Pants! ...and my pride

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jmcrae said:
Sorry, but I have never in my whole life seen a whore that wore pants. They wear dresses, because dresses attract men for sex.

The “problem” with pants is that they make women look gender-neutral - not sexy.
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You never saw a prostitute in what we used to call HOT PANTS? Or tight pants that showed her anatomy? Or Daisy Dukes?
You have not been in the same cities I have then.

IMHO if you are at a Traditional mass, “no pants”.
If you are at an NO, they don’t seem to have a problem with it.
I never wear slacks, pants, or trousers. I wear skirts and tops. It is I have discovered cooler in the summer. In the winter I wear tights and boots. So for me it is warmer in the winter.
I can ride horses, garden, baby sit gran kids, cook, paint, lay carpet…you name it I can and have probably done it in a skirt.
 
SwizzleStick said:
I am incredulous. If I am understanding this thread correctly, there are folks who believe that the act of a woman wearing slacks or shorts instead of a skirt or dress is a sin? Is that correct? If that is so, then in their opinion, I’ve been sinning nearly every day for the past ten years or so since it has probably been about that long since I’ve regularly worn a skirt or dress and I’ve sinned since by simply getting dressed in the morning? Do I understand that correctly? If that is so and my understanding is correct, I am incredulous. Wow. That is just…well, a very odd concept to me.
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You seem to understand correctly. We all agree that crossdressing is a sin (I think). The question that needs to be but has not been definitively answered is whether pants are an item of men’s clothing, or women’s, or both. It may seem strange, but c’est la vie…

Pax.
 
Mater said:
Marfan, regarding the long underwear:

I wear long underwear under my skirts and pants from Sept. to May. Yes, it shows. It’s black, slightly baggy, very cozy. I walk to Mass and find skirts with long johns underneath actually warmer than pants - all that trapped air. And interestingly, I find all that swishy air around legs in summer to be cooler. I’m not saying what you should do, but this is what works for me.
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Mater: that sounds so frumpy!!! And what if you have to break into a fast run??? Mad dog or coyote is chasing you, on the way to church–the long skirt is gonna slow you down… I think that we should ask the priest in the OP if this is OK–to wear our long underwear underneath our skirts and have it hanging out instead of leg skin.

BTW, I have a friend who has some ugly scarring on one of her lower legs from an accident. She never wears skirts, dresses or shorts–only long pants. Should she have to wear a skirt to church for this priest–or is she exempt because it would cause her distress to reveal her wounds for public inspection?.
 
JSSebastianoP said:
You seem to understand correctly. We all agree that crossdressing is a sin (I think). The question that needs to be but has not been definitively answered is whether pants are an item of men’s clothing, or women’s, or both. It may seem strange, but c’est la vie…

Pax.
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I have no problem with the idea that pants are an acceptable item of clothing for either sex, so perhaps that is why I am so surprised by the idea that a woman wearing pants is sinful. A tunic or robe type of garment was a proper item of clothing in Biblical times for either sex, so I see no reason why that isn’t true of pants in our times as well.
 
adstrinity said:
I understand the reasons for skirts in the past, a woman could squat and pee, but, modernly, a dress is much more cumbersome what with the invention of indoor plumbing.
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This never occured to me!!! This is why they invented dresses!!! Makes total sense!!! So the function of the dress in societies that have plumbing is obsolete!!! We are wearing dresses now just out of habit and tradition, and they serve no valuable function unless you are in the woods and need to pee.
 
slyboots said:
I can ride horses, garden, baby sit gran kids, cook, paint, lay carpet…you name it I can and have probably done it in a skirt.
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You would definitely have a problem wearing a skirt if you were an astronaut.
 
SwizzleStick said:
I have no problem with the idea that pants are an acceptable item of clothing for either sex, so perhaps that is why I am so surprised by the idea that a woman wearing pants is sinful. A tunic or robe type of garment was a proper item of clothing in Biblical times for either sex, so I see no reason why that isn’t true of pants in our times as well.
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It’s that women didn’t really start wearing pants in the western world until recently and many people can still remember a time before that so they define pants as men’s clothes. If pants were defined by the Church to be men’s clothes then it would be a sin for a woman to wear them. The problem is that we live in a time of transition with various people defining it differently for themselves and no official Church teaching.

Pax.
 
Should female converts go out and buy a new wardrobe?

“Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes.” Henry David Thoreau
 
Marfran said:
THIS IS FABULOUS!!! This should put an end to this discussion.
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How so? How would you answer the question about “have you ever seen the Virgin Mary wearing pants?” I think it can possibly help one side of the argument but this photo is far from putting an end to the discussion. 😦
And, while saints were on earth they were people, capable of sin. In the very least, this just proves that a woman who wore pants can become a saint. Perhaps when she went through purgatory she was punished for crossdressing; perhaps GOD did not view it as crossdressing - who knows? I just don’t view it as the definitive proof we’re all looking for to end the debate one way or the other. It certainly helps strengthen the case for wearing pants but it is not definitive.

Pax.
 
Marfran said:
THIS IS FABULOUS!!! This should put an end to this discussion.
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She’s not at Mass. That was where this all started. Wearing pants to a traditional Mass…

Your friend with the scarring is not the only only with unattractive legs shall we say. Skirts cover that as well in my experience.
As for being an astronaut? Doesn’t sound appealing to me as I obviously wear skirts so I can go around urinating in fields. 😛
 
Interesting topic. I have no answers, but thought I would simply comment that I’ve always thought pants were MORE modest than skirts (unless tight pants). I can understand how important gender roles are, and I can appreciate the fact that the evil one is hard at work trying to blur sexuality. I’m not sure, though, that pants/skirts are their chosen battle tactics.

Also, priests, altar boys, and monks practically wear dresses!

Somehow I think Satan is using this as a distraction. The jews of old were always concerned with little things like this, and often were so distracted with the little things that they overlooked the larger.

Even if it does have truth in it, it would be a very MINOR thing compared to all the other problems we have. Not saying we shouldn’t be aware of it, or disregard it, but seems to be low on the list. It is likely more of an effect of the blurred gender roles, rather than the cause of blurring roles itself.

My advice, like in all things, don’t dwell on it - but do remember it in your prayers for a while. See what God reveals. Christ loves that you go to Mass, and knows your intentions. Don’t lose sleep over it.

Again, that is just my opinion. I could be wrong. 🤷😃

Kevin
 
I don’t think the priest differentiated if skirts should be worn exclusively at Mass. I was under the impression that women who wear pants, especially in but, not limited to, Mass, are immodest. The priest made a point along the same lines of, where is the dignity befitting to the female’s gender, by doing a construction job or another male’s job. When he kept giving examples, “Father, I can be a construction worker!” “So what?”

Yes, this is a thread of are pants, in and of themselves, immoral/immodest on women? AND, is it a sin to wear them anywear, especially but not limited to, Mass. Yes, that’s really what this thread is about. I never thought I’d question pants.
 
adstrinity said:
I don’t think the priest differentiated if skirts should be worn exclusively at Mass. I was under the impression that women who wear pants, especially in but, not limited to, Mass, are immodest. The priest made a point along the same lines of, where is the dignity befitting to the female’s gender, by doing a construction job or another male’s job. When he kept giving examples, “Father, I can be a construction worker!” “So what?”

Yes, this is a thread of are pants, in and of themselves, immoral/immodest on women? AND, is it a sin to wear them anywear, especially but not limited to, Mass. Yes, that’s really what this thread is about. I never thought I’d question pants.
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Any pants can be modest/immodest depending on various factors in and of themselves. The question is more specifically whether women wearing pants are committing the sin of crossdressing. There are various answers but that is the question.

Pax.
 
JSSebastianoP said:
Any pants can be modest/immodest depending on various factors in and of themselves. The question is more specifically whether women wearing pants are committing the sin of crossdressing. There are various answers but that is the question.

Pax.
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I think, we can in our own lives, discover the differences simply by wearing different clothing. And while there is more to this than just that… or rather, there is the interior mental harm from dressing one way or another, besides the spiritual effects (which can be subtle but harmful) which can be more or less depending how overtly the psychology of a person is dependent on dressing like the opposite gender… also…

If wearing pants is not cross-dressing, what exactly -is- cross dressing for a woman, to dress like a man? Does it, effectively, even exist?

For a man we -know- what cross dressing is. He puts on a dress. 🙂
 
I think slacks are gender neutral, like shoes are…I think that if the Pope felt our souls were in danger by wearing pants he would be the first to tell us not to

Some of this stuff is just personal taste, and we are all adults and should dress modestly and neat and clean…Other people can tell me how to dress when they pay my bills
 
Shin said:
If wearing pants is not cross-dressing, what exactly -is- cross dressing for a woman, to dress like a man? Does it, effectively, even exist?

For a man we -know- what cross dressing is. He puts on a dress. 🙂
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cross-dressing is a mental disorder, and has to do with either wanting to associate oneself with the other gender, or with the thrill of breaking socially defined lines (breaking the “taboo”).

my wife wears jeans all the time, with cute embroidery designs and sequins. certainly not trying to associate herself with being male, or break any social taboo there.

another random thought, looking at paintings from medieval times, men wore tights and frilly things that would be considered totally feminine nowadays.

i think this priest is WAY out of line, equating pants with sodomy? what a flipping wacko. and seeing all the traditionalists that agree with him is even more reason for me not to attend an EF ever again.
 
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