’m not all about that bass, treble, or face. And the girl I used to see didn’t wear bikinis, but I still thought she was gorgeous.

Did I ever say looks are the only thing I care about? I too care about the match. I’ve dated fat women before. I get knee-jerk reactions that I’m shallow, misogynistic, and entitled.

In the Christian circle we are taught that beauty is a shallow, worldly thing, and that we should feel guilty about seeking beauty.

Other Christian people I know marry the one that is gorgeous to them and is a good match… were they so wrong?

I’ve noticed that it’s the not-so-pretty women that complain that men are shallow and preach that beauty is sinful. How’s that for misogynistic.

Anyways…she looked better than I thought, we match and understand each other, but there’s no need for me to make a final decision today.

My fear is that better women won’t come along later if I reject the ones I meet now.

 

[1ke]

My coworkers, and now my parents, are telling me that they agree with my friend, who said that the only thing that matters in a woman is that she has a good attitude and she is a good mother to her children.

I don’t know why anyone would say that these are the “only” things that matter. There are many things that matter. Character is certainly #1, but there are others.

All flowers wilt as they get old," says my dad. “Average looks is all you need,” says my mom. “You can get married if you aren’t so picky,” says my boss.

These sorts of unsolicited comments may be on to something if you are indeed “so picky”. Being “picky” could point to underlying issues. I’ve known several otherwise successful men who were “so picky” that they found ridiculous faults in beautiful, successful, nice women. Their own issues and fears of commitment manifested in finding ways to drive these women away or break up with them.

My fear is that if I keep rejecting perfectly decent women, there’s no guarantee that better women will be available to me later.

If they are “perfectly decent” why are you rejecting them?

And, you are very correct there is no guarantee “better women” will come along. The older you get, the fewer women will come along, actually.

Plus, life isn’t always all about me, and I want my family to be happy and see me married.

You should marry because you are called to the vocation of marriage and no other reason. Marrying because your family wants you to be married is the worst reason to do so and will rain down misery on you and your chosen spouse.

My question is, is it wise advice that the only thing that matters is that she has a good attitude and is a good mother?

No. Those are not the "only’ qualities I would look for.

Neither is it wise to be so picky that you cannot see the really good qualities in a person because of superficial flaws.

should I settle and not seek most of what I want in a woman?

What is it that you want in a woman?

but good women are still rare to find.

Define “good woman”. That will give us a better idea of what you are talking about.

 

[BrassAnkles]

Sometimes God want us to look beyond what society tells us is attractive. For example I grew up in a racist area where blond hair and blue eyed women were considered the most attractive, but I always like dark eyes like what my great aunt had who I loved very much. Therefore, don’t be afraid to date outside of your “race”.

 

[EasterJoy]

The advice I’d give you is the same response I’d give to the people pressuring you: Why are you jumping right to hopes of getting married? Of course you aren’t going to be ready to jump into marriage with someone you barely know. Of course you’re going to be “picky” about who you date, if you think agreeing to date is automatically a path straight to marriage.

How about this? How about you just go out and date some women who don’t fail on any of your non-negotiables–if you do not want to marry a non-Catholic, I would not wish it on you to fall in love with one–and see what happens?

Of course you want your heart to beat a little faster for a woman before you marry her, but I would point this out: When I read accounts of people married for 50 years, they very often didn’t see each other as anything particularly thrilling when they first met! Sometimes, yes, but sometimes they only warmed up to each other later. Only later do you know a person’s personality so well that it not only makes their looks irrelevant but changes your whole idea of what a desirable woman looks like! It happens all of the time.

Let go of your anxiety to marry, and tone down your expectations to finding women that might find you interesting company. Maybe you marry one, maybe you don’t. Maybe she finds you a nice guy, but not for her, and she introduces you to somebody. Get out there and date, be honest and treat the women you spend time with with the respect and gratitude they deserve for spending time with you. That’s enough for one day. Worry about the next days when they come. “Do not worry about tomorrow; tomorrow will take care of itself.” (Matt.6;34). Women are not put off by men who say, “Marriage? Why don’t we see if we *like *each other first?” That is far more sensible.

 

[Indigo_Cardinal]

I’m just wildly curious how good-looking you must be. I can only imagine that you must make the likes of Brad Pitt and George Clooney look butt-ugly if you think you can demand only the best-looking women.

Why, yes, that was sarcasm.

You’re not finding a wife because the women you’re meeting up with are above-average enough to know they deserve better than you.

 

[CaliLobo]

I’m just wildly curious how good-looking you must be. I can only imagine that you must make the likes of Brad Pitt and George Clooney look butt-ugly if you think you can demand only the best-looking women.

Why, yes, that was sarcasm.

You’re not finding a wife because the women you’re meeting up with are above-average enough to know they deserve better than you.

That was inappropriate.

 

[Xantippe]

Other Christian people I know marry the one that is gorgeous to them and is a good match… were they so wrong?

**“Gorgeous to them” is the key. It would be sad if you married someone because she was gorgeous to other people, but not to you.
**

I’ve noticed that it’s the not-so-pretty women that complain that men are shallow and preach that beauty is sinful. How’s that for misogynistic.

**Really? I don’t run into that in normal life.

I think people do lift eyebrows hard, though, when a guy is demanding something from women that he isn’t able to offer himself and isn’t willing to exert the same amount of effort for himself that he wants from her. If he isn’t super athletic, but wants a girlfriend with the sort of figure you get from living at the gym, if he has no self-control around food, but wants a thin girlfriend, etc. That makes people point and laugh. **

Anyways…she looked better than I thought, we match and understand each other, but there’s no need for me to make a final decision today.

**Yay!
**

My fear is that better women won’t come along later if I reject the ones I meet now.

When the right one comes along, you won’t even think about “better women.”

 

[Xantippe]

The advice I’d give you is the same response I’d give to the people pressuring you: Why are you jumping right to hopes of getting married? Of course you aren’t going to be ready to jump into marriage with someone you barely know. Of course you’re going to be “picky” about who you date, if you think agreeing to date is automatically a path straight to marriage.

How about this? How about you just go out and date some women who don’t fail on any of your non-negotiables–if you do not want to marry a non-Catholic, I would not wish it on you to fall in love with one–and see what happens?

Of course you want your heart to beat a little faster for a woman before you marry her, but I would point this out: When I read accounts of people married for 50 years, they very often didn’t see each other as anything particularly thrilling when they first met! Sometimes, yes, but sometimes they only warmed up to each other later. Only later do you know a person’s personality so well that it not only makes their looks irrelevant but changes your whole idea of what a desirable woman looks like! It happens all of the time.

Let go of your anxiety to marry, and tone down your expectations to finding women that might find you interesting company. Maybe you marry one, maybe you don’t. Maybe she finds you a nice guy, but not for her, and she introduces you to somebody. Get out there and date, be honest and treat the women you spend time with with the respect and gratitude they deserve for spending time with you. That’s enough for one day. Worry about the next days when they come. “Do not worry about tomorrow; tomorrow will take care of itself.” (Matt.6;34). Women are not put off by men who say, “Marriage? Why don’t we see if we *like *each other first?” That is far more sensible.

Yes!

 

[EasterJoy]

I’m just wildly curious how good-looking you must be. I can only imagine that you must make the likes of Brad Pitt and George Clooney look butt-ugly if you think you can demand only the best-looking women.

Why, yes, that was sarcasm.

You’re not finding a wife because the women you’re meeting up with are above-average enough to know they deserve better than you.

Perhaps the OP only means women he finds exciting merely by looking at them, and thinks he’ll find someone who immediately makes him feel as if he were a groom the first time he lays eyes on her. Some people are naive, and do not realize that most people become a lot “better-looking” after you get to know them and appreciate them than they looked when they were total strangers.

This is even true of actors and actresses. Some became much “better-looking” with the help of an introduction to the public that a movie or TV role gave them. Others seemed like “dreams” when they were models, but seemed wooden and uninteresting when they were presented as actors and actresses on-screen. Maybe in person, they seem warm and wonderful, but putting them on the spot to act makes them less attractive.

I have heard that Marilyn Monroe could go out in public and not even be recognized, if she chose to dress and act in unremarkable ways. If she chose to “turn it on” and “be Her,” then all of a sudden her fans would recognize her.

If you think about it, you know that you also know people who “light up” around those who make them feel safe and socially engaged, whereas they might even seem forbidding around strangers when they don’t have their personal “it” turned on. You really have to get to know people before you can tell if you’re going to find them attractive in an enduring way. A naive person does not know this, and thinks that an “attractive” man or woman will be just as attractive under all circumstances. It does not work like that.

 

[Xantippe]

Perhaps the OP only means women he finds exciting merely by looking at them, and thinks he’ll find someone who immediately makes him feel as if he were a groom the first time he lays eyes on her. Some people are naive, and do not realize that most people become a lot “better-looking” after you get to know them and appreciate them than they looked when they were total strangers.

This is even true of actors and actresses. Some became much “better-looking” with the help of an introduction to the public that a movie or TV role gave them. Others seemed like “dreams” when they were models, but seemed wooden and uninteresting when they were presented as actors and actresses on-screen. Maybe in person, they seem warm and wonderful, but putting them on the spot to act makes them less attractive.

I have heard that Marilyn Monroe could go out in public and not even be recognized, if she chose to dress and act in unremarkable ways. If she chose to “turn it on” and “be Her,” then all of a sudden her fans would recognize her.

If you think about it, you know that you also know people who “light up” around those who make them feel safe and socially engaged, whereas they might even seem forbidding around strangers when they don’t have their personal “it” turned on. You really have to get to know people before you can tell if you’re going to find them attractive in an enduring way. A naive person does not know this, and thinks that an “attractive” man or woman will be just as attractive under all circumstances. It does not work like that.

Yes!

I was actually looking for pictures of Marilyn Monroe when thinking about this thread and she didn’t even look like Marilyn Monroe when she had brown hair, wasn’t wearing makeup, etc.

 

[Dulcie]

OP, I think you should focus less on strange women’s looks and more on what you can offer to women. What can you do to make yourself a more desirable marriage partner?