Papal prophecy and the 'final Pope' Petrus Romanus

[Rex_Regorum]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes

I had a quick scan of the ‘next Pope’ thread and this didn’t seem to be discussed. Perhaps not many people are aware of it? Then again maybe they are, I am a recent convert.

The Prophecy of the Popes, attributed to Saint Malachy, is a list of 112 short phrases in Latin. They purport to describe each of the Roman Catholic popes (along with a few anti-popes), beginning with Pope Celestine II (elected in 1143) and concluding with a pope described in the prophecy as “Peter the Roman”, whose pontificate will end in the destruction of the city of Rome.

…]

The longest and final motto reads:
In the original Latin:

In p̲secutione extrema S.R.E. ſedebit. Petrus Romanus, qui paſcet oues in multis tribulationibus: quibus tranſactis ciuitas ſepticollis diruetur, & Iudex tremẽdus iudicabit populum ſuum. Finis.

This is usually translated into English as:
“During the final persecution of the Holy Roman Church, the seat will be occupied by
Peter the Roman, who will feed his sheep in many tribulations:
and when these things are finished, the city of seven hills will be destroyed,
and the formidable Judge will judge His people.
The End.”

It is believed by some that our current Pope fulfils the prophecy of the penultimate Pope in the list. In other words, if our next Pope, or at least the Pope after him is this ‘Peter the Roman,’ the prophecy will be true and we will be living in End Times.

What are the thoughts of the forum on this? Has it been discussed loads of times before and this thread is pointless. Probably. >.<

 

[MarkThompson]

It’s been discussed, because people love believing in stuff like this even though it’s about as meaningful as the Mayan 2012 prophecy. FWIW, this prophecy is an almost certain forgery, first attested some four centuries after St. Malachy’s death. I’m waiting with bated breath for the next pope, who doubtless will not be Roman or named Peter, and I’m especially anxious for the installation of the next pope after him, because I’m dying to hear the explanations: we miscounted, he’s not really a pope at all, etc. It’ll be classic. See you on January 1, 2013.

 

[diggerdomer]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes

I had a quick scan of the ‘next Pope’ thread and this didn’t seem to be discussed. Perhaps not many people are aware of it? Then again maybe they are, I am a recent convert.

It is believed by some that our current Pope fulfils the prophecy of the penultimate Pope in the list. In other words, if our next Pope, or at least the Pope after him is this ‘Peter the Roman,’ the prophecy will be true and we will be living in End Times.

What are the thoughts of the forum on this? Has it been discussed loads of times before and this thread is pointless. Probably. >.<

Nonsense

 

[Chatter163]

I remember back in the early eighties, when Ven. John Paul II was called the penultimate Pope, according to the same list.

 

[MerryCatholic]

i also believe there are no popes ever named peter. correct me if iam wrong please?

 

[Beth_Martin]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes

I had a quick scan of the ‘next Pope’ thread and this didn’t seem to be discussed. Perhaps not many people are aware of it? Then again maybe they are, I am a recent convert.

It is believed by some that our current Pope fulfils the prophecy of the penultimate Pope in the list. In other words, if our next Pope, or at least the Pope after him is this ‘Peter the Roman,’ the prophecy will be true and we will be living in End Times.

What are the thoughts of the forum on this? Has it been discussed loads of times before and this thread is pointless. Probably. >.<

I have not shared this before, except with close family, but as a child, ages 6-8, when Pope Johon Paul II was in order I felt or knew there were only one more Pope after Him before Jesus comes for the church, then one Pope ofter that before the Popehood came to an end. Interesting their is a phrophecy that gives the number of Popes and meets to the exact number the remaining Popes - I know it sounds real crazy which is why I rarely speak of it, but seeing how fast we are moving toward a one-world governemnet and how people are becoming more religious, which means we can see the one world religion followinging the heels of the one world government. If this is so and Pope Benedict is 83, the the cathing away of the church is not far away and shortly thereafter the return of Christ would follow shortly thereafter.

I do not believe; pretty sure of it, this is not part of any Catholic doctrine; I’m just sharing something that started or came to me from early childhood without any religious influences. Probably just a myth and certainly cannot be proven unless it were to come to pass. I hope I did not offend anyone; if I did I am truly sorry.

Beth

 

[unafraid]

I remember back in the early eighties, when Ven. John Paul II was called the penultimate Pope, according to the same list.

Since Pope Benedict is still alive, and as of this moment no pope has been named successor, to discount this prediction is premature (that scenario is still plausible). Also, to claim with certainty that the claims of St. Malachy are “nonsense”, prior to the date when said proclamation can be factually deemed as such, one assumes the mantle of “prophet” themselves.

Time unfolds, truth reveals itself and the future becomes the present, ready to be commented upon with some clarity. Personally, I withold judgement in these matters. I never would have imagined that a sex abuse crisis would ravage our Church, even now I am still shocked, and dumbfounded by what has happened. I am not sage enough to debunk anything. I just watch and wait.

 

[thistle]

Since Pope Benedict is still alive, and as of this moment no pope has been named successor, to discount this prediction is premature (that scenario is still plausible). Also, to claim with certainty that the claims of St. Malachy are “nonsense”, prior to the date when said proclamation can be factually deemed as such, one assumes the mantle of “prophet” themselves.

Time unfolds, truth reveals itself and the future becomes the present, ready to be commented upon with some clarity. Personally, I withold judgement in these matters. I never would have imagined that a sex abuse crisis would ravage our Church, even now I am still shocked, and dumbfounded by what has happened. I am not sage enough to debunk anything. I just watch and wait.

The Malachi prophecies are forgeries written long after the death of St Malachi so yes they are nonsense.

 

[Rascalking]

Keep in mind that Jesus Himself didn’t know the time and place for the end of the world.

I’m fairly certian that if Jesus didn’t know, St. Malachy didn’t either.

 

[gerardw]

Amidst the the end times theories, prophecies, etc. some may forget that we should be continually prepared for the Master’s return, whenever it may be. So we should continue to follow Jesus’ commandments to love the Lord our God with all our heart, soul, body, and mind and to lover others as ourselves. We should also be witnesses to the faith and make disciples of all nations, through love and charity. My 2 cents, however simplistic it may be…

 

[Victorious]

i also believe there are no popes ever named peter. correct me if iam wrong please?

Just the first one!

I have not shared this before, except with close family, but as a child, ages 6-8, when Pope Johon Paul II was in order I felt or knew there were only one more Pope after Him before Jesus comes for the church, then one Pope ofter that before the Popehood came to an end. Interesting their is a phrophecy that gives the number of Popes and meets to the exact number the remaining Popes - I know it sounds real crazy which is why I rarely speak of it, but seeing how fast we are moving toward a one-world governemnet and how people are becoming more religious, which means we can see the one world religion followinging the heels of the one world government. If this is so and Pope Benedict is 83, the the cathing away of the church is not far away and shortly thereafter the return of Christ would follow shortly thereafter.

I do not believe; pretty sure of it, this is not part of any Catholic doctrine; I’m just sharing something that started or came to me from early childhood without any religious influences. Probably just a myth and certainly cannot be proven unless it were to come to pass. I hope I did not offend anyone; if I did I am truly sorry.

You are right: that is a myth and is no part of Catholic doctrine. The Church will never die out of the world, and neither will the papacy.

Since Pope Benedict is still alive, and as of this moment no pope has been named successor, to discount this prediction is premature (that scenario is still plausible). Also, to claim with certainty that the claims of St. Malachy are “nonsense”, prior to the date when said proclamation can be factually deemed as such, one assumes the mantle of “prophet” themselves.

Time unfolds, truth reveals itself and the future becomes the present, ready to be commented upon with some clarity. Personally, I withold judgement in these matters. I never would have imagined that a sex abuse crisis would ravage our Church, even now I am still shocked, and dumbfounded by what has happened. I am not sage enough to debunk anything. I just watch and wait.

This is not open-mindedness, but an abdication of reason. It is possible to evaluate these alleged prophecies in the light of reason and sense. It is noteworthy, for instance, that these “prophecies” did not surface until hundreds of years after the death of their purported author. Many of the “prophecies” – particularly the ones that supposedly apply to popes subsequent to 1595 – are vague enough to mean anything you want them to mean; and it takes a great deal of intellectual acrobatics to match them up with the popes they are alleged to refer to. The one that is supposed to go with JPII, for instance (“de labore solis”) is so obscure as to yield multiple possible explanations. In many cases, the “prophecy” depends on connection with some arcane fact about the pope in question in order to make it fit. If the best interpretation of “de labore solis,” for example, is that JPII was born and buried during a solar eclipse, doesn’t that strike you as being a goofy thing for a prophetic vision to latch onto about the pope who lit the fuse for the destruction of Communism in eastern Europe? Furthermore, if Benedict XVI is really the second-to-last pope, then you have to ask yourself whether the biblical prophecies concerning the End of Time have really all been fulfilled.

Bottom line: I think the purported St. Malachy prophecies are el fakeroo.

 

[Beth_Martin]

Just the first one!

You are right: that is a myth and is no part of Catholic doctrine. The Church will never die out of the world, and neither will the papacy.

I guess Christ won’t be returning to reign on earth for 1000 years when there will be no Pope? I did not know this was Catholic doctrine either.

 

[Beth_Martin]

Amidst the the end times theories, prophecies, etc. some may forget that we should be continually prepared for the Master’s return, whenever it may be. So we should continue to follow Jesus’ commandments to love the Lord our God with all our heart, soul, body, and mind and to lover others as ourselves. ***We should also be witnesses to the faith and make disciples of all nations, through love and charity. *** My 2 cents, however simplistic it may be…

It is an interesting observation; I have had all denominations from JW’s. mormons, Baptist, Penecostal etc and not a single Catholic ever knocked on our door nor have my Catholic neighbors ever really spoke of their faith except to say they are Catholic, but I have never been invited to their church; is this something Catholics are not allowed to do; I am pleading ignorance because I am concerning Catholic doctrine. I have only picked up on a few of the teachings so far. Is this another doctrine that the members do not go door to door sharing their faith?

 

[gerardw]

It is an interesting observation; I have had all denominations from JW’s. mormons, Baptist, Penecostal etc and not a single Catholic ever knocked on our door nor have my Catholic neighbors ever really spoke of their faith except to say they are Catholic, but I have never been invited to their church; is this something Catholics are not allowed to do; I am pleading ignorance because I am concerning Catholic doctrine. I have only picked up on a few of the teachings so far. Is this another doctrine that the members do not go door to door sharing their faith?

I’ve only had JW and mormons knck onmy door, so this may be more of local issue ??
As far as the Cathokic Church, there is no doctrine that I’m aware of the prevents thsi type of door to door evangelization.

As to why your neighbors do not share more can be due to personal reasons, so can not address those. I can address from my own experience. As there is NO doctrine in the Chruch that prevents the faithful from sharing their faith, actually we are encouraged to do so, JP II had called for a renewed evangelization during his pontificate. As for me, when previously in situations, as you’ve encountered, I have either felt inadequate in the knowledge of my faith, thus uncomfortable in sharing it or did not at times want to be perceived as “preacy” in doing so. Happily this is changing for me as I’m “rediscovering” the faith of my birth, (there is a back story here).

I’m interested in your commnet that your are “concerning Catholic doctrine”. Are you looking for a church home? If it hasn’t been done, I invite you to go to the Catholic Church in your area and join an RCIA group. This way you can get your questions about the Catholic Church and her doctirnes answered.

God bless your and I’ll keep you in my prayers.

 

[st_julie]

i also believe there are no popes ever named peter. correct me if iam wrong please?

In a way they are all Peter of Rome

 

[Erin_Anne]

As a previous poster said, we should always be ready.

I trust no one besides God on this issue. Not the alleged Prophecy of St. Malachy, not the Mayans, not Psychics or Wiccans or garden gnomes or anyone else.

If Jesus came back tomorrow, then that would be that. We’d have nothing to worry about aside from whether or not we’re worthy of salvation. That’s the key.

 

[diggerdomer]

i also believe there are no popes ever named peter. correct me if iam wrong please?

Right, no Pope following Peter has taken Peter’s name.

 

[Victorious]

Right, no Pope following Peter has taken Peter’s name.

Except that we do give the Pope the title of “Peter” – because, in a real sense, he is Peter, having taken the place and filled the office of Peter. So “Peter the Roman” is essentially meaningless.

But it is true that no Pope has ever taken Peter as his regnal name.

 

[Beth_Martin]

I’ve only had JW and mormons knck onmy door, so this may be more of local issue ??
As far as the Cathokic Church, there is no doctrine that I’m aware of the prevents thsi type of door to door evangelization.

As to why your neighbors do not share more can be due to personal reasons, so can not address those. I can address from my own experience. As there is NO doctrine in the Chruch that prevents the faithful from sharing their faith, actually we are encouraged to do so, JP II had called for a renewed evangelization during his pontificate. As for me, when previously in situations, as you’ve encountered, I have either felt inadequate in the knowledge of my faith, thus uncomfortable in sharing it or did not at times want to be perceived as “preacy” in doing so. Happily this is changing for me as I’m “rediscovering” the faith of my birth, (there is a back story here).

I’m interested in your commnet that your are “concerning Catholic doctrine”. Are you looking for a church home? If it hasn’t been done, I invite you to go to the Catholic Church in your area and join an RCIA group. This way you can get your questions about the Catholic Church and her doctirnes answered.

God bless your and I’ll keep you in my prayers.

Thanks for the prayers and may God bless you as well!

I came here to meet new people mostly; this forum is the most grounded on the internet that I have seen. What I mean is it has more people participating thanmost if not all. Along the line I have learned some things about Catholic doctrine which is always nice to learn something new. I was in the subsription about the security of salvation (not the exact title - was in apologetics) and was surprised that Catholics doctrine does not teach or believe in the security of a Christian. I have learned a tiny bit about the buddist religion and a few other teachings of the Catholic Church just like you showed above.

I am seeking a new church home, but I do not think Catholicism is for me but only based in little information, but that teaching on security really bothered me, in a sad way, as a Christian I believe the Bible teaches that we are not only able to know, but should know. I understand that this is not what is taught in the Catholic church; so I left the subscription because I could not handle discussing that teaching anymore. No big deal to each there own.

We will see; i never know where the Lord will lead me, but I hope He gets me where I need to be soon. This past weekend I heard one of the worst sermons on the Parable of the soils; the Pastor taught that each soil related to Christians and the soil that doesn’t bear fruit because of the “cares of this world” the Pastor said this is most Christians when in fact only the fourth soil, the one prepared by God, which represents the heart (soil) is the only one that bears fruit. I almost walked out of there. There is no such thing as a non-fruit bearing Christian.

Beth

 

[Holly3278]

I honestly don’t know what to believe about this so called “prophecy”. In a way, I am tempted to believe it but in another way, I am also tempted to disbelieve it. Regardless, the June 1994 issue of “This Rock” addressed the “prophecy” in their Quick Questions section. You can find the relevant question and answer here. It is the third one down:

catholic.com/thisrock/1994/9406qq.asp