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tafan2
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That is the reason there are still deaneries and pastors assigned as deans, to corrdinate things such as mass times and confession times. But, as a general rule, they do not do that.
Parish Dos and Don'ts from Millennials
- Thread starter blackforest
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tafan2
Guest
I didn’t read that into it at all. It comes across as assertive and assured. Which it should, as the items on the list are proven to work.
And doing the don’ts, which was the norm from aroudnm 1975 until 2000 (being a little generous there) have been proven to fail.
ETA: the parish I mentioned with the 630 am mass and confessions three confession times per week, with adoration during the day, everyday: they are about to have their 4th vocation ordained to the priesthood since the current pastor has been there. Those items on that list, they work.
And doing the don’ts, which was the norm from aroudnm 1975 until 2000 (being a little generous there) have been proven to fail.
ETA: the parish I mentioned with the 630 am mass and confessions three confession times per week, with adoration during the day, everyday: they are about to have their 4th vocation ordained to the priesthood since the current pastor has been there. Those items on that list, they work.
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phil19034
Guest
Yeah, our Cathedral has a 12:05 mass daily mass during lunch. It always has easily over 100 people each day.
And a Capuchin ran parish near my office has a 5:15 PM daily mass that easily has 50 people each day (the Capuchins have 5 daily masses each day: 7:45 AM, 8:30 AM, 12:05 PM, 1:05 PM, & 5:15.
That same Capuchin ran parish also has 10 Masses for Holy Days of Obligation. 1 Vigil at 5:15 PM and then 9 Masses on the Holy Day:
- 7am in upper church
- 7:45 in lower church
- 8:30 in lower church
- 11:30 AM in upper church
- 12:05 PM in lower church
- 12:30 PM in upper church
- 1:05 PM in lower church
- 5:15 PM in lower church
- 6 PM in upper church
Our Cathedral also has confession 7 days a week (at lunch time during the week) and the Capuchins have Confession Wed - Friday afternoons from 3:30 to 5PM and get a lot of people who can’t make it earlier to the Cathedral.
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Shasta-Rose
Guest
It’s hardly inclusive of older people.
<<Second: Don’t make service opportunities the fiefdoms of previous generations.>>
<<“My generation hates when churches cater to the elderly and retired only,” >>
Previous generations? Excuse me, I’m still here. I’m not “previous,” though there might be those who wish I was.
Cater to the elderly? Are you referring to those people who spent decades supporting this church you now want to attend, bringing along your list of demands?
A while back, I was attending a small event of this social group I belong to. Most of us were older. A younger guy came and said he noticed there were not a lot of younger adults in our group. Well, if we wanted younger adults to attend our events, we would have to do…(this)…and (that)…and so on…concede to our demands or you’ll just go on being an old people’s group. I thought, After listening to this, that actually sounds pretty good to me.
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DeniseNY
Guest
It was stuff like this that makes me think the approach was arrogant and disrespectful
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tafan2
Guest
What particular item on the list is not inclusive of older people? We older folks might want to go back to guitar masses with folk music and singing kumbya, but we can put on a John Denver CD and get our folk music fix, we don’t need to continue things like they wer in the 70s.
Yes, that would be us, and we should be so happy to have their list of demands. What we did, did not work. But, we did at least support the parish for decades so that it still exists and can start catering to these demands. Lets take some comfort in that.
Tis_Bearself
Patron
They are at this one. The priest wasn’t even around for part of one year (long story).
Most of what happens at this Newman Center is student-driven. It is literally 5 minutes from my house so I’m over there a lot for Mass and I see and hear a lot of what goes on.
The kids are traditional in other ways. They are reverent. They like to kneel (On the floor as the big worship space just has chairs and no kneelers). They made a big push for Adoration and did quite a bit of it during Lent (Including sessions with contemporary music).
I would note that in addition to this Newman Center, there is a diocesan youth Adoration for people in late teens and 20s that happens up the street at the “traditional music” church , where I usually go to weekly Adoration whether it’s youth Adoration night or just regular, and the twentysomethings tend to have a mixture of choral (chant, polyphony etc) and contemporary music there at the Youth adoration night. It seems like there is a big mixture of tastes and it’s not like 100 percent of the young people or even 50 percent of them want to always hear old organ hymns and Gregorian chant. I would presume the ones who love the chant are at the TLM parish.
I think you would have to take a poll of every person under 30 to get a true read on this…and I am pretty sure just from what I’ve seen, heard and experienced that you would get a range of answers. Some of them would probably like a little of everything - like I do.
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phil19034
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“Catering to the elderly” means all or most Parish events only take place during working hours.
For example: when I joined by parish (which is in the suburbs), the best adult faith formation program the Parish was running took place as a lunch & learn on Thursdays. So the only people who could attend were retirees, ppl who worked nights, and ppl who worked very close to the parish.
I think a big part of the problem is that Parishes too often try to be have events that they want to be inclusive of all age groups and types of families.
However, when doing this, they often only run the programs when it is convenient for the volunteers or staff. Not necessarily when it would be best for the parish.
For example: perhaps it would be best to run an education program at two different times (mid morning for retirees and 7pm for others) . Or perhaps it would be best to schedule a program at the same time kids have CCD so parents with school age kids don’t need a babysitter?
Also, there is NO reason why a parish can’t have separate groups for retirees, for empty nesters, for parents with young kids, for singles, for widowers, divorcees, young adults, etc
But when you have a group that is supposed to be & advertised as being open for everyone- then be open to criticism from under represented groups
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tafan2
Guest
Definitely bring it up to your pastor, but he might very well be interested, until he takes a poll of people who currently attend daily mass. I know of pastors who did this, and the predicted result was “everyone likes it at 8:30”. Instead it takes a pastor who is willing to explain to the elderly why it is so important to have it at a different time. But most of the time, it takes adding another daily mass to the existing schedule, and that typically requires two priests to be assigned to the parish.
My hometown is a farming community, small parish. They never changed their morning mass from being very early (its moved around a little through the years, but it is currently at 7:00 am). Guess what, you see people of all ages at that mass.
My hometown is a farming community, small parish. They never changed their morning mass from being very early (its moved around a little through the years, but it is currently at 7:00 am). Guess what, you see people of all ages at that mass.
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DeniseNY
Guest
Not sure why this was directed at me. As I stated earlier, I think the suggestions make sense but it was the delivery that stunk.
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phil19034
Guest
Yeah, this is true.
What I tend to see is that they like traditional music at mass and praises & worship music (the more contemporary) at adoration and other kinds of holy hours.
And traditional music doesn’t have to be chant, or Latin.
Traditional music includes Salve Regina and other traditional & easy hymns in English
Top Ten Catholic Hymns
Online Edition – September 2005 Vol. XI, No. 6 A Choir Director Selects — The Top Ten Catholic Hymns by Lucy E. Carroll The question was raised in a recent AB Readers’ Forum (June 2005) — what are the “top ten” Catholic hymns? This is perilous ground. Selections of music for the Sacred Liturgy...
adoremus.org
But it’s also true that many millennials and Gen Z who are musicians are being taught only the contemporary music at the Catholic Schools they attend.
Also, it sometimes has to do with the volunteers. If the volunteers only know how to play the piano, guitar and/or drums - it limits you regarding the type of music you can play (assuming you want to utilize you volunteers 100% - which many do)
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Joe_5859
Guest
This seems like the same list I’ve seen requested for the past 20 years. 
I agree with most of it, but generally most parishes I have been around do schedule daily Mass outside of normal working hours. And that can vary from place to place. In a downtown urban area, that probably means having Mass at lunch time. In an area where most people live no more than 10 minutes from work, Mass at 8:00 might very well be before work for most 9-to-5ers. It all depends on the community. And, certainly, any parish should be sensitive to that.
I agree with most of it, but generally most parishes I have been around do schedule daily Mass outside of normal working hours. And that can vary from place to place. In a downtown urban area, that probably means having Mass at lunch time. In an area where most people live no more than 10 minutes from work, Mass at 8:00 might very well be before work for most 9-to-5ers. It all depends on the community. And, certainly, any parish should be sensitive to that.
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DeniseNY
Guest
What did I say that gave you any indication that I disagreed with the suggestions?
Tis_Bearself
Patron
I would imagine when there are volunteers stepping up to the plate, they get a lot of (name removed by moderator)ut into what they want to play or sing both at Mass and outside of Mass. If the idea is to engage the young people, then they are not going to be engaged being forced to play or sing something they don’t like, or they may compromise and say they will do the type of music Jason likes for one song and then do the type of music that Emma likes for the second song, etc.
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EnglishTeacher
Guest
I agree the tone here is disrespectful, especially when one considers how much the older generations have done and are still doing to keep the parish afloat by faithfully donating both their money and their time. I always wonder what the Catholic Church is going to do in 15-20 years when a good number of the older generation have either passed on or are no longer physically able to volunteer. Presently we aren’t seeing the numbers we would need from the younger generations for the most part, both in terms of financial giving and volunteering (as well as Mass attendance) to keep the current number of parishes afloat.
There is something to be said, though, for re-thinking and updating how we as parishes do many things, so as to continue to spread the gospel and serve the community and attract younger people as well as keep our older faithful members. Having evening weekday Mass and confession times convenient for working people, keeping an up-to-date online presence including social media and a mobile-friendly website, and creating communities where people can get to know each other and build friendships are important if we want to keep our parishes open.
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PHXsunsAZ
Guest
I don’t see what any of these things have to do with millennials. The 9-5 working class, yes.
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Shasta-Rose
Guest
Very well put. Course, I’d expect nothing less from someone named EnglishTeacher!’’
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EnglishTeacher
Guest
Ha, thank you. I always think I should not have made that my handle because if I make mistakes or typos, people will be more likely to notice.
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tafan2
Guest
Actually, I would fully expect that if a poll was taken at large, not more than a handful would say that they would attend if the mass was at 7. That’s why it takes a pastor with a little bit of foresight to understand. If a mass is moved from 8:00 am to 7:00am, initially attendance will drop, as a few of those old people will start attending at the neighboring parish which is still not interested in working class folks. Then overtime, attendance starts growing. That timeframe, IMO, is not that long, but it likely will be a year or so before attendance has exceeded the old 8:00 am time. It takes a while for word to spread to those working class people that there is another parish with an early mass (two priests were hearing confessions).
Now, this same patiences is NOT required for added confession times to take effect. That is almost immediately. Two years ago when anbother parish went to two week nights, for the first month or so, the lines were pretty short on those week nights. But it only took a couple of months and they are back to pretty long. Get there 20 minutes ahead of time and you won’t have to wait long. The other day I arrived at the scheduled start and had to wait in line almost 40 minutes.
Now, this same patiences is NOT required for added confession times to take effect. That is almost immediately. Two years ago when anbother parish went to two week nights, for the first month or so, the lines were pretty short on those week nights. But it only took a couple of months and they are back to pretty long. Get there 20 minutes ahead of time and you won’t have to wait long. The other day I arrived at the scheduled start and had to wait in line almost 40 minutes.
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tafan2
Guest
Guess what, millennials are working class folk. Also, use older working class people just didn’t care when we were that age. There are not an insignifant number of millennials and genXrs who do care.
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