Parents' obligation to their Child?

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Why should you also mention this?

Do you believe this is currently a problem? Do you have cause to believe that he would assault someone?

I am sorry to say that it does sound like you simply want to air his dirty laundry.
If I wanted to air his dirty laundry I’ve had plenty of opportunity to do so before now. I’ve said several times that I’ve been giving him the benefit of the doubt, that I wish him well and don’t want to harm his reputation, etc. If you don’t believe me and want to question my motives, that’s fine, but I think that your accusations are in bad faith. After all, if this was my primary motivation, why would I come here and seek advice instead of having already done it by now?

**Edit: My concern is not that he would assault someone directly, but that he is looking to get involved in a relationship with a younger girl through being the teen catechist. I mention the porn because typically porn depicts younger girls, does it not? I’m afraid he may be seeking out this age group to date, and I don’t think this is appropriate.
 
If I wanted to air his dirty laundry I’ve had plenty of opportunity to do so before now. I’ve said several times that I’ve been giving him the benefit of the doubt, that I wish him well and don’t want to harm his reputation, etc. If you don’t believe me and want to question my motives, that’s fine, but I think that your accusations are in bad faith. After all, if this was my primary motivation, why would I come here and seek advice instead of having already done it by now?
No, not always. Many people come here for the okay to do something they have been thinking about. And in fact, some posts have indicated that you should go to the pastor and tell him everything. Which would be quite interesting if the pastor is already aware.

You seem to have some opinions about this young man, that you have made by simply guessing what he may have done. You don’t know what the agreement is between the mother of his child and him. You don’t know if he has signed away his paternal rights. If he is to have no contact with the mother or child. He and his parents may not “have successfully covered up the existence of his daughter.” They may have all agreed, your friend included, that it would be best for everyone to sever contact. Without knowing enough about the situation, you may be pushing something on your friend that she, doesn’t want.
**Edit: My concern is not that he would assault someone directly, but that he is looking to get involved in a relationship with a younger girl through being the teen catechist. I mention the porn because typically porn depicts younger girls, does it not? I’m afraid he may be seeking out this age group to date, and I don’t think this is appropriate.
I don’t know what porn typically depicts. I can say that if he is looking at child porn, by title, would depict children. But child porn is illegal.

I would wonder how you know he is or has been addicted to porn or that he is or was into group sex?

I also wonder how old your friend is. Is she underage? Why would you think he is interested in having a relationship with a child?
 
No, not always. Many people come here for the okay to do something they have been thinking about. And in fact, some posts have indicated that you should go to the pastor and tell him everything. Which would be quite interesting if the pastor is already aware.

You seem to have some opinions about this young man, that you have made by simply guessing what he may have done. You don’t know what the agreement is between the mother of his child and him. You don’t know if he has signed away his paternal rights. If he is to have no contact with the mother or child. He and his parents may not “have successfully covered up the existence of his daughter.” They may have all agreed, your friend included, that it would be best for everyone to sever contact. Without knowing enough about the situation, you may be pushing something on your friend that she, doesn’t want.
I don’t know what porn typically depicts. I can say that if he is looking at child porn, by title, would depict children. But child porn is illegal.

I would wonder how you know he is or has been addicted to porn or that he is or was into group sex?

I also wonder how old your friend is. Is she underage? Why would you think he is interested in having a relationship with a child?
Mary,

Firstly, thanks for your interest in my situation. I really do appreciate your advice, and you taking the time to try and understand what’s going on.

I have received advice from others on this thread to go to the pastor with everything, yes, but I never said that I would or that I was even considering it. I was considering letting DRE know privately and putting it in her hands to act at her discretion in regards to his teaching of teens or letting the pastor know. If you think the action is uncharitable, please do say so and why.

I also have graciously accepted the advice given in this thread as to not try to insert justice into this situation by putting his back into my friend’s life or her daughters. People have made very many good points about that not necessarily being a good solution for anyone involved and having that pointed out to me, I agree wholeheartedly! Maybe I didn’t make that clear enough in my last post and for that, I apologize.

I actually do have very good open line of communication with my friend and I do happen to know that he decided to sever contact from her, which she was very distraught about at the time, but since she has decided not to seek him out for her life anymore since he is clearly unreliable and dishonest. I agree with her and respect that, hence me not mentioning anything to anyone about this, even though my Goddaughter is eight months old.

I believe I’ve qualified my statements about his behavior with statements indicating that he was still practicing these things when he was still with my friend and that he may have amended his ways by now. I’ve already said I’m assuming the best of him several times. I’ve also indicated that I will leave his spiritual well being in the hands of his confessor (although the young man in question was also my friend, so I do worry about him sometimes. I think this is natural, but by no means does this give me a right to “air his dirty laundry” and I also never said that it did).

I should clarify that he has been caught having multiple sexual relationships at once, but not having sex acts with multiple girls at once. As in I know that he’s cheated on his girlfriend(s). I don’t know if he’s had threesomes, I never meant to imply that as it has never crossed my mind that he would do that. I don’t want to imply he was worse than he actually was, so there’s that clarification.

Finally, I would really appreciate if you would tell me if you think it’s appropriate and charitable to approach the DRE privately with this matter, keeping it anonymous at first, and allowing her to take the information and use it at her discretion? If she doesn’t think it’s a safety concern (and surely she would know better than I would) or if she already knows then she can never ask for his name, keep it to herself, and I haven’t defamed his character at all. But even if there is the slightest risk that harm may come to one of the students, should I not say something? Would parents be happy about this if they knew the full situation? Could the DRE face backlash if the scandal broke later? Could my parish face scandal? I would hate it if something happened that I could have prevented.

In spending time questioning my motives, you’re not really helping me discern a moral and charitable course of action. If you really think I should just entirely leave it alone and that there’s no possible harm that could come from that, I encourage you to say so and why. I value your opinion and I’d like to know what you think of the situation, not just what you think of me. Thanks!
 
Finally, I would really appreciate if you would tell me if you think it’s appropriate and charitable to approach the DRE privately with this matter, keeping it anonymous at first, and allowing her to take the information and use it at her discretion? If she doesn’t think it’s a safety concern (and surely she would know better than I would) or if she already knows then she can never ask for his name, keep it to herself, and I haven’t defamed his character at all. But even if there is the slightest risk that harm may come to one of the students, should I not say something? Would parents be happy about this if they knew the full situation? Could the DRE face backlash if the scandal broke later? Could my parish face scandal? I would hate it if something happened that I could have prevented.
No, I would not approach the DRE. I would possibly speak with your pastor. Naming no names. Chances are, he already knows that the man is the father. So once you say something the pastor is going to know of whom you speak. Especially if either your friend or the young man have been to confession. I would mention that you are concerned because of things about this young man, that you have heard. I would not tell him what you have heard. Not unless the pastor asks you for that information.

If the pastor does ask for the information, I would be sure to tell him if you know any of this first hand. (For example, if you heard it from your friend vs. saw it yourself.) I have seen the downfall of a young man because his ex-girlfriend’s friends started talking about him. He hadn’t done what they said, but his ex was out to get him. And there was no way for him to defend himself.
In spending time questioning my motives, you’re not really helping me discern a moral and charitable course of action. If you really think I should just entirely leave it alone and that there’s no possible harm that could come from that, I encourage you to say so and why. I value your opinion and I’d like to know what you think of the situation, not just what you think of me. Thanks!
I believe your motives are part of the discernment process. Don’t you? If your motives are to hurt this man, because he hurt your friend, that brings a whole different perspective to the situation. Same thing if your motives are to knock this family down a peg or two.

I believe that you should seriously examine your motives. Be 100% sure that you are not doing this for your friend, but instead are doing it for the good of the parish. Make sure you truly believe that this man could be a problem. Because right now, from what I have read, it sounds more like you are going on rumor and what happened to your friend.

Think about the fact that in your first post here, you didn’t mention anything about porn or cheating or dating underage girls. You were simply trying to stand up for your Goddaughter. I think this brings up important ideas about your motive.
 
No, I would not approach the DRE. I would possibly speak with your pastor. Naming no names. Chances are, he already knows that the man is the father. So once you say something the pastor is going to know of whom you speak. Especially if either your friend or the young man have been to confession. I would mention that you are concerned because of things about this young man, that you have heard. I would not tell him what you have heard. Not unless the pastor asks you for that information.

If the pastor does ask for the information, I would be sure to tell him if you know any of this first hand. (For example, if you heard it from your friend vs. saw it yourself.) I have seen the downfall of a young man because his ex-girlfriend’s friends started talking about him. He hadn’t done what they said, but his ex was out to get him. And there was no way for him to defend himself.

I believe your motives are part of the discernment process. Don’t you? If your motives are to hurt this man, because he hurt your friend, that brings a whole different perspective to the situation. Same thing if your motives are to knock this family down a peg or two.

I believe that you should seriously examine your motives. Be 100% sure that you are not doing this for your friend, but instead are doing it for the good of the parish. Make sure you truly believe that this man could be a problem. Because right now, from what I have read, it sounds more like you are going on rumor and what happened to your friend.

Think about the fact that in your first post here, you didn’t mention anything about porn or cheating or dating underage girls. You were simply trying to stand up for your Goddaughter. I think this brings up important ideas about your motive.
Mary, thank you!

It’s true that I put the emphasis on being her Godmother first. Please bear in mind that this is my first time posting to the Catholic Answers forum and I struggled with what I should write. I didn’t know what details should be included, what was most important. I have said already that as the thread has gone on I have definitely decided that I need not try and fix his personal problems with my friend and that is no longer the issue here, so I would appreciate it if you would look at all of my statements holistically instead of just looking at your first impression of me.

You’re willing to give this young gentleman the benefit of the doubt, which is very charitable and just of you and I do appreciate that as it gives clarity to both sides of the issue, but I do wish you’d try to do the same with me. As I’ve already said, I’ve not acted on this for quite some time, instead trying to discern the situation with charity and prudence. I’ve not done anything to harm this young man’s reputation. I think I can say with reasonable certainty that I am innocent in this matter so far as I have acted. I came here seeking advice so as to prevent myself from potentially causing further harm. I think I deserve to be treated with the same amount of dignity and charity as someone who has undoubtedly acted wrongly so far.

I will take your advice and spend some time before the Blessed Sacrament this weekend before I take any action at all. I will reflect on what my motives are and I will pray for wisdom, understanding, and for good intentions. Would you say that if someone else had this information and was not so close to his ex-girlfriend and didn’t have possibly questionable motive, that there is a safety issue that would be worth that person bringing it forward (this is a hypothetical, I know of no such person - besides his family and they are not bringing it forward)?

You would advise that I 1. go to the Pastor 2. not name names 3. give facts and 4. identify what I know from what I’ve just been told. Is that an accurate summary of what you think would be best?

Thanks again!
 
I will take your advice and spend some time before the Blessed Sacrament this weekend before I take any action at all. I will reflect on what my motives are and I will pray for wisdom, understanding, and for good intentions. Would you say that if someone else had this information and was not so close to his ex-girlfriend and didn’t have possibly questionable motive, that there is a safety issue that would be worth that person bringing it forward (this is a hypothetical, I know of no such person - besides his family and they are not bringing it forward)?
If someone has first hand information, yes, I would suggest they share it. Second or third hand? No, I wouldn’t take action. Why? Because too often the person doesn’t know the real story.
You would advise that I 1. go to the Pastor 2. not name names 3. give facts and 4. identify what I know from what I’ve just been told. Is that an accurate summary of what you think would be best?
Thanks again!
Yes. I think is it important to be sure that the pastor knows which is which. What you know vs. what you have been told. As the saying goes, “Just the facts, ma’am.”
 
If someone has first hand information, yes, I would suggest they share it. Second or third hand? No, I wouldn’t take action. Why? Because too often the person doesn’t know the real story.
Yes. I think is it important to be sure that the pastor knows which is which. What you know vs. what you have been told. As the saying goes, “Just the facts, ma’am.”
Mary, thank you so much for your advice! You make many good points. Please pray for me.
 
Just wanted to say how appreciative I am that you paused to consider my situation, Deacon Jeff. Your answer has a lot of weight with me! I do have information first hand (from the father directly, as I said he and I also are friends); but it’s simply an admission that the child belongs to him. That in and of itself isn’t really the cause for concern regarding his being a catechist. After all, if one transgression disqualifies you from being a catechist, then we wouldn’t have any at all, right?

Just to be clear, you recommend that since the only hard fact I have from both sides isn’t explicit grounds for alarm and the other details are of dubious authenticity, dated, or otherwise compromised, the threat to the teens in the situation is mostly exaggerated and therefore I should have no reason to be concerned.

Again, thank you!

I will continue to pray for everyone involved, especially my Goddaughter since I have a special obligation to pray for her! If everyone would kindly pray for me, that would be greatly appreciated as well. I really just want to do what is right, but sometimes it’s hard to discern a situation we’re so close to.
 
I think I can do that! That was a very clear answer, thank you.
 
Changed my mind re my first response:
Several things. If you don’t know anything first hand, then the mother of the child is the one to bring it up.
Also, in our parish> We do not allow anyone under the age of 25 to work with teens. It makes the parents and the teens uneasy and opens the parish up fro all kinds of problems. Young girls tend to develop crushes on the leaders if they are in this age group. Seen it happen so often. Attachment, dangerous territory. Period.
Don’t assume the pastor knows anything, people are generally happy to have a warm body volunteering.
But again, I believe it’s something for the mother of the child to approach her confessor about, in private.
If you want to go to the pastor, he will undoubtedly want names, facts, etc.
 
Does he have a moral obligation to his daughter? Of course he does.

Is it your responsibility to make him live up to his obligations? No.

Is this something between the child’s mother and father, that they need to work out? Yes.

Since you can’t know everything about the situation, I would stick to advising your friend to work it out with the child’s father directly- she may have her own reasons for not pushing him to be more involved, as others have mentioned.

However, as the Godmother with a loving concern for the child, the best way to help your Goddaughter is for you to stay personally involved in her life. Provide a good example for her. And keep an eye out for her.

pjmedia.com/lifestyle/2014/06/15/3-studies-about-fatherhood-that-will-shock-you-but-shouldnt/?singlepage=true

According to the studies cited in the above article-

Best outcomes for children:
  1. Intact family,
  2. Shared parental custody,
  3. Paternal custody,
  4. Maternal custody.
Shared parental custody however, assumes two parents truly wanting to raise the kids, be involved in their lives and responsibly take care of them. As you can see, father as the primary custodian ranks above single mothers. Wonder why?

Statistically, the biggest threat to a child is the mother’s boyfriend/new husband. Children of single mother’s are more likely to be sexually/physically abused, become victims/perpetrators of violence, be promiscous, abuse drugs and alcohol. That’s statistics-- that isn’t individual cases. You can help your goddaughter to beat the odds by being part of your friend’s support network and help her avoid situations that may put your goddaughter at risk. My Dad is the finest man I’ve ever known, he was raised by a single mother during the depression in a major city. It can be done, help your friend where you can and let her deal with the father.
 
The young man should have to marry the mother of his child. He has the moral obligation to do so.
Yep, that’s the answer, marry someone who shows no interest in his own child or the mother, the absolute requirements for an awesome life partner. The young woman is better off alone and teaching her child how to be a faithful and loving woman. She might want to sue him for child support, but would any mother really want her child around someone who lacks any concern for that child? NOT ME.:eek:
 
However, what really sparked me to seek advice was the fact that I went to the catechists’ pre-school year meeting this week and saw him there and his nametag indicated that he would be teaching the 11th and 12th graders.
As another poster indicated, a single 23 year old guy teaching teens is a bad idea. Romantic entanglements are not just possible, they are predictable. If he already has a child out of wedlock from a younger girlfriend, I think it work mentioning.

However, must of the information you have is second hand. In light of the relationship of your friend to the young man, I would think you know that hearsay would irrelevant. There is room for distortion both in the passing, and in any filtered resentment by any party along the line. If I were listening to such a story, I would have to disregard such reports, though they might form a basis for my own inquiries, like talking to the young man directly.
 
If you can’t, why don’t you do the one thing you didn’t suggest, and talk to the young man privately first, to see what his actual reasons are? It would not be inappropriate for a Goddmother to talk to the biological father, but it would be weird for you head straight to an institutional authority without all the facts.
I agree with this post. Maybe you should start with the father and then go from there if you’re not satisfied with his response.:twocents:
 
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