Parents versus wife/me

[TerrierGuy]

I’ve been married 5 years and my wife and parents have had a strained relationship since the engagement. Long history. Things came to a head last summer when my parents and us disagreed over some parenting choices - my mom interpreted stuff my wife said in a text as an attack, we had a phone convo, the 4 of us, to try and patch it up, they got snippy, she got snippy back, i froze, they escalated - at wife’s suggestion and counselor’s endorsement, i took some time off from communicating w them to clear head, work on rel w wife. That wound up being about 5 months.

My mother reached out to me w apology for some of it, I wrote back and thanked her, said these are the boundaries I need you and dad to respect (dad was copied on email) and i think you owe my wife an apology. My mom responded - acknowledged some boundaries, half-heartedly agreed to others (i told her she needs to stop involving my sisters in our disputes, she said there are times when it effects them), she talked about how she had been hurt, agreed to apologize to wife. mom texted wife an apology which consisted of “i’m sorry if you were offended”, also said she hoped going forward, they could have a “mutually respectful relationship”. Dad said nothing. On Christmas, mom and dad each texted wife “merry christmas”. Wife said they were sweeping it under the carpet and she was either not answering or would answer in a way that addressed everything. In candor, I was tired and upset (the last 5 months have been emotionally draining), and I told her, meekly, that i thought just answering back “merry christmas” was best - that wasnt an option, so i said out of the 2, i thought answering was preferable to not answering. She sent a text to both saying that she has forgiven them for everything they have said and done and wishes them a happy holidays. My father responded by saying he has also forgiven her for everything and going forward, when he has a problem w her, he will let her know, “you can bet your bottom dollar.”

At the time, I was insensitive and told her that she nudged him and he nudged back. I know the fault lies with me because she asked me beforehand. I should have spoken more about how I felt it might lead to this and I regret that I didn’t.

She is furious and hurt - wants this addressed, wants to make sure dad understands and agrees to the boundaries, wants to make sure mom agrees fully to all the boundaries.

I feel exhausted and unable to continue. I hate this. I got a half-hearted apology, fine - some people are too prideful to say it all or not to offer excuses. My position was to move forward and, regardless of my mother’s equivocation and my father’s non-answer, make sure the boundaries are respected, and call them out on it if they are crossed.

I want peace, I want reconciliation - my wife has said I act like a door mat.

Any guidance you all could offer, I would appreciate it so much.

 

[EasterJoy]

I suggest a New rule: We text unimportant things and take-it-100%-at-face-value-messages: Happy Birthday, Merry Christmas, Have you left the house yet? Do you have time to get eggs on the way home? What is your flight number and when does your plane land? No, I do not need to be picked up at the airport, thank you.

We do not text apologies, complaints, the setting of boundaries, or other emotionally-charged messages. Let it be known with your parents that emotionally-laden texts that cover material that will only be heard when delivered in a more personal way will get this stock reply: This is not text-suitable material. That is how you are going to let them know you aren’t hearing that message when it is delivered in that way.

Your boundary? Your boundary is that you follow Terry’s Rule of Texts. You tell your wife and family: that’s how I’m going to conduct my text life, because it is emotionally practical. I am going to have no part in any future texted dramas. If the rest of you do otherwise, you are all on your own. I am not going to bat for you, and I am not listening to any venting about what happened in one of your text dramas. I am done.

As for your personal boundaries, they aren’t negotiable. You tell people what your boundaries are, so your boundaries aren’t invisible to people who respect you enough to abide by them when they’re pointed out. You refuse to let those lines be crossed by knowing what you’re going to do when someone crosses them. When that happens, you calmly do that, even if having to do that saddens or disappoints you. You also know what you’re going to do as a follow-up when that doesn’t stop the boundary violations.

Yes, you get to decide unilaterally when you are going to allow your sisters to be dragged into discussions between you and your mother. You decide what behavior you are going to allow from whom. Frankly, your wife calling you a doormat because you don’t insist on a verbal apology that suits her specification is behavior you might well decide not to allow. Name-calling is counterproductive, hurtful and disrespectful. I’d advocate that you not give her what she wants from you when she engages in name-calling and putting you down. You have to have boundaries with her, too.

 

[MrsAngelala]

Goodness, I wish I could help you with this. My husband and I had a very, very similar problem for the first many years of our marriage. It was devastating (though in our case it was his very troubled sister and then his mother jumping in). Your responses and positions as you describe them are exactly like my husband’s. And I also felt he was behaving like a doormat.

Our problem was slightly before the days of text, but we had identical issues with email. When we decided to cut off email communication, it was a big help. I wish we had done it sooner. I’d go so far as to say that there should be absolutely no text or email between your family and your wife. Any and all communication other than the in-person kind should be carried out by you. Only you. And don’t pass messages or play middle-man. (Turns out my husband was an inaccurate middle-man, and that caused some major problems…)

I don’t know how often you see your parents, but the next few times – whether that happens within a year or a few years – stick to your wife LIKE GLUE when you’re around them. I’m not kidding. Before you go, reach an agreement with her that she will be on her absolutely best behavior. When you get there, do NOT leave her side. If she goes to the bathroom, wait outside the door for her. And make sure to speak up when you see her being snitted at, or if you miss it and she shoots you a look that tells you so. The first time she sees you stand up for her, it will make an enormous difference.

As the husband, drawing boundaries which include your wife on your “side” – and sticking to them – is a very good idea. It took my husband a long time to do this, which meant it took me a long time to feel safe within those boundaries… but in the end it was very helpful. Over time he defended me more solidly and even vehemently, which also helped. At one point he even drove 2.5 hours each way to see his parents face-to-face and call his mother (respectfully but very firmly) to task for her behavior. I can’t even tell you how much that meant to me.

Unfortunately, the only thing that solved this problem is that in the end, I – the one who was being so blatantly abused that even my abusers acknowledged it in writing – had to simply let go of absolutely all of it. It took me a few years, and that was after I put my foot down and gave myself a couple of years of safe space by refusing to go anywhere the sister would be. Recovery from this may take a very long time.

The only good thing I am aware of taking away from this problem is the deep experience of my husband and myself as our primary family. He had to rise up and take a very firm stand on my side. It cost him a great deal. I love him more deeply because of that.

This is an excruciating position to be in, and I’ve prayed for you. I hope you and your wife are able to find peace with each other, and eventually with your family. Might I suggest bringing this to Jesus in adoration? It may prove helpful. I guarantee nobody wants to see healing more than He does.

 

[EasterJoy]

Goodness, I wish I could help you with this. My husband and I had a very, very similar problem for the first many years of our marriage. It was devastating (though in our case it was his very troubled sister and then his mother jumping in). Your responses and positions as you describe them are exactly like my husband’s. And I also felt he was behaving like a doormat.

Our problem was slightly before the days of text, but we had identical issues with email. When we decided to cut off email communication, it was a big help. I wish we had done it sooner. I’d go so far as to say that there should be absolutely no text or email between your family and your wife. Any and all communication other than the in-person kind should be carried out by you. Only you. And don’t pass messages or play middle-man. (Turns out my husband was an inaccurate middle-man, and that caused some major problems…)

I don’t know how often you see your parents, but the next few times – whether that happens within a year or a few years – stick to your wife LIKE GLUE when you’re around them. I’m not kidding. Before you go, reach an agreement with her that she will be on her absolutely best behavior. When you get there, do NOT leave her side. If she goes to the bathroom, wait outside the door for her. And make sure to speak up when you see her being snitted at, or if you miss it and she shoots you a look that tells you so. The first time she sees you stand up for her, it will make an enormous difference.

As the husband, drawing boundaries which include your wife on your “side” – and sticking to them – is a very good idea. It took my husband a long time to do this, which meant it took me a long time to feel safe within those boundaries… but in the end it was very helpful. Over time he defended me more solidly and even vehemently, which also helped. At one point he even drove 2.5 hours each way to see his parents face-to-face and call his mother (respectfully but very firmly) to task for her behavior. I can’t even tell you how much that meant to me.

Unfortunately, the only thing that solved this problem is that in the end, I – the one who was being so blatantly abused that even my abusers acknowledged it in writing – had to simply let go of absolutely all of it. It took me a few years, and that was after I put my foot down and gave myself a couple of years of safe space by refusing to go anywhere the sister would be. Recovery from this may take a very long time.

The only good thing I am aware of taking away from this problem is the deep experience of my husband and myself as our primary family. He had to rise up and take a very firm stand on my side. It cost him a great deal. I love him more deeply because of that.

This is an excruciating position to be in, and I’ve prayed for you. I hope you and your wife are able to find peace with each other, and eventually with your family. Might I suggest bringing this to Jesus in adoration? It may prove helpful. I guarantee nobody wants to see healing more than He does.

There is a period of grieving between realizing your in-laws don’t treat you in the way you deserve and accepting that amended behavior with no apology is the best you’re going to get. You can’t stand around and just tolerate being abused (unless you have room to write it off because the person is demented), but sometimes you have to decide you’re going to live without an apology because the offensive behavior has stopped.

 

[Allegra]

Stop texting. It isn’t working because your wife is so hurt that she reading tones that aren’t there. Aside from that, can you seek reconciliation without your wife? Maybe she’s not ready yet?

 

[pianistclare]

Ah…the old “I’m sorry you’re a jerk” apology.

How passive aggressive.

I agree with no texting of important matters.
These things are for face to face conversations. Anything else is juvenile FB stuff
That’s what kids do, not adults
Just my 2 cents.

Offer an agreement that everyone to to be cordial and supportive in the new year.
EVERYBODY.
If they can’t muster that for the sake of family, then expect it to get far worse.

 

[mommy_k]

Yes to talking —not texting or email… Also u should be the one trying to smooth things over with your parents, not your wife.

 

[EasterJoy]

Yes to talking —not texting or email… Also u should be the one trying to smooth things over with your parents, not your wife.

Meaning, he should talk to his parents, not expect his wife to do it.

The problem is that if she wants an apology, they have to talk to her unless she is willing to accept the apology that the husband deemed acceptable.

I agree that adult children should, as a rule, deal with their own parents. That requires, however, that the spouse who does the negotiation has the authority to negotiate. If the adult child is a powerless go-between stuck pleasing everyone else, then yes, he’s going to wind up a doormat. The only question left is whose doormat he’s going to be. While he ought to come to an agreement with his wife about how he is going to handle it, he does have to have to be given some authority in the matter.

Just for the record: Insisting on a pro forma apology is usually a fruitless quest. Either the person understands that they’ve wronged you and can bring themselves to honestly apologize, or they don’t. Most of the time, family members don’t. Nobody is ever forced into a truly satisfactory apology, because of course, if they have to be forced, it always seems false. Usually, they dish up just as much apology as they want to give, then they dig in, help themselves to a little pointed coldness, and the matter just fades into the past until somebody breaks down and decides to act as if it never happened. It’s a terrible way to handle an offense, but most of the time it is what happens.

 

[mommy_k]

[BIBLEDRB][/BIBLEDRB]

Meaning, he should talk to his parents, not expect his wife to do it.

The problem is that if she wants an apology, they have to talk to her unless she is willing to accept the apology that the husband deemed acceptable.

I agree that adult children should, as a rule, deal with their own parents. That requires, however, that the spouse who does the negotiation has the authority to negotiate. If the adult child is a powerless go-between stuck pleasing everyone else, then yes, he’s going to wind up a doormat. The only question left is whose doormat he’s going to be. While he ought to come to an agreement with his wife about how he is going to handle it, he does have to have to be given some authority in the matter.

Just for the record: Insisting on a pro forma apology is usually a fruitless quest. .

Yes.

Other then the obvious though, another reason the op should be the one speaking to them is the text his wife sent. She too is still holding onto some issues.

Even though she said she forgave them for all they did, she did not say that she may have even played a small part in this discord. You don’t offer forgiveness unless someone says thier sorry. You forgive silently at times…that is arrogant, to say i forgive u when the other party does not want or ask for it or bring it up. Kwim?

That prompted the response from the op’s dad, because in this text she placed the entire blame on them. The inlaws or anyone can percieve this expression of forgiveness as assigning guilt for the entire mess.
Not the way to gain peace, imho.

At times, brushing things under the rug until everyone can be sincere is a good thing too. Seems emotions are still raw, and best to keep things in check until a better time to discuss it in person, with the op as the main speaker.

I don’t see the op as a doormat in this, i see him as a peacemaker and he may be able to crack this pattern. Of course he should consult with his wife and address this as a united front, with mutual sincere, apologies for both sides.

But not when the spirit of anger is still present… It can’t happen.

 

[on_the_hill]

I’m in a similar situation with my wife and a feud she has with my brother. He thinks she’s acting irrationally, she thinks he’s hateful.

 

[holyrood]

Ah…the old “I’m sorry you’re a jerk” apology.

How passive aggressive.
.

Agreed.

Unless your wife is Cruella DeVille–have her back. Stand up for her. Protect her. Defend her.

 

[StGerardMajella]

We do not text apologies, complaints, the setting of boundaries, or other emotionally-charged messages.

This is great advice. Follow it.

Emails and texts are perhaps the absolute worst inventions on the planet. The telephone can be just as bad. Miscommunication in these formats is all too common.

For these kinds of situations, an in-person meeting would be best, preferably you meeting with your parents first to help clear the air.

 

[egretps]

I would also suggest reading Dr. Henry Cloud’s Boundaries, and the series of his Boundries books.

I think this can resolve.

I have had a failing with being ‘overly’ sensitive. My husband’s family have their own issues. Lots’of prayer on my part, not ever needing an apology, I just wanted to get along.

SIL has apologized for some nasty public comments meant to embarrass me at a formal dinner party when I was dating my now husband. Years later. Like 20 years later. So tell your wife not to hold her breath. If and when that apology comes, she’ll probably have a great laugh! My husband defended me quietly but firmly during a very insulting session when we were married in the early years.

I love my MIL for raising the man who is my husband.
The above SIL and I are getting along wonderfully today.

I haven’t developed thicker skin, but I’ve increased my prayer life.

I also had numerous masses said for my inlaws. Sometimes I’d send the mass card. I can’t tell you how this warmed my MIL to me. I wasn’t expecting this, but she really appreciated it.

I often have masses said for people I love, and for people who really get my goat. In this case it was a double whammy. Having a mass said for someone who has hurt you is just a beautiful thing.

God Bless you and you and your family are in my prayers. Especially your dear wife.

 

[CatholicSheila]

So this has been going on 5 years and only your parents owe an apology? In that time your wife hasn’t behaved badly at all? There is absolutely no reason why your parents might also be feeling hurt?

I understand men feel the need to protect their wives but be realistic. No man has ever married a perfect women and when their are issues within families usually both sides bear some fault. Your wife probably owes your parents an apology too and you’re likely to get further with peace making between the family if both sides admit they bear some fault.

 

[Anglewannabe]

Things came to a head last summer when my parents and us disagreed over some parenting choices

STOP this is the problem right here. Your parents can silently disagree with your choices but they have NO say in the matter and since they are your parents it is up to you to tell them to butt out

My mom responded - acknowledged some boundaries, half-heartedly agreed to others

Does matter what she said. Actions speak louder than words and unless she behaves in a manner that respects boundaries, don’t believe a thing she says

. mom texted wife an apology which consisted of “i’m sorry if you were offended”,

Very passive agressive. Did more harm than good

On Christmas, mom and dad each texted wife “merry christmas”. Wife said they were sweeping it under the carpet and she was either not answering or would answer in a way that addressed everything,

Your wife set a boundary you should have respected it.

In candor, I was tired and upset (the last 5 months have been emotionally draining), and I told her, meekly, that i thought just answering back “merry christmas” was best - that wasnt an option, so i said out of the 2, i thought answering was preferable to not answering. She sent a text to both saying that she has forgiven them for everything they have said and done and wishes them a happy holidays. My father responded by saying he has also forgiven her for everything and going forward, when he has a problem w her, he will let her know, “you can bet your bottom dollar.”
TerrierGuy;14367723:

Forcing your wife to like someone she can’t stand will NOT work. She will hate them more. Also, that is doing a very good job at making her feel alone in her marriage. Her own husband sees nothing wrong with people treating her badly ! Ouch talk about hurting your wife’s feelings
TerrierGuy;14367723:

She is furious and hurt - wants this addressed, wants to make sure dad understands and agrees to the boundaries, wants to make sure mom agrees fully to all the boundaries.

I feel exhausted and unable to continue. I hate this. I got a half-hearted apology, fine - some people are too prideful to say it all or not to offer excuses. My position was to move forward and, regardless of my mother’s equivocation and my father’s non-answer, make sure the boundaries are respected, and call them out on it if they are crossed.
TerrierGuy;14367723:

If your wife is anything like me, she sees it as YOUR responsibility to make sure your parents respect her. And let’s face it, you can not control their behaviour. If your wife is going to be nice enough to take your feelings seriously and be in the same room as your parents it is up to your to make sure they respect her. That means speaking up when your wife says so even if you don’t see her point. Because after all, if it weren’t for you, she would not go near your parents. Are you sure you want to take that on? Can you really trust your parents will respect her? Be honest, I can’t help but think it would be easier to just live with the fact your wife won’t go near you parents.
TerrierGuy;14367723:

I want peace, I want reconciliation - my wife has said I act like a door mat.

Any guidance you all could offer, I would appreciate it so much.

Start by making peace with your wife. As much as it is not nice for her to call you a doormat, you are the man, you are the one who is suppose to protect her and instead you want to throw he in the cage with the lions. From a woman’s perspective, that is hurtful to not be able to trust one’s husband

 

[Lorelei12]

It sounds like you had a reasonable counselor before- maybe time to make another appointment?

I think responding “Merry Christmas” and not getting into it, as you suggested, would have been the best course of action. You can deal with boundary-crossing when it happens. Your wife did nudge your dad.

It doesn’t sound like either your wife or your parents offered sincere apologies. Even if your parents were pretty horrible, being snippy in response (while understandable) is also something to be apologized for. And your mother’s “apology” was ridiculous.

I think maybe the place to start is talking it through with your counselor who can help you both to figure out how to move forward, and maybe help your wife to understand that she is probably not ever going to get the apology she wants. Also, make it clear to your wife that in the future, you will not allow boundaries to be crossed and instead of “freezing” like you did initially, you will take charge of the situation and explain to them that your parenting decisions are not up for discussion, and end the conversation.

 

[holyrood]

My husband defended me quietly but firmly

THIS is key. A husband must defend his wife.

 

[StGerardMajella]

Start by making peace with your wife. As much as it is not nice for her to call you a doormat, you are the man, you are the one who is suppose to protect her and instead you want to throw he in the cage with the lions.

This is excellent advice. Your parents should not be interfering with family decisions made between you and your spouse.

You are both adults now, and should seek counsel when appropriate. But unsolicited advice and interference from even well-meaning parents can cross boundaries.

There is a great little book called, “Boundaries: When to say Yes, When to say No”, by authors Henry Cloud and John Townsend. It’s a bestseller on Amazon. It might be a good place to start.